Author Topic: Craynerd new workshop project log  (Read 13768 times)

Offline raynerd

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Craynerd new workshop project log
« on: September 07, 2014, 03:38:36 AM »
I've now been in my house a week and a day and I've unboxed enough to start thinking about my new workshop. I've got countless questions and as always, I appreciate anyone's opinion and ideas. Rather than posting individual questions on the forum, I'll stick them all in here a bit like a project log.

The first issue is that the 18' x 8' garage is concrete in print. There is a leak in the roof which I need to seal but there is also damp coming through in one corner! I'm struggling to see exactly where it's from other than simply the join not tight enough in the corner. What's the best way of sealing it?? There is no clear gap to fill!

On a similar thought, the concrete panels that lie on the ground have holes in them for bolting together. The ones on the bottom that sit on the floor have nothing in them and I'm pretty sure that earth/soil is being pushed up through very slowly over time. Would I be best just using something to poke out the soil and cementing these up?

Door
I have both a main up and over door and a normal door next to each other. I know a lot of garage workshop owners bolt up the up and over door for security. I'm thinking of doing this also and it will also give me more room putting things up against that end of the workshop.
The wooden door is rotten and worn at the bottom. I'd like to buy a new door and my grandfather said to stick in a cheap uPVC door but that would require a frame fitting with a bottom cross piece and I want to keep the bottom free from any frame or cross piece so that things can be walked, wheeled and brought in easily without tripping. This does have the disadvantage that a little damp is coming in from below the current door as water simply comes under it with no barrier in the way. What would you do? What door would you fit? The current door needs changing as one of the first jobs.


Lights[\b]
There are currently 2x.  5' tubes in the centre. I have 3x 6' tubes in storage from my old shop. Would all those tubes be overkill - there is also a window.

I think getting these basics would be good this week before moving anything in. I'll post some pics later.
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Offline Pete.

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2014, 05:18:31 AM »
Pre-cast panels on the floor is not unusual, but it's normal for there to be an air gap below them. If you have no air gap you're going to need a moisture barrier of some kind else the floor will be forever damp even if you grout the gaps with cement.

Need a photo of the floor, and the damp section.

What door is an easy choice for me - an old fire door. Impossible to break through, hugely long-lasting and of course very fire resistant. You can usually get one at any local demolition site, I have some lovely hardwood ones on site right now but it's too far away for you.

Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2014, 06:31:09 AM »
Thanks for the reply Pete. I've attached a picture of the damp inside, picture of the printed concrete on the outside and one of the door. Looks like there is a slope on the concrete going into the door!!
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2014, 07:07:49 AM »
Chris,

I'm afraid that those issues are rather typical of the various pre-cast concrete garages I've been involved with. My foundry at the last house had two extensions on it that I made from sections of dismantled pre-cast concrete garage assembled into a different configuration. Obviously there are tolerances in the making of the slabs, and both mine when I dismantled them has 'gaskets' of gooey stuff that had obviously been squirted on when they were originally assembled between the slabs and on the floor. Where they sit on the concrete base, unless it slopes away you will always get rain driven under them. Can be reduced by a generous fillet of cement at 45 degrees in the base / wall junction on the outside. Most certainly you must ensure that there is no build up of earth or leaves against the base of the walls.

Don't expect it ever to be truly dry.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Pete.

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2014, 08:37:37 AM »
I does look like the concrete put outside has a fall towards the wall - that'll be the source of most of your damp. Probably have a prevailing wind against that wall too I guess. Hard to say what the cure is - you could cut a section out of the path alongside the wall, dig it out 6" deep and fill with stones, or build a small canopy along that wall so the rain water falls outside the pathway. Personally I'd smash out that path and lay a new one with a healthy fall away from the building, and I'd lay a DPM inside the shop, bring it up the walls a bit and screed over it to keep the floor dry (and flat). a ton bag of sharp sand, few bags of cement and a borrowed mixer would sort that easy.

Offline spuddevans

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2014, 10:09:26 AM »
Lights[\b]
There are currently 2x.  5' tubes in the centre. I have 3x 6' tubes in storage from my old shop. Would all those tubes be overkill - there is also a window.

I would say that you can never have too many lights. My workshop is 16ft x 10ft and I have 2 rows of flourescents, one row is 2 5ft single tubes and 1 6ft, and then above my lathe and mill I have the other row, 2 double 4ft tubes and 1 single 5ft tube

I recently got my grubby little hands on a couple of  flourescent fittings (like office lights for suspended ceiling) they are 2ft square and take 4 2ft tubes, I'm gonna put a perspex shield on them and bung one above the lathe and another above the mill.

The more light the better (just remember to slap on the factor 30 suncream before going in the workshop!!


Tim
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Offline dsquire

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2014, 01:41:20 PM »
Chris

Moving is for the birds and I am glad to see that you have that behind you. I hope that you are able to find your photo resizer soon as I refuse to play the up, down, left, right, do it all over again game to try and figure out what I am supose to be looking at.  :D :D

Cheers  :beer:

Don

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Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2014, 03:24:00 PM »
Cheers chaps,

Pete - can you tell me more about physically how I would "lay a DPM inside the shop"?

Tim - that was my intention and I`m pleased you have confirmed it.

Andrew - the fillet of concrete certainly seems a good idea.

I was talking to my father in law and he thought about completely blocking up and bricking in, or ideally matching in with concrete sections, the door and then bricking up the main garage door and putting the walk in door in that wall. It would remove the garage door for security reasons and also shift the door away from that wet concreted side. In all honest, what I intend to do with the garden will require me to bash up that concrete path anyway but I still like this idea.

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Offline Jonny

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2014, 04:42:38 PM »
For the reasons said already I would weigh up the costs involved in laying DPM barrier and concreting over along with door, lining the walls and roof plus other rework to make habitable. Noticed some prefab garages the other week starting at 2k but how much for a proper brick.

Luckily your door and frame is easy to do unlike the pvc which have a step and open inwards, the main reason I have not been able to change. Fire doors good and will be able to shovel the swarf out without lodging in the pvc seal.

If theres damp you will always feel cold and uncomfortable, think it through for the long term.

Offline Pete.

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2014, 06:54:56 PM »
A DPM is a damp-proof membrane. Nothing more than a sheet of heavy polythene (500-1000gsm you need) laid on the floor and curled up the walls then concrete or screed on top. It forms a barrier for damp so it's important to hoover the floor or give it a really good sweep so it doesn't get cut on anything sharp whilst you walk abou ton it laying screed.

Offline Arbalist

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2014, 11:02:57 PM »
I've had a couple of concrete garages as workshops and also a brick built, they all let the damp in sadly. One thing I did to improve lighting levels on one of them was to paint the walls with white emulsion, makes a huge difference. I've just recently had a concrete garage knocked down and replaced with a wooden cabin on a new concrete base.

Offline Kjelle

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2014, 05:47:38 AM »
Chris, When looking at those pic's, I guess it is not properly drained under the concrete (after looking at British home improvement programs on telly, I gather it's pretty normal...). As you are to smash the concrete outside, dig down and drain all around the building. Also, a dehumidifier will help with the inside climate... Good overall lightning and point lights at the machines makes for a good working environment. Remember that a concrete building do pass humidity through the wall (not so much) and floor (depending on drainage below).

The fire door idea seems like a good idea, get one or two extra locks (one high, one low on the door), and pin the hinges and door hinge side (pins in the door, holes in the frame), and the scumbags will need a motor driven cutter to get in. If you brick up the garage door, make sure the entrance is big enough to move machines in and out without resorting to major deconstruction of either said machine or building!

Good luck!

Kjelle

Offline Eugene

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2014, 09:40:13 AM »
Chris,

The big enemy you have is damp, all the rest is pretty small beer, but damp is a real killer in a workshop as I found out last winter (it has been known to rain in Wales!) when I went through a similar exercise. It looks as if most of the trouble is coming under the plinth that the wall panels sit on, plus a bit through the slinging holes and I'd tackle those issues head on.

Without seeing more detailed pics, my vote would be for the DPM and concrete raft on the inside floor; it's fast, easy and relatively cheap. Put a course of blue bricks across the thresholds of both doors, and lay the concrete making sure the PVC is turned up above the new floor level. Then make a ramp for the main door entrance to get heavy stuff in and out; you can leave the side door with a step if you like. On the outside, thoroughly jet wash the path / wall junction, and using a PVA mix plus some PVA painted on the interfaces to ensure adhesion of your cement, lay a fillet.  If you want a flexible finish, don't bother with the fillet, just give it a couple of thick coats of bitumen.

I wouldn't hand mix, that's a tedious pain; half a load of ready mix and you could have the whole job done in a day and a half. Day one, jet wash inside and out, lay the blues, drop the PVC in together with any reinforce. Day two pour the concrete, lay the fillet or bitumen, bodge the ramp. Four hundred quid should cover it easy, and you won't have any b***** digging out or rubble to get rid of, the path can stay put.

Again without seeing the penetration through the gaps / corners, a can of expanding foam works wonders.

Eug

« Last Edit: September 08, 2014, 10:09:23 AM by Eugene »

Offline awemawson

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2014, 10:11:55 AM »
I agree that Eugene's plan is a good one BUT if you lay the blue bricks on day 1 and try and concrete on day 2 be assured that you WILL disturb the bricks.

If you are not accustomed to floating concrete I would strongly advise getting someone to do it for you who is. As you are working to in-situ walls you cannot easily tamp with a board and getting it sufficiently flat and level in no mean task. I have an office in one of our outbuildings, where a previous owner tried floating a floor just as you need to do. End result it is dished, and floor standing cupboard doors and filing cabinet drawers slide open on their own  :bugeye:

It's somewhere on my 'to do' list  :scratch:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Eugene

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2014, 10:24:36 AM »
Chris,

Whereabouts in the country are you?

Eug

Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2014, 03:27:57 PM »
Thanks guys,
Eugene, I'm north manchester. I must admit, when I asked about theDPM, I knew what one was, just not how it would be layed in this situation. I know one was installed when building a dwarf wall on our old porch but that was fitted after a few layers of bricks. So here you are saying to lay it along the floor and then concrete over it, making a new floor. I admit that the rest about blue bricks, rafts and floating concrete is over my head! I'm more than prepared to give anything ago but based on Andrews advice, how much would you expect to pay for this to be done for me?
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Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2014, 03:30:03 PM »
Just one comment  - I have got extra head room but not much! How much would the floor be raised by?
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2014, 03:56:20 PM »
If your current floor is sound and with no cracks a 3 or 4 inch screed would be ok, and would normally be mixed up (or delivered to site) as a semi dry mix for the screeder to lay. Round here (East Sussex) I would expect to pay 150 per day for a skilled man and 100 for his labourer. A full load of mixed screed (6 cu M ) is about 600 but you should need far less,but would have to pay a 'part load' penalty so it's not quite pro-rata.

If it's not a huge garage your screeder may well choose to mix on site from screeding sand and cement which will be more economic but you don't get quite as consistent a mix (ie it varies slightly from one mixer load to the next due to the human factor)

It's less than a days work, but you'll have to pay for a full day probably.

Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #18 on: September 08, 2014, 04:41:06 PM »
So upto 850??????   :doh: :Doh: :palm:
That is well well well more than I can afford!
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #19 on: September 08, 2014, 04:46:14 PM »
Absolutely no point in setting up your workshop unless it is dry. These things don't come cheap. Undoubtedly you can do it yourself for much less but it depends on your skill level  :bugeye: :bugeye:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #20 on: September 08, 2014, 04:48:45 PM »
I do appreciate what you are saying but having just moved house, I don't have 600!

It seems a hell of a cost when it is just that one corner damp when it rains other than physically under the door.
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Offline dsquire

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #21 on: September 08, 2014, 05:13:10 PM »
Absolutely no point in setting up your workshop unless it is dry. These things don't come cheap. Undoubtedly you can do it yourself for much less but it depends on your skill level  :bugeye: :bugeye:

Chris

It all depends on how bad you want a dry workshop. When you were born you didn't know how to do anything but poop and pee. Since then you have come a long way and learned to do many things. Doing a bit of reading, watching a few You-tube video's and asking a few questions you can learn all that you need to know to have yourself a do-it-yourself garage floor party.   :ddb: :ddb: :ddb: :D  :)

This is pretty much the same way you learned to build clocks except you didn't have the party.  :ddb: :ddb: :ddb:

Cheers  :beer:

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Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2014, 05:40:06 PM »
Guys, I might just take some more pictures tomorrow in day light. I might be hoping for the best, but there is only the one corner of the workshop damp and looking it, I'm wondering if the floor has a DPM and actually the water is running in between the adjoining corner concrete slabs and dripping down onto the floor. I am probably being overly optimistic now I know the price of a new floor!!

I've noticed that there is actually a fillet inside the garage running all the way around rather than outside the building. How could I tell if a DPM is installed ?  I've looked online and others seem to have an issue of a fully damp floor around large areas of the build rather than just a localised area as I have. 

I do have the contact details of the local manufacturer - I need a replacement roof panel so may give them a ring tomorrow and see if they can tell me more. Of course they may not have installed it but they are local firm so I expect they have.
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Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2014, 05:42:15 PM »
Don, yes, it's very true. I built a porch, did a fully compliant to building regs loft conversion and many other jobs all from youtube, books and forums! None of them have fallen down yet so I'm sure I could attempt a floor. The issue is, like Andrew said, it's so expensive and critical t get it level that it probably is not worth the risk of attempting it!
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #24 on: September 08, 2014, 06:04:10 PM »
There are nowadays fully liquid screeds that come in a tanker, are pumped in.and self level. Never used them. No idea of price. But they flow level if thick enough so theoretically need less skill to lay. Seem to remember seeing them on a Grand Designs program.
Andrew Mawson
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Offline vtsteam

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #25 on: September 08, 2014, 08:23:16 PM »
If you're absolutely broke, Get a shovel and dig out the outside of that corner to see is there is a crack in the foundation wall. If there is, tar (bitumen?) the whole area of the corner and the crack. Dig a trench by shovel to daylight along the perimeter of the building just below the pad. Lay in some 4" perforated drain pipe pitched to daylight. Stick some 6 mil or thicker poly sheeting along the pad and foundation wall along the trench and tuck under the drain. Cover the drain with washed gravel or stone.

On the inside at the corner. steam clean the wall and pad adjacent, mix up some neat Portland cement with some masonry polyvinyl emulsion so it sticks better ,a handfull of clean sand per bucket, dilute to liquid porridge consistency and paint the entire area with this mix using a wide stiff brush. Let cure overnight and do it again, Repeat for a total of three coats. Neat cement is waterproof, and was formerly used to line swimming pools and the outside of ferrocement boat hulls. I have a cistern made of cinderblock, lined with the same and it's been holding for twelve years now.

No guarantees, but if you have more time than money this might do it -- assuming it is a leak. If it's moisture penetrating poor concrete, the tar and Portland cement should also block that.
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Offline Kjelle

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #26 on: September 09, 2014, 02:09:49 AM »
Chris, this is the best advice you'll get, ever!! This is exactly how I would do it, and it's almost to Swedish building code!! I wish I remember where I saw (didn't save the link), but it was a profile of how it should be done...

As Steve wrote, dig up, check and possibly repair (you could have more than a small crack), paint with bitumen, and do that to the whole sole, get some of the perforated tubing and lay on a gravel bed, and fill with gravel. If you want to make it realy right, dig a trench out from the building, and end the tubs there, in a stone bed...

I wish I could help more... What kind of earth is it around the garage? Gravel (unlikely, drains well), sand, mud, normal earth?

Kjelle

Offline smiffy

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #27 on: September 09, 2014, 03:45:28 AM »
Hi, when converting redundant brick built farm buildings to offices and workshops we regularly encountered problems with damp were it was not possible to screed floor .Our answer was to use sinterproof ,a bitumen based product that is semi liquid .This would be spread on the floor with a stiff broom and also painted up the walls to a height of 1 meter .The walls would then be dry lined  by fixing 1 inch batterns
vertically to the walls 2 foot apart which were covered with 40 mm of high density  insulation and then 12mm shuttering ply .It is important to maintain a air flow between the wall and insulation by drilling regularly spaced holes at the bottom of the wall covering. This is often referred to as tanking a building out and if done correctly is quite cheap and effective. Mike

 

Offline SwarfnStuff

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #28 on: September 10, 2014, 12:51:28 AM »
Seems to me that if you were to adopt Smiffy's solution you could opt to include or not include the insulation layer. If your budget runs to it, insulate. You could also run your electrics behind the drywall and give yourself power outlets where desired. Perhaps you may need slightly thicker battens but probably not.
A dry, warm shop. Yea!  :coffee:
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Offline vtsteam

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #29 on: September 10, 2014, 04:23:12 PM »
Ideally you want to stop the water outside the shell, with backup prevention on the inside. The corner is the only problem reported. Seems like you'd want to look at what is happening on the outside there.
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Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #30 on: September 10, 2014, 07:06:02 PM »
Well I appreciate all the comments and suggestions. After three days of dry weather the area is totally dry. I did a test last night in the dark and placed a tourch outside the corner and went inside- I could see the light inside between the joint. I've tonight attempted to seal it and then need some rain. If that cures it I'll go with the liquid dcm and a better job at sealing. If it gets damp then  I'll get digging!

I've been interested in the discussion on insulating the walls. The concrete is well indented with a 1 3/4" cup - can I not use it for insulation or do I need it as well as the air gap. It's only 8' foot wide and I'm worried insulating it is going to really bring it in. Also, what would you use to insulate the roof?

A few more pics how it stands are attached. Still trying to source a door but I also need to fix the concrete run off into the door!!

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Offline SwarfnStuff

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #31 on: September 11, 2014, 03:10:41 AM »
Hmm, Looking at the second pic I think insulating the roof would be No 1 for me. Galvanized iron is either freezing in winter or roasting in summer. Here in OZ it's the summer heat that is the killer. Still, you would need to leave breathing space between insulation and iron. You could perhaps insulate the indents in the concrete too but I would start with the roof.
John B
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Offline chipenter

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #32 on: September 11, 2014, 03:27:13 AM »
Celotex for the roof it's expensive but the best 50mm or more , you can get plaster board with up to 50mm of polystirene  glued to one side that is use for garages in building called thermaline plus , I would put a surface drain by the door just to be safe .
Jeff

Offline Eugene

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #33 on: September 11, 2014, 04:55:42 AM »
Quote
Still trying to source a door but I also need to fix the concrete run off into the door!!
If you mean the side door, that's dead easy, just lay a few blues across the threshold. I'd also run the cement fillet along the base of the walls, following vtseams suggestion about doing both inside and outside.

If you aren't confident in your bricklaying skills, just give me a call via PM and I'll come over and do the job for you; I've got all the required kit (jet washer, blower / dryer etc.) you'll just need five blue bricks, the one's with "hoildays", and a couple of bags of ready mixed sand and cement. I've also got half a can of bitumen sealer going to seed, so it might be possible to fix some of the other problems too.

Eug






Offline Arbalist

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #34 on: September 11, 2014, 06:48:12 AM »
Typical with these garages, you also have daylight between the walls and the eaves. Plug those gaps as well if you plan to insulate.

Offline Joules

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #35 on: September 11, 2014, 09:22:37 AM »
I would be hatching a plan to insulate the outside and then maybe shiplap the exterior than loose any further space internally.  Also plan on re-roofing with a taller apex and hefty beam for lifting tackle, you never know what the future may bring.  We had a tiny garage here, and checked up with a local planning guy what size garage we could build in its space.  I now have a decent sized workshop I have filled !!! :palm:

          Joules
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #36 on: September 11, 2014, 06:38:33 PM »
walls would then be dry lined  by fixing 1 inch batterns vertically to the walls 2 foot apart which were covered with 40 mm of high density  insulation and then 12mm shuttering ply .It is important to maintain a air flow between the wall and insulation by drilling regularly spaced holes at the bottom of the wall covering. This is often referred to as tanking a building out and if done correctly is quite cheap and effective. Mike

Could you just explain the "regular spaced holes at the bottom of the wall covering" ?

Also would 25mm celotex be acceptable instead of the 40mm - just thinking it`ll take up a little less room - only 15mm - 3cm in total across the width but I only have 8'1" to play with! that's still 24mmx2 batton + 25mmx2 celotex + 12mmx2 for the play - reduced it by 122mm.
Is it worth it - will it help with heating or not really? I think it`ll make it feel warmer!

Can I just say now that I can`t afford to lay a new screed floor. I`m going to go with the digging, check the foundation, get a drain running around the garage to move water away from the footings and then go with a liquid dcm. I`ve just purchased this today.
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Offline smiffy

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #37 on: September 12, 2014, 04:08:43 AM »
Hi The hole size i use is about 50 mm ,cut with a hole saw and spaced 2 feet apart, at any builders merchant you can buy a plastic push in vent normally used in soffit boards etc these are ideal to make a professional looking job .When dealing with any damp in confined spaces
ie between concrete walls and insulation it is important that there is a air gap and that there is  air flow through the gap hence the holes top and bottom . Always fit as much insulation as possible to both walls and roof ,there is nothing worse than trying to work in a cold damp workshop and it protects your tools and equipment . I turned a stone built house with no dpc that was impossible to heat and control the  damp in ,into a house that is almost passive in heat input, by the use of  insulated walls with a 25mm vented air gap then 50mm insulation  and a further 25mm air gap and then plaster board with 200mm insulated in the  roof . Mike

Offline Jonny

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #38 on: September 12, 2014, 05:25:58 PM »
You have it made its so easy to line from the rafters, Its the best thing I ever did 21 years ago but admittedly have a lot more height in the eaves where I lay boxes to keep the noise down.
Mines only 3/16" ply cheap as you will get screwed to rafters. Lighting fixings through ply in to the woodwork. Some years ago I did lay insulation in between the rafters, then some years later lay chipboard floorboard on the top of the rafters and screw together, immensely strong to walk over. I have a hatch like a loft door.
This extra insulation I haven't noticed much if any difference but a massive difference lining the roof with thin ply.

Must be 12 years ago I lined the walls with the cheap 8ftx2ft+? interlocking chipboard meant for floors, this was a worthwhile improvement but take notice of where the battons are to screw shelving to.
Can just about see it in background above dro in magnolia though a few years ago http://i1140.photobucket.com/albums/n563/Jonhareng/Jons%20machining/4DROCompareGlassMagneticinitialmovement004.jpg

Doing what I have is perhaps the cheapest method, no doubt the celotex is better but you seen the price of one slab - about the cost of doing 1/2 the whole wall or ceiling with little advantage or in my case inferior as cant hang shelving up or hang aluminium and steel lengths from ceiling between the lighting.

For me I would black dip the walls (bitumen) and seal up the gaps prior to battoning.
Cheap 3mm ribbed rubber matting will massively help with the floor, but might only last 18 months, go thicker. It expands in summer and bubbles, walked over creating tears as it shrinks. Also a pain with shovel and swarf though broom not too bad n straight lines. Also helps with the dropsies.

Offline Pete.

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #39 on: September 13, 2014, 02:07:50 AM »
There's no way I would put up with a floor like that when I could fix it for 100 in materials and a weekend's hard work.

One of these: http://www.wickes.co.uk/Wickes-1000-Gauge-Blue-Damp-Proof-Membrame-4x12-5m/p/152859

One of these: http://www.wickes.co.uk/Wickes-Sharp-Sand-Jumbo-Bag/p/220081

Ten of these: http://www.wickes.co.uk/Lafarge-Blue-Circle-Cement-25kg/p/224661

And you have a new floor dry, flat and smooth. Plus you've raised the floor level to stop anything that gathers outside the door troubling you. Laying it could not be easier - just cut the poly 6" over-size all around, lay it in and tape it to the walls to stop it moving. Throw a few shovels of sand/cement mix around the edge if you like to keep it down.

Cut a piece of stout timber to fit across the bottom of those concrete panels on the recess and fix a board to it to hang down to where you want your floor height to be. This is your levelling tool. It has to be able to slide left and right but not fall off either end.

Either borrow a mixer or get a nice flat area to work on. Start at the far end and draft in some help coz without a mixer it's going to be a long day. Shovel out 3 sand 1 cement 3 sand one cement all into a rough heap and turn it over till it's a uniform colour. Now add a LITTLE water and turn it over to make it damp so it will just clump in your hand enough to hold shape but not have a shiny surface. Now just shovel it in. Do a couple or three rounds then spread it out with your levelling tool. Ram the corners and edges lightly with a block of wood or club hammer head to pull the DPM down into the corner. Scrape one panel level then hop your scraper over to the next gap. Scrape than too then trowel the bit in between where your scraper won't fit. Work your way across to the door then start again the other end. Do the last bit later when either side has cured a bit. Once it's all dry, trim the poly offabout 10mm high from the floor around the edges until you're sure no damp is coming in through the walls.



Offline RussellT

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #40 on: September 13, 2014, 05:33:50 AM »
Hi Chris

I had a new concrete garage at one time.  It was dry, so there's no fundamental reason why yours shouldn't be.

The concrete fillet has to be on the inside - a fillet on the outside just guides the water running down a wall under the walls.  The joints between sections were simply filled with mastic.

I assume the roof is some sort of cement panel rather than steel.  I didn't get condensation on those but I had a couple of clear panels for light which did suffer from condensation.

Insulation is nice but remember it only keeps heat in - it's no use if you don't have some heating in there.

I found the bolts holding the panels together useful for fastening shelves. You can bolt a length of angle iron to the wall and weld shelf brackets to it.

I had trouble with water being blown under the door.  I used cement and made a barrier just inside the door - like a mini speed bump about half an inch high - I could still wheel stuff over it but it stopped the water.

Has the garage got gutters?  Do the down pipes get the water clear of the concrete base?

Russell

Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #41 on: September 17, 2014, 01:23:19 PM »
Sorry for the slow replies but I'm without internet for a further two weeks!

There have been many suggestions and I can't do them all but I've used a lot of suggestions. I sealed the gap I could clearly see in the edge and I then applied a bitumen based flexible damp course membrane - 3 coats, 3' up the wall and a couple of foot into the floor. I've then battened the wall and I'm adding insulation boards and 12mm ply to make the walls. It's going to take me a few more days but I'm getting there.

I've bricked up the door bottom opening with one layer of engineering brick and cut the door down to fit but I still need a new door. Next job is to dig more concrete up and provide a drain around the garage.
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Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #42 on: October 11, 2014, 08:12:15 PM »
Hi guys, 5 weeks in the new house and I've still no proper internet connection (thanks to Sky buts that's another story!!). Just wanted to update you in that I'm now on the new workshop, I moved all my new stuff in today and I'm really pleased with it! I'm not 100% happy with the arrangement but I'll be tinkering and tidying over the next few days. I'll take some pics soon.

I battened and insulated the walls and used ply to face the walls. I used OSB3 on the floor and painted it with floor paint but I admit, I think I'm still going to put some PVC mats down where I stand. All is good so far!

Chris
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Offline raynerd

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #43 on: July 26, 2016, 12:44:27 PM »
18 months later... Not everyone's style of video I know, but it makes it fun to edit and use my camera...

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2OXDgFW6uk" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2OXDgFW6uk</a>
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Offline mechman48

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #44 on: September 13, 2016, 10:48:34 AM »
Hi Reynard
Nice shop & kit. One question... I have attempted to upload video of my latest project, a simple S10V, & have followed the instructions from the forum heading 'posting a video from YouTube' but am always getting the copied URL in hyperlink format, I can never seem to upload the actual video into the post. I am running the new Win10 using IE but the pages that come up on YouTube bear only some resemblance to the instructions. I would appreciate you describing the process you used to embed your video in posting, either pm me or as another posting on here, as is usual there must be something very easy that I've missed & is not registering in my old grey matter.

Much appreciated.
George.
George.


Always look on the bright side of life, & remember.. KISS..' Keep It Simple Stupid'

Offline philf

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Re: Craynerd new workshop project log
« Reply #45 on: September 13, 2016, 11:15:50 AM »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBoHBX14h0" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eBoHBX14h0</a>

George,

You need only to post the YouTube number as follows:

Code: [Select]
[youtube]5eBoHBX14h0[/youtube]
Copy the number from your YouTube video URL; Either type the youtube and /youtube in square brackets or hit the YouTube button (which will do this for you) and paste the number in the middle.

Hope this helps.

Cheers.

Phil.
Phil Fern
Location: Marple, Cheshire