Author Topic: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion  (Read 6451 times)

Offline Joules

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Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« on: September 03, 2016, 08:44:07 AM »
Well, the start of it anyway.  My second controller and first pendant got delivered this morning.



Quite impressed by the pendant, was expecting something rather plastic for the money.  It is plastic cased but with brass inserts for the screws, no self tappers.  It is quite hefty and a solid feel in the hand, the rotary dial has a good feel to it, consistent movement and indents, no tight spots or play in rotation.  I did tweak the selector switches as the plastic knob just kissed the switch body below, but really only undo and refasten the grub screws, now the switches feel fine no dragging between moves.  The magnets in the back of the pendant are adequate to hold it in place but it doesn't take much to remove from a steel plate.  Not sure I would entirely trust the magnets to hold it in place, so I will probably end up with a hanging hook someplace.



The controller fired up straight away with the same firmware version as my previous unit, so no surprises in its operation.  The controller pulling about 100ma @ 24vdc

Still to get on my shopping list is another PSU and the stepper motors, probably the NEMA 23 3.1nm jobs.  Further progress will now wait till the mill arrives in kit form   :thumbup:
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Will_D

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2016, 10:53:34 AM »
Hi Joules,

Can I have some more info on the pendant please?

Is it a separate driver controller or does it integrate with the DDCSV1?

Can you post a link to it please?

Still learning and waiting for my controller

Will
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Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2016, 12:06:49 PM »
Here you go Will

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/CNC-Pulse-Generator-4-Axis-MPG-Pendant-Handwheel-Emergency-Stop-for-Siemens-FAGOR-GSK/2009058806.html

It wires straight into the back of the DDCSV, though I will use a 25w D connector for through the case connection, and transfer to other machines.  The extra pins on the D can also support the tool probe sensor  2.5mm mono audio jack built into the D connector shell.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Will_D

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #3 on: September 04, 2016, 02:48:19 PM »
Thanks Joules, do you have a wiring diagram for this pendant?

Just got a reply fromn ParcelMotel* that a package has arrived in the Dublin depot. Afaik it should be my little controller!!


*Note to all non Irish about ParcelMotel:

This is a service provided by a courier company (Nightline).
http://www.parcelmotel.com/

They have set up computerised lockers at Petrol Stations around the Republic of Ireleand ( I think they are in NI as well, not sure about UK or the rest of the world)

When a parcel arrives in the locker nearest to you you get a text message and a pin to unlock the locker. You walk up, pop in your mobile number and then the pin and then the locker opens - so you get your parcel.

This costs just under 4 per parcel.

So what is the advantage(s)?

There are several:

Biggest is that they have a NI address (just add yout membership number) so UK companys that offer free post within UK send then to Belfast for free!
Others charge a LOT less to post to NI as opposed to posting to the Republic - Like 5 fold  :bugeye:

Some UK companys will NOT post to Ireland period  :Doh:

You have 48 hours to collect your parcel (suits people who work)

Stuff is not delivered to an apartment complex and subsequently stollen.

If it won't fit in the locker (like a Bike) then you collect from their Depots (for an extra charge)

And the Biggest Advantage:

SWMBOB never knows that you have just recieved yet another 'Golden Must Have Widget'!
Just say "I'm off to fill up the car with petrol darling"

It really is a GREAT service
Engineer and Chemist to the NHC.ie
http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.ie/forum/

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #4 on: September 04, 2016, 02:56:18 PM »
This is on that page link above, but no harm posting it here as well.

Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Will_D

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #5 on: September 04, 2016, 06:24:49 PM »
 I saw that diagram Joules on the makers thread!

Its just that the colours of the wires bear no relationship to the connections on the DDCSV1?

Or am I just being incredibly stupid?
Engineer and Chemist to the NHC.ie
http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.ie/forum/

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #6 on: September 05, 2016, 05:50:29 AM »
Yeah, tis a little confusing.  However all the important stuff is there, you don't have a line out for the LED and the emergency stop on the DDCSV only uses two wires not three.   I'll do a wire to pin chart later, probably after I have wired mine up so we know its right, or WRONG.

Also confusing is the E-stop has two options, one for the pendant 5v and an external E-stop 12v  My guess, they won't appreciate being cross wired.

 
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #7 on: September 05, 2016, 05:09:12 PM »
Finally got the pendant working....   If you're at all colour blind this will be a challenge.  I had a really bright light and the colours are still awkward.  Wiring direct into the DDCSV is lets say tricky, it wants to be a socket of some sort and thicker gauge cable off the other side.   The other thing that caught me out was setting the logic levels in the parameters and remember to select MPG using the mode button.  I cracked open the case and tested every wire till I realised I wasn't in MPG mode
 :palm:

Oh well, at least I had continuity and everything was wired correctly, if you are colour blind this is actually the best way to attempt wiring it as the board has some silk screen labels and the encoder connections are as per the diagram.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline raynerd

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #8 on: September 05, 2016, 05:23:26 PM »
 :offtopic: nice power supply. Rob Wilson sent me one of those a good few years back. I love it.
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Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #9 on: September 05, 2016, 05:27:18 PM »
LOL I picked that one up at an Amateur radio rally from the Kenwood stand, it's got to be over 20yrs old now.

Will, I just took a look in the manual and saw the wire list you must have looked up.  Ignore that unless you use the pendant they specify, this one isn't the same as that, hence the different wire colours, but they do the same job, main requirement being the pendant has a 5v encoder, NOT 12v.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2016, 05:37:40 AM »
Here comes the beautiful pendant wiring...   :lol:



Colours and connection as below.

GND      =  Black
WHA+   =  Yellow
WHB+   =  White
A-IN      =  Blue
Z-IN      =  Light Blue
Y-IN      =  Orange
X-IN      =  Brown

+5V-W  =  Red
WHA-    =  Pink
WHB-    =  Transparent
GND      =  Purple and Green Black
X100     =  Blue Black
X10       =  Grey
x1         =  Green
ESTOP   =  Red Black

You end up with 3 wires left over, this means the GND could be common'd up and reduce the pin count to 14 so a 15way D could be used, but the connector shell would be very tight so think the 25way is still the one to use.  The above ONLY applies to the pendant linked to earlier in the thread, the wiring is not universal so check before you follow the above guide.



These are the MPG (pendant) settings used for this particular pendant.  Note top left of the screen it's displaying MPG (Pendant Mode)

At this I have full pendant control over the router, makes a huge difference in driving the machine around rather than typing in the co ordinates on the front panel...  I now also have an ESTOP button (John)

Time to get another pendant ordered I guess.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline awemawson

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2016, 05:44:34 AM »
Joules,

It would be very handy if that pendant was on a plug & socket arrangement - makes the ergonomics of moving things about so much easier and would give you more flexibility sorting the wiring to your liking. Probably need to be a locking plug to prevent inadvertent dislodgement.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2016, 05:47:24 AM »
Andrew, this is just temporary to test the pendant and make sure it works as it also has zero strain relief as is.  I will be using 25w D connectors with locking screws in the shell.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2016, 01:26:30 PM »
The mill arrived, thanks Lester.  Now to get it trued and fettled as best I can for manual operation.  Then figure out how to CNC it.

 :scratch:

It's only a little beast but weighs in at over 90kgs, bit of hand scraping on some ways to get them even once I find which, or both are out of whack.



 :dremel:

The origional plan was to drive the Z axis from underneath, but as the action of the hand wheel is pretty good might just hang the motor off the front as per the Y axis.  As was pointed out to me it has a lot of mass and gravity working in my favour.  Ball screw might not be the best option for Z as it could easily back turn when the stepper powers down.  Only need two ballscrews then   :thumbup:
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline John Stevenson

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2016, 02:04:02 PM »
Call that a photo ?
Seen better identikit photos on crime watch.

 :worthless:
John Stevenson

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #15 on: September 22, 2016, 02:21:57 PM »
Well, I am preparing to murder it......
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline awemawson

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #16 on: September 22, 2016, 02:25:16 PM »
Call that a Mill - I've seen bigger ones given away in Cornflake packets  :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

(sorry Joules - I had to parody John  :clap: )
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #17 on: September 22, 2016, 02:42:07 PM »
It's OK I shimmed the column with cornflakes box....   Be right, especially machining those gnats nuts.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline malbenbut

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2016, 03:51:47 AM »
What is the mills make and model?

MBB

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2016, 04:32:29 AM »
It's a Sieg SU1
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline lesterhawksby

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #20 on: September 23, 2016, 04:41:41 AM »
Sieg SU-1. It's the oddball, tiny horizontal-to-vertical convertible nobody but me is daft enough to buy. Accepting its limitations, and one actual defect I never had the opportunity to get corrected, I actually rather liked it - though used it only very lightly due to circumstances. Joules has been concocting an exciting plan to CNC it for ages and finally bravely bought it from me (my workshop arrangement is changing and I don't think it's part of the new picture). I can't wait to see what he does with it.

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #21 on: September 23, 2016, 06:49:44 AM »
OK bit more about this project.



The mill is pretty unique in that it's a very small (modern, Asian) knee mill.  From the above picture you can gather the head has no travel, it's all done via the knee.  This also means you do have a small Z axis, well not such a problem here as my other mill for the last 20+yrs has been the Taig at the side of it.  I have an idea to use a high speed spindle for the vertical and use something like a Myford vertical slide to allow the spindle to be raised and lowered independently.  This should allow some degree of drilling, manually and allow the Z to have an extra 50mm or so without major modifications.  It should also still use the existing overarm attachment.



The horizontal is where we have a bit of an issue.  Whoever bored it was in a bit of a hurry or had a boozy lunch, its on the piss   :palm:   I might need to call in a favour with someone that has a Bridgeport to re bore and sleeve the horizontal.   I don't want to use the horizontal for milling, but rather turning.  I looked at Taig's new CNC lathe and have been following Grimsmo Knives on YouTube.  I really like the ganged tooling approach.  I figured the little SU1 would make a great CNC small part turning machine with ganged tool plates for the bed.  It allows me to try some ideas see if they work, the current spindle would probably end up dedicated to horizontal use if the high speed spindle works out, if not it can still be swapped over as originally intended for this machine.

Thats the plan, I need to move towards CNC machines for the workshop.  My hands getting worse as the years go by and the 3D printing has been such a success for me, it seems only a small step from plastics to metal in relation to G Code anyway.  I seem to have the CAD side covered, lets see where it goes, I should also add first job is to get it as good as I can as a manual mill first, need a bit more tweaking for smooth running, slight taper on the Y axis dovetail somewhere and the knee can be a little sticky, pretty sure a bit of gentle hand scraping will sort those issues.

Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #22 on: September 23, 2016, 06:04:22 PM »
OK, small set back....  Whilst setting the knee up I just couldn't get shut of some play, loosen the gib it improved, OK but the table still moved a bit, tighten the gib and it moved a lot.





I had one of the column mounting bolts give me some concern when it wouldn't tighten properly, well now I know the result.  Strip back down ready to blue the parts and sort it out.



The base came up nice, I don't have a small surface plate  (which would have been so handy later on) so figured I will scrap it to the base.



First blue, or rather lack of......   Hmm I spy with my now blue eye, two pivot points.  The thick blue and the shiny blob.   No wonder it was rocking, break out the new Sandvic scraping tool and get to work.



Some time later we have a column that no longer rocks.   Still needs more contact area.



Hours later, my back breaking lifting and flipping the column over, I have a much better result.   Time to call it a night and continue tomorrow.  All I want is contact around the outer edge and a bit of clearance round the bolt holes so they snug down.   I find this work really satisfying, just take your time and be patient.

Night all.....
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Joules

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2016, 11:40:33 AM »
Ahhhh, done as much as I need for good contact of the column to base.



Had a visit from Rob Wilson  :wave:  He reckons the bore for the horizontal can be rebored and sleeved to get it all back true, cheers Rob will take you up on that offer.

I made a start on making a mock up of the ball nut 1204 that might be used in the conversion.



Printing finish when Rob arrived so he was able to see one hot, out the machine.



It's going to be, interesting   making two of them fit in the knee space available, at least I can try different printed nuts before I commit to buying any.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline John Stevenson

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Re: Desktop Mill CNC Conversion
« Reply #24 on: September 24, 2016, 11:53:10 AM »
Hope you kept an eye on the perpendicular it both planes when scraping ?
Give those hole a light countersinking so when they are tighten up you don't raise any stress points to hold off that lovely clean, flat scraped surface
John Stevenson