Author Topic: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b  (Read 26162 times)

Offline mexican jon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 214
  • Country: england
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2015, 03:01:47 AM »
 :Doh: :Doh:
People say you only live once ! I say thank F@*K can't afford to do it twice.

Offline tom osselton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1255
  • Country: ca
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2015, 08:43:15 PM »
Sorry to hear that but it doesn't look all that bad I think they made that gear as a weak link there isn't much meat between the gear and the teeth. Is the double key one piece? Just wondering I didn't pull my gear off of it.

Offline Manxmodder

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 739
  • Country: gb
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2015, 06:28:47 AM »
The same thing can happen with my Alba. On later models and the Elliot 3M(based on the Alba design) the feed screw threads taper out to minor dia shaft size and the nut runs out of thread before the crash can occur.

Just put this incident down to learning the do's and dont's of running a shaper. Maybe a good idea to modify the end portions of the screw when you rebuild the mechanism so it can't happen in future.

As Tom says,it is all repairable and a shaper without a power cross feed is seriously reduced in it's versatility and capability.......OZ
Helixes aren't always downward spirals,sometimes they're screwed up

Offline rockknocker

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 53
  • Country: us
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #28 on: September 15, 2015, 01:15:09 AM »
Tom, yes the double key is one piece, or at least it appears to be. I haven't take that piece out yet either, as I've been continuing to use the shaper without the power feed. Shapers are supposed to be great at making spur gears, so I thought I'd use it to make a replacement gear. To that end, I do have an Atlas indexer attachment for this machine, although I wanted to get better at running the shaper in general before trying to use it, supposedly they can be a bit fragile.

OZ, I thought about turning down the thread to do just as you're suggesting, but was worried about the amount of table movement I'd be losing, or weakening, if those threads were removed. When items are bolted to the side of the table on this shaper, the table has to be almost all the way to one side in order to machine, although this would be less of a problem with an angled toolholder (the toolholder could be held out to one side to compensate). I'd be worried that the shaper would be set up for another type of failure if there was only a thread or two of engagement while power feeding. Have you ever been limited by this safety feature on your shaper?

Regardless, there will definitely be some form of anti-crash feature to keep this from happening again.
Anything is possible when you forget what's impossible.

Offline vintageandclassicrepairs

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 218
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #29 on: September 15, 2015, 07:59:26 AM »
Hi All,
Sorry to hear about the "crash"
I'm surprised that there's not a shear pin or soft key to prevent damage when something like this happens?
If theres supposed to be one, maybe if there was one it had beee replaced with the "wrong" material??

Regards
John

Offline RGS

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • Country: us
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #30 on: October 20, 2015, 08:29:25 AM »
The gear that is broken is a 20T change gear used on the Atlas 10 & 12 inch lathes.  The part # is 9-101-20.  They changed the gears on the lathes at some point and the newer gear is a 9-101-20A.  The only difference is the face is narrower on the A model gear to help reduce noise in the lathes.  I don't think that will matter in use on the shaper.

Offline RGS

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • Country: us

Offline tom osselton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1255
  • Country: ca
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #32 on: October 23, 2015, 01:08:48 AM »
Good to know I'll have to buy a couple just in case!  :headbang:
thanks

Offline Sackett

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #33 on: October 31, 2015, 08:50:43 PM »
The powerfeed on my Atlas , doesn't work. The gear on the feedscrew just turns back n forth, with no visible way to secure it to the screw.Shaper works fine, n I enjoy using it. My solution when I get around to it is to make a feed mechanism according to Gingery's design,,n just file a flat on feedscrew for a set screw.If this isnt a good idea, sombody stop me before I mess up,please.

Offline RGS

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • Country: us
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #34 on: November 01, 2015, 02:17:33 AM »
Somewhere I saw that the keyed bushing has a pin through it.  I do not see the pin in the manual.

Offline tom osselton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1255
  • Country: ca
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #35 on: November 01, 2015, 01:07:26 PM »
You can see it on page 2 it looks like it is just to keep it located.

http://madmodder.net/index.php/topic,10925.0.html

If it is just rocking it probably needs to be adjusted by sliding the linkage arm out increasing the feed.

Offline Sackett

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2015, 06:20:27 PM »
Tom,
That wont work on my machine. the gear on the feedscrew has a bushing in ,,no hole for a pin , or key or anything. it just spins on the feedscrew. i can spin it with my finger. the mechanism works fine,, ratchet n such,,but the gear just spins on feedscrew

Offline tom osselton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1255
  • Country: ca
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #37 on: November 01, 2015, 06:46:29 PM »
Your machine is exactly like mine if you can move the table with the crank then it has to be the pin in the double key piece I'd tap the gear over or off, I'm sure if you take a closer look you will find a pin cleanly sheared off.

Offline Sackett

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2016, 01:03:51 PM »
Well folks, I was wrong again. Man I hate when that happens! ,lol Here's an apolegy to Tom for disagreeing with him about his / n my shaper.
I had to move mine today to get to some other bits, n afterwards thought I'd have another go at fixing the power crossfeed. took it all apart for umptenth time,, n sure enough there on the crossfeed shaft were the little telltale circles of the sheared pin. Got all the little bits out, so off to get new roll pin. Was sweating bullets about trying to drive that little keyed bushing outta the zamak gear,, but first light tap, n out it came :D :D happy here

Offline tom osselton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1255
  • Country: ca
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2016, 01:51:59 PM »
Nice to hear you found it they are sometimes hard to see!

Offline Sackett

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #40 on: March 31, 2016, 01:19:38 PM »
New pin in, all back together. Still slight issue,, n this may be where all the trouble started. The table movbes to the operators side,,,left to right if facing the machine fine. but if going the other way ,,the ratchet pawl slips over the teeth,,,with much protesting noise. Tried it a coupla times ,,,might move through several cycles the same thging. The table is noticeably harde to move away,,,towards the left. Even using a wrench,,,no crank handle with machine.Soooooo, I left it ,,I'll have a think on why is harder to move one way than other,, n get back on it next week. Off to the city for Dr appointments n such now

Offline Manxmodder

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 739
  • Country: gb
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #41 on: March 31, 2016, 03:23:09 PM »
Sacket, that might be a problem with the gib strip adjuster screws riding up on their respective strip indents in one direction and causing the gib to give a wedging effect.

I had a similar problem with the topslide feed on my Alba shaper. Ended up making a new gib strip with accurately drilled screw locating indents and problem sorted.

OZ.

Helixes aren't always downward spirals,sometimes they're screwed up

Offline Sackett

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #42 on: April 03, 2016, 11:49:03 AM »
Not sure what the prob is,, was thinking to try loosening gibs, n see if helps. will try when I get back to shop next week

Offline Okapi

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 7
  • Country: ch
    • Mes images de coeur
Re: New Old Shaper - Atlas 7b
« Reply #43 on: April 15, 2016, 07:21:11 PM »
Hi Rockknokker,
As I have near the brother of your shaper as you can see here : http://www.lecollectionneur.ch/rapide-lime/
And the same broken gear… but it comes after a long use due to the bad material used, I've made a new one in normal C35 steel, for the broken carter which is sometimes made in a very thin zamac, you can make a new system without using this one until you find a repair part, it's not very complicate to put a wheel directly on the command screw.
If you're interested by the precision obtained with this model, here is a little video I made for proving that point : http://www.lecollectionneur.ch/precision-plane-dun-etau.html

The new piece you've made perfectly is very often forgotten by the users, it need some oil at each use of the shaper if you don't work all days, and at the morning if it is in function frequently, you make the small perfectly. :thumbup: