Author Topic: moglice/turcite home cook?  (Read 1406 times)

Offline PekkaNF

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moglice/turcite home cook?
« on: May 17, 2016, 02:00:52 PM »
Hello,

I have been reading about epoxy based some epoxy based bearing materials and I'm trying to understand what is the fuction of different constituents and their purpose.

http://www.google.com/patents/US4329238

Abstract:An antifriction paste containing epoxy resin, molybdenum disulphide, graphite, aluminum, copper, alumosilicate and polyethylenepolyamine, the components being used in the following proportions (in parts by weight):
epoxy resin: 40-80

molybdenum disulphide: 15-30

graphite: 10-15

aluminum: 5-10

copper: 5-10

alumosilicate: 8-15

polyethylenepolyamine: 5-10.

The antifriction paste may also contain a solvent for the epoxy resin in an amount from 5 to 30 parts by weight. This paste is suitable for both small-and large-size friction assemblies. On the basis of this paste a solid lubricating coating with high antifriction performance is produced. Thus, a coefficient of sliding friction ffr. at a sliding speed V=0.06 m/s at a load P=10 kgf/cm2 is 0.2; linear wear rate Ih under the same conditions is 1.0.10-9, and service life is as high as 500 km.

So, what is the purpose of each part?

epoxy resin: 40-80. OK, this is obivious. Matrix.

molybdenum disulphide: 15-30. This is often last line of defense, Works under high load, slow speed?

graphite: 10-15, what is the ecological niche for this one? Isn't that little bit redandant with MOS?

aluminum: 5-10
copper: 5-10. Yup, other materials are not that "strong", glass fibre is common to supplement abysmal cold flow of teflon.

alumosilicate: 8-15, more hardness?

polyethylenepolyamine: 5-10.

*****************

DIY version: on megathread....
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/epoxy-granite/30155-epoxy-granite-machine-bases-polymer-concrete-frame-225.html

100 Grams total: powders should be in the 1 to 20 micron

    50 grams epoxy 635 2:1 (with BYK A-525 and BYK W-969 if you have it.)
    10 grams of Molybdenum disulphide powder or Hexagonal Boran Nitrite.
    10 grams Graphite powder (still wondering why on this one).
    10 grams 3M 200 Zeeospheres.
    5 gram Tungsten Disulfide. (if you can't afford then up the teflon)
    5 grams Teflon powder.
    5 grams Aluminum powder. (probably can drop this and up the Zeeo's)
    5 grams Copper powder. (probably can drop this and up the MoS2)

Lot of slipery stuff! I'm wondering mostly teflon. Works dry, low friction if there is some transfer onto counter surface. But mechanical properties are pretty low.

Some stuf is easy to get and straightforward to use. Some stuff is hard to obtain in right grain size and spesification.

Teflon is something I have mixed feelings:
1) Hard to glue. There is an activator for CA-glue. Surface treatment for epoxy is harder.
2) Another bearing surface must be apropriate surface roughness, or there is too little of of transfer or excessive wear.
3) PTFE has large cold flow and needs something on mix.

This is so far just and academic entertainment, but I just might order some graphite and metal powder, because I seem to need some dry lubricants every now and then.

Now the question: Ideas of two different mixtures? Another for way oil and another dry.

Pekka

Offline PekkaNF

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Re: moglice/turcite home cook?
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2016, 05:19:42 AM »
Unbelievable :doh:

I knew that epoxyresins and such are HAZMAT, but I never thought that most of the metal powders are too....apparently something new, least in UK/EU in last 6 months or so. Frigging frustrating trying to find a place where you can buy small amount (100-250g) of graphite, copper, bronze, and aluminium powder and then DG surcharge is something like 70 GBP! Clacking bell!

Plan B - non metallic fillers? Any ideas for lower abrasivity than glass fibre/spheres and more compression strength most plastics, closer to aluminium would be nice?

Pekka

Offline PK

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Re: moglice/turcite home cook?
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2016, 05:51:59 AM »
Metal powders are fairly easy to make.


Offline PekkaNF

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Re: moglice/turcite home cook?
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2016, 10:11:37 AM »
Yesh, but pan of my band saw contains mixture of mystery metals - could be closer to thermite than bearing material.  :lol: Actually it might have a little POM, PTFE, HDPE and such.....

Pekka

Offline DavidA

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Re: moglice/turcite home cook?
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2016, 10:48:25 AM »
Stefan Covers this product in his lathe rebuild video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1ytS1lhVFg

Dave.

Offline Fergus OMore

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Re: moglice/turcite home cook?
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2016, 04:49:24 PM »
I thought that there would have been more creative response but not really.

Two points might help.

1. my Myford Super7B Old, Long in the tooth, like me- has a turcite packing under the very worn saddle

2. there was an article about that years ago in Model Engineers Workshop.

Somebody could unearth it, perhaps?


Me, well I have rather a large supply of bronze dust dating possibly 1938-- and a large box of stones for balances. I'm being serious.

The dear lady who had them is no longer with us but here daughter is- and she's gluing wires to teeth.

Just a thought or three?

Such fillers are pretty cheap- ready to use