Author Topic: Moving shop again (again)...  (Read 5695 times)

Offline AdeV

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Moving shop again (again)...
« on: November 13, 2016, 05:04:11 PM »
Some of you may have gathered from some of my other posts that I am moving to a new workshop. Again. Fourth time now... it's getting a bit tedious, so I'm hoping to be in this new one for a good few years. Tried to move out of my current one a couple of years back, but had to abort & come back due to the new place being constantly flooded - including a gigantic hole right over the electric board, so everything shorted out every time it rained. Which it does a lot, up here in t'frozen North...

So, anyhoo, here's the new spread (all pictures can be embiggened by clicking):



3600 sq/ft of leaky roof and pigeon shít. Nice.

I'm sharing this with a couple of other lads, so I get 3/4 of the place (about 2700sq/ft, or 250sq/m for those who calculate in French). 100sq/m of that space is upstairs on the mezzanine.



One of the many water features... This one has now been fixed, and new OSB laid across (most of) the old floor. That was the only real weak spot upstairs, it's been leaking so long most of the glue/bonding/whatever it is in the OSB had been washed away, the water was dripping straight through!



That grey stuff is not insulation. It is, genuinely, pigeon shít. There were about 1/2 dozen pigeons in there when we moved in, all since shot & fed to the cats/foxes. The place has been empty for many years, mainly due to the leaking roof, dangerous electrics, and inch-deep coating of pigeon poo. Oh, and the fact that the council wanted to charge rates on the place! Well, since that nice Mr Osborne (former UK finance minister, for those scratching their heads) changed the rates rules, the place will be zero rated as of next year & for the foreseeable future. Which is nice.

Aaaanyway, fast forward 5 months, and this is what it looks like now:




The eagle-eyed amongst you will notice there's not many machine tools in evidence.... they're still at the old place, should have them in by/just after Christmas (I hope!)

Meantime, I've spent the last 2 weekends buying wood, then screwing it all together:



This will be the new office (byebye Portacabin, you've served me well, but I can't lift you onto the mezzanine you're just too damn heavy & fragile). Got 1 more main wall to build, but I can't do that until I've got the window(s) and door(s). Maybe next weekend... Note the shiny new OSB. And the black rubber mat where it still leaks a bit  :palm:



One of the old welding bays (visible in the 1st pic, on the RHS about 1/2 way down) currently full of "clutter" (Mr Wilson might recognise some of it  :wave:)

The roof isn't quite there yet either:


Yes, all 5 buckets are needed... there's a 6th just out of shot too! New plan is to fit some internal under-roofing which will catch the water & channel it away.

Anyway... I'll have a smashing big workshop when I'm finished - over 1000sq/ft for the lathes/mills and other sundry machine tools, and all tucked away under the mezzanine where it should be possible to keep them reasonably warm even in the middle of winter (I plan a giant sliding door in front of the mezzanine, so access is still easy, but any warmth stays in there), approx 400sq/ft office space up on the mezzanine (the dimensions are 100% driven by the requirements of the pool table!!) with the rest given over to storage, and around another 800sq/ft ish for cars/race car stuff.

All in all, I'm aching from head to foot but rather pleased with myself just now  :)
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2016, 05:11:54 PM »
That's quite some space Ade  :bugeye: You've been busy - is the travelling crane still functional?
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2016, 05:35:20 PM »
That's quite some space Ade  :bugeye: You've been busy - is the travelling crane still functional?

Unfortunately the crane has been stripped of everything electrical (apart from the bare copper wires that used to power it!!! That gert big I-beam that's visible in the first "office" picture did have 4x 1/4 inch bare conductors stretched along it. Talk about a lethal hazard! Will use the forge to make copper ingots out of them, then either weigh them in or keep them as mementos). However, all the crane really needs is a motor, and a gearwheel, and it could be made to move again. The original hook and traverse mechanism's all gone, and has been replaced with a simple hand-moved hanger (visible in 2nd pic, with the chains hanging down). I'd hang my 1 ton electric hoist off that, although it would be nice to have an electric traverse.

Anyway, it's on the "one day" list... Biggest change would have to be moving the stops, left as is it could crash into the shelves/office!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline John Stevenson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2016, 05:46:00 PM »
Friend of mine has a travelling crane, in fact the girlfriend built it for him.

What they have done is to park it halfway down the carriageway and fit one of those 1/4 ton Lidl hoists onto the beam.
Cable goes from one end of the building about 5 times round the winch capstan and then goes to the other end where it's tightened up.

Works that well he's in the process of fitting one to the lift carriage for side to side movement.
John Stevenson

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2016, 06:59:02 PM »
Friend of mine has a travelling crane, in fact the girlfriend built it for him.

What they have done is to park it halfway down the carriageway and fit one of those 1/4 ton Lidl hoists onto the beam.
Cable goes from one end of the building about 5 times round the winch capstan and then goes to the other end where it's tightened up.

Works that well he's in the process of fitting one to the lift carriage for side to side movement.

Hmmm, interesting...

I may need more than a 1/4 ton winch to move the whole beast (it's pretty sturdy looking), but that'd be ideal for the side-to-side. Thanks! Another one for the ever-lengthening to-do list!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline Spurry

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2016, 05:14:27 AM »
A VERY impressive clean-up operative you've carried out there.  :thumbup:
Pete

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2016, 06:19:52 AM »
Thanks Pete - it's involved a LOT of brushing, jetwashing, more brushing & more jetwashing, several gallons of paint and many many hours... and there's still a long way to go! e.g. there's still piles of pigeon crap under the mezzanine which needs sweeping up... ideally before the machines arrive...

Still, the good news is, it no longer stinks when the roof leaks!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2016, 07:10:25 AM »
Your're certainly sinking a lot of time, effort and materials into the new place Ade - have you bought it or are you renting it? If renting is your landlord obliged to do any repairs or is it a full 'repairing / insuring' lease ?
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline smiffy

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2016, 07:30:35 AM »
What a great shop . I am sure it will be worth the effort . Looking forward to more pictures when the machines arrive. Mike

Offline RobWilson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2016, 12:16:26 PM »
Looking good Ade

I sure wish I had just half the space you have  :palm:



Rob  :thumbup:

Offline Manxmodder

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2016, 04:43:23 PM »
Looking good Ade

I sure wish I had just half the space you have  :palm:



Rob  :thumbup:

A mezzanine and knee pads and you've doubled your working space......OZ.
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Offline howsitwork?

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2016, 05:01:55 PM »
Ade

really impressive mate and a lot of hard work no doubt. :clap:

Flog the pigeon fertilizer to someone who has an allotment! Like the idea of integrated pool table, mine just stands on end next to the mill until kids nag me and I put it up again.

Instead of a sliding door why not heavy duty plastic screen- faster and keeps heat in? Unless there's a fire hazard issue?

Ian

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2016, 08:07:05 PM »
Thanks chaps, it certainly is a nice place to have. Not the cheapest in the world... but pretty cheap considering the size, despite the colander-like roof... I can't claim credit for most of the prettyfication, the other chaps have done a lot of painting & decorating... and we have a sparky doing the re-wire (all to code and everything).

Andrew - it's only rented unfortunately. Buying is currently beyond my means... hopefully, if I've got my budget about right, I'll be in a position to buy sometime in the next 4-5 years, but I'll just keep on saving until we get kicked out of this place, the longer I can stay here, the more of a deposit I can build up towards purchasing. The rent is on the basis that you leave the place "no worse" than you found it. In fairness, the landlord is paying for me to "fix" the roof... but if push came to shove & we insisted on having the roof replaced (which is what it needs), they'd just refuse & condemn the building. One day, the whole site is going to get sold to a developer, and that'll be us on notice.

Rob: Yep, but as you know from your last visit, I do rather need the space (either that, or I need to massively downsize... and I just can't bring myself to do that). No ducking under low flying cars to get to the office in this place! Well... hopefully not anyway... Not at first.

Ian - Interesting, I hadn't considered a plastic curtain... A sliding door would be easy enough to construct - 10 sheets of OSB, some castor wheels, and some kind of guide rail.... but plastic would be quicker & easier. No fire issues we need to worry about, the place is so damp I don't think it would support combustion! Unfortunately (or fortunately?  :scratch:) most of the pigeon dung ended up being shoveled down the drain & flushed away... stinky horrid stuff. Most of what remains is either on top of the office, doubling up as insulation, or on top of the remnants of the welding bay roof... frankly I can't see my selling it, It'll go down the drain with the rest of the ick I think.


Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2016, 05:27:12 PM »
A little more progress today - got most of the 4th wall frame up:



Just got the door frame to finish, then 18 off 6x2 by 4.2m ceiling joists to lift just over 8ft in the air, then I can start plasterboarding.... not looking forward to that, unless I can beg/borrow/steal a plasterboard lifter from somewhere...
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline Spurry

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2016, 06:01:22 PM »
[quote/

Just got the door frame to finish, then 18 off 6x2 by 4.2m ceiling joists to lift just over 8ft in the air, then I can start plasterboarding.... not looking forward to that, unless I can beg/borrow/steal a plasterboard lifter from somewhere...


If you had a mate going to Snetterton, I have a board lifter just up the road from there. It's such a pleasure to be able to position a board accurately, without someone saying " 'aven't you dun it yet!".
Pete

Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #15 on: November 20, 2016, 03:58:31 AM »
I think Wickes hire them out
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #16 on: November 20, 2016, 05:39:56 AM »
Thanks for the kind offer Pete - unfortunately, the distance is prohibitive - I'd pay more in petrol than if I bought one!

Andrew - I'll check this morning, I'm about to head to Wickes for a bit more wood & plasterboard... for 3x2 stud & drywall, Wickes are cheaper even than the big builder's merchants.
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #17 on: November 20, 2016, 06:22:50 AM »
.... and I'm afraid that their low timber prices are reflected in the quality of the stuff they sell  :bugeye:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline PekkaNF

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2016, 12:51:17 PM »
That is a lot of space...some work you have left.

Helpped yesterday my brother, We had to move over 20 hard plasterboards 13x1200x2600 mm i.e. about 35 kg each. Some distance and then negotiate upstairs and then around the corner.....

Pekka

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #19 on: November 20, 2016, 06:21:45 PM »
A little more progress today, all the ceiling joists (for the main part of the office) are up; only 3 left to do, but until I build the door frame, I can't put them in place; and I can't build the door frame until I know how big the door is.... just waiting on the measurements from the seller, and another few bits of timber from Wickes. Andrew - I agree, they're not exactly the best wood I've ever worked with, but as far as I am concerned all wood is inhabited by evil spirits which cause splinters, splitting, warping, twisting and other nefarious effects. Oh, and why is it there's always a knot just where you need to saw/drill/screw the damn stuff? Give me metal any day of the week, at least it behaves relatively consistently. So long as you don't have to weld it of course...



Pekka.... I feel your pain.... I have approx 50 sheets of drywall, about the same size, to manhandle upstairs. At least I don't have to worry about corners though! Then there's another 14 or so sheets of OSB to go up to form the roof, and a big roll of EPDM to spread over that.... this is to contain the remaining small leaks which continue to plague the roof.

After that, there is the relatively minor job of carpet tiling the entire room, fitting all the electrics, fitting the beer pump  :bugeye: the dartboard, leveling the pool table, searching ebay for a fruit machine....  :lol:

I suppose I ought to carry on building my racing car at some point!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline PekkaNF

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #20 on: November 21, 2016, 04:13:54 AM »
Panel carry is good. We had two and two panels are at a time are fine if there are no stairs. There are fancier models, but simple ones seem to work best on real world.

He has to screw them on the roof, he is going to borrow a panel lift.

Pekka

Offline DMIOM

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2016, 05:56:31 AM »
........ searching ebay for a fruit machine....

Come on Ade - you're a software whiz, and you've now got a CNC lathe.  Bar feeder + a set of G-code macros + random-number front end = press the button and lathe will churn out a set of fruit!  Far more fun than watching pictures of fruit on painted wheels.

 :proj:

Dave

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #22 on: November 27, 2016, 04:17:20 PM »
........ searching ebay for a fruit machine....

Come on Ade - you're a software whiz, and you've now got a CNC lathe.  Bar feeder + a set of G-code macros + random-number front end = press the button and lathe will churn out a set of fruit!  Far more fun than watching pictures of fruit on painted wheels.

LOL! An interesting prospect for sure.... but that does involve getting the CNC lathe to work, currently not feasible... Still, there's plenty of other jobs to be getting along with.

So... this week I picked up the window, and discovered they'd measured it wrong  :palm: Fortunately, the height is good, and the window is narrower than the opening I made for it, so it fits right in. I'll make another "cripple stud" to run up alongside it, and no-one will ever know.  Then, whilst manoevering a sheet of plasterboard, I managed to knock into one of the end walls, nudging it off the floor and down below  :zap: Oh well, I needed to extend it anyway, as I'd made it about a foot too short...

Anyway, the upshot of this weekends labours is this:





This building lark isn't as easy as I thought it would be! Still, it's all more-or-less square and straight, +/- about 1/2 inch. Although as we can see, the window isn't quite spot on:



The vendor's listing said 2500mm wide, actually it's 2050mm. Doh! Easy mistake to make I suppose.

Also missing: One door...



I'm not planning an "L" shaped door, but the one I have on order I'm a bit concerned about the height - just 1975mm. If it really IS only that high, then I'll be banging my head walking through it... I need at least 2.1m height for safe entry! I suppose I could just screw a 125mm extension to the bottom of it, once it's all painted, no-one will ever know...  :loco:

Insulation would be the next conundrum.... it ain't cheap, specifically I reckon I could easily spend as much as I've already spent, and that's buying the cheap stuff. If I went for building code stuff, it'd be double again... Or do I just by pass the electric meter & run the heating 24x7.......  :lol:

Anyway, that's it for a couple of weeks, business trip next weekend, any readers local to Orlando?
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline mexican jon

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #23 on: November 27, 2016, 05:12:21 PM »
 :thumbup: Nice shop, makes my new place look rather small  :drool: :drool:
People say you only live once ! I say thank F@*K can't afford to do it twice.

Offline PekkaNF

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2016, 02:48:33 AM »
Do you need keep warm very big place? I would keep only a "hut" inside that structure warm and use residual heat to keep rest of the structure dry.

Pekka

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2016, 05:48:31 AM »
Do you need keep warm very big place? I would keep only a "hut" inside that structure warm and use residual heat to keep rest of the structure dry.

Keeping the whole place warm would be an exercise in futility... and a massive gas or electric bill! Unfortunately, the roof (what's left of it) is thin steel, so the heat goes through it like it wasn't there. Hence, the office... even without insulation it'd be possible to keep it somewhat warm, I'm hoping to be able to put something up (waiting for word on a bunch of reject Kingspan which would do me nicely) which will keep it warm in winter & cool in summer; but we shall see.

Underneath the mezzanine, I think it will be easier to keep warm; the low roof  will help, and I can put some kind of cover over the front - either sliding doors or that heavy duty plastic stuff you see in warehouses, which will also help. The rest of the place.... well, we'll just have to freeze in winter, and roast in summer....
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline mattinker

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2016, 08:36:54 AM »
Adev,

I insulated the outer walls of my workshop with panel from accident damaged fridge trucks! A friend of mine works for a fridge truck builder, when a driver tries to get under a bridge that's too low the resulting damage even if it's only in the front means replacing the a of the insulated body (apart from the floor!) as the panels can't be replaced! -18 degree trucks have continuous sides and roof panels, both sides polyester with 50mm of high insulation foam between. The roof sections are 80mm. an aditional bonus, on the inside there 1mm stainless cladding about 1.5meters high! My mate is always pleased to get this stuff "recycled", they have to pay to get it recycled!

All the best, Matthew.

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2016, 10:16:41 AM »
Matt,

I would be very keen to know if your friend would be willing to part with some of this stuff? Could I possibly ask you to contact him & find out if he'd be happy to hear from me? I could take loads of stuff off him.... got a few ideas which need some stainless steel sheet too! Depending on where he is, I could show up with a large van to be filled... and it'd all be going to a good home!

Cheers,
Ade.
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline mattinker

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2016, 10:23:12 AM »
Well, that would be difficult as he's south west of Paris and on to of that, they don't have them all the time. You also have to cut the panels up yourself. I was thinking more like you could ring round your local fridge truck builders and see what they say!

Cheers, Matthew

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2016, 10:24:17 AM »
Well, that would be difficult as he's south west of Paris and on to of that, they don't have them all the time. You also have to cut the panels up yourself. I was thinking more like you could ring round your local fridge truck builders and see what they say!

Doh! I was hoping this was a friend from before you scarpered off to France!

Good intel though, I'll do the yellow-pages dance & see what I can find.

Cheers!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline mattinker

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #30 on: November 28, 2016, 01:01:24 PM »
I don't have many friends from when I left, it was thirty seven years age!

All the best, Matthew

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #31 on: November 28, 2016, 05:35:40 PM »
Ohhhhh, I thought it was more recent than that? No idea why.... just me getting the wrong end of the stick...  :zap:

Anyway... I spent most of the day (when I should have been working on the day job) slaving over a hot* calculator, and I figure I can insulate the whole office, sides & roof, with 50mm rockwool (100mm on the roof) for about £250 quid, minus the VAT which I can reclaim. So TBH I'll probably go down that route, it's not too bad an expense, and the company will deliver it all to site which saves any faffing about. And most of the rockwool will simply squeeze between the studs, there should only be a little bit of cutting involved, e.g. around the window, and where the stud spacing has been "tweaked" for various reasons.


* No pun intended...
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline mattinker

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2016, 05:52:02 PM »
50cm is what's used on internal walls for sound proofing! Did you work out what expanded polyurethane foam would have cost? Eight centimetres on my roof is supposed to be the equivalent of twenty centimetres of fibreglass wool!

Cheers, Matthew.

Offline howsitwork?

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2016, 05:01:01 PM »
Ade

unless you want to itch from Now until Christmas buy / beg a tyvec suit and wear the damn thing whilst installing the rockwool :bugeye:

I also recommend buying some hydrocortisone 1% cream ready for afterwards. Tell em it's for a rash ( it will be).

Have fun in USA before they wall up.

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2016, 05:53:09 PM »
♪ ♫ On top of spag-♫EEEEEEEHHHHHHH♪-tiii, all covered in cheese! ♪ ♫  :lol:



Some of the plasterboard was sagging a bit where the joints didn't meet the joists... So, I threw together a couple of right-angled bits of OSB (handy things, mitre saws...). then clambered up onto the roof & nailed it into place (air-powered staple gun, yeaah). That done, I could return to ground level & screw the plasterboard up to the new wooden support. Which has nicely cured the bowing.

It's quite a long way down from up here...



A fairly alarming building wobble was cured with some wooden wedges (pics next time). Fitted and fettled the front door into place. Thank goodness for electric planers... as I accidentally forgot to allow for the carpet clearance.... Couldn't be bothered moving the hinges & top of the door frame...

No more pics (I forgot, and they're boring anyway).... next jobs are to fit insulation & walls...
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #35 on: December 18, 2016, 07:35:08 PM »
A bit of weekendus interruptus this time, Dad - at the tender age of 70 - is getting hitched again, so Saturday evening was his stag do.... beer & curry = little forward office progress... Sunday morning, of course, being "recover from hangover" time. Fortunately the advanced age of most of the participants kept table dancing to a minimum, and usefully disguised my appallingly low tolerance for alcohol since I hardly ever drink these days. Anyway... I managed to finish off boarding up the ceiling, added noggins between almost all of the studs, added a couple more braces to hold the walls solidly to the building, and made a few more "things" to hold the ceiling boards up where the joints don't line up with the joists...

Speaking of which, this is they:



3 "brackets" made of 2x2 cheap'n'nasty wood (acquired for free from a friend) & cut on the mitre saw, stapled to some OSB offcuts. These are then stapled to the joists, thus:



And then the plasterboard below is screwed up into the flat bit, which brings the ceiling nice and level (ish) ready for a skim. The air-powered staple/nail gun is one of the most useful woodworking tools I've got... it's handy for sticking carpet tiles down to a wooden floor as well  :thumbup: If I recall correctly, a snip at £20 or £30 from Aldi. Or Lidl. One of them.

Last job of the day was to get the first corner wall up. I'm using OSB here, because I will be screwing lots of those little storage draw cabinet things, all full of electronic components, to the wall in this corner; this being where the electronics work will take place. Once again, the nailgun came into its own here, and the plasterboard lift usefully held it in position while the first few nails were shot in. The plasterboard will have to be screwed to the wood, the nailgun is far too vigorous for such a feeble material.



Now there really isn't a whole lot more I can get done before the insulation arrives... which may well be after Christmas now... so I can't bore you with any more woodwork pictures until then  :beer: :wave:

In next week month's exciting episode:
  • How to get rockwool insulation behind an 8ft board, without falling down a 10 foot sheer drop!
  • The best way to extricate oneself from a 10 foot sheer drop onto sharp and jaggy things without severing an artery!
  • Making square holes for sockets in plasterboard, yeah baby
  • ....and more!

 :thumbup:

PS: No spirit levels were harmed, or even consulted, during this construction project!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #36 on: December 19, 2016, 02:44:24 AM »
Ade, an ordinary Stanley Knife will cut your square plasterboard holes nicely, or if you want an excuse to buy a new tool Google Rotazip
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #37 on: December 19, 2016, 04:46:16 AM »
I bought a Ryobi Multi-tool a couple of weeks back, that chops through plasterboard PDQ. Unfortunately, it's hopeless at going through OSB... fortunately I have jigsaws and drills for that. I do plan to have many sockets on the electronics wall, I have a row of 10 (or maybe 12, I forget now) in my existing office, and even that isn't enough!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline mattinker

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #38 on: December 19, 2016, 05:20:59 AM »
Plaster is surprisingly abrasive!

Regards, Matthew

Offline PekkaNF

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #39 on: December 19, 2016, 07:40:51 AM »
Are your junction boxes square like in USA or round like some parts in europe?
http://media.taloon.com/image/upload/q_70,f_auto,w_1200,h_1200,c_limit/cloud/k/ensto/1152303.jpg

Round ones are nice on that respect that holesaw makes it easy and tidy. Alhough I mus say that I made a jig for multihole models. Alhough you can use that throw away blue dust shield to trace outside and mark centres:
http://media.taloon.com/image/upload/q_70,f_auto,w_1200,h_1200,c_limit/cloud/k/ensto/1152389.jpg

Wiring is pretty nice when prior sheeting, best to plan ahead. After wall plates are done.....it is a pain.

Pekka

Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #40 on: December 19, 2016, 09:40:37 AM »
Ade, for lots of sockets in a small space I use  the distribution strips used in server cabinets. (Not to be confused with the 4 way rubber domestic ones).
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline micktoon

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #41 on: December 19, 2016, 07:46:10 PM »
Ade, for the square holes in plaster board, after marking off, I would just drill say 20mm hole with spade bit then small pad saw is neat and quick and only a couple of quid too  :thumbup:

 Cheers Mick

Offline David Jupp

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #42 on: December 20, 2016, 11:18:49 AM »
Plastic 3 compartment trunking isn't cheap, but does make the wiring of sockets (and subsequent alterations) very simple.  You can also run phone and Ethernet cables inside.  just a thought.

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #43 on: December 21, 2016, 03:53:06 PM »
Thanks for all the suggestions chaps  :thumbup:

I have a padsaw, and the multi-tool, and the air-powered reciprocating saw (like a jigsaw really, only shorter) for the plasterboard. So that won't be a problem.

For the OSB, drill and jig-saw or the air saw should be fine. The air saw is a bit slower than the jig saw having finer teeth, but I reckon that could be solved by sticking a jigsaw blade in it ;)

Andrew- i already have a few strips like that, a couple of 12-ways and at least one 10-way... but they're ugly and stick 2" out from the wall (before plugs). I'd like this place to look a bit classy at least, so I'll be going with flat double-gang sockets & lots of them. Possibly in black Nickel finish :D I don't mind spending some extra time cutting holes, and I think the end result will be worth the hassle.
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline howsitwork?

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #44 on: December 26, 2016, 02:53:59 PM »
Ade

merry Christmas and a Relaxed New Year ! :beer:

For rockwool- tie the damn stuff there with bailer band (polypropylene string very strong and available in vast lengths cheaply via your local farmers supplier. ) Drop it from the top of the office into the cavity and tie to the uprights with bailer band. Don't forget the Tyvak undergarments mind you or the itch will surely get you. Oh and wash your hands before dashing outside for a leak . :bugeye:

Ps whilst up there might be an idea to lay and staple some thick polythene sheeting over all that OSB and joists just in case of water leaks ?

Have fun

Ian

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #45 on: December 26, 2016, 04:07:32 PM »
Hi Ian,

Thanks - same to you  :beer:

As the insulation is going to be a while before it's delivered, and due to impatience on my part, I've decided to crack on with cladding the walls, and I'll figure out the insulation later...

Anyway, a few hours work tonight and it's starting to look a little more like a room and less like a skeleton:





Hmm, maybe not in all directions though...



I'm running out of plasterboard again, so another pain-inducing trip to Wickes is in the offing... well, unless I can persuade them to deliver  :wack:

Meanwhile... the Wall of Power is up  :lol:



I'll replace one of those double sockets with network points... but that'll still leave 24 power outlets, should be enough to cope with my electronics bench. There's a few more to go on the other wall too... Went with white ones because they were literally 1/4 the price of the fancy ones; but I've got some chrome ones as well, they'll be hooked up to an uninterruptable power supply, so the computers (and whatever's plugged into them) will stay running even if there's a power cut.

Back at it tomorrow  :doh:
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #46 on: January 02, 2017, 07:54:43 AM »
Starting to look a bit more like a room now  :beer: Another couple of plasterboards will see the interior walls done, then there's just the outside front wall to cover. That will have to wait until Spring/Summer for various reasons.



The work benches are up on some temporary trestles, I wanted an idea of where to bring the water supply in for the coffee machine (got to get the basics right!  :lol:)



The pub games end of the room  :) Dartboard will go on the left-hand side of the short wall... beer tap on the right hand side...

Today I will finish the internal walls & start on the electrics, then everything grinds to a halt for months on end as I'll be spending most of my time in China for the next few months.
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline RobWilson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #47 on: January 02, 2017, 12:05:52 PM »
Coming along very nicely Ade  :thumbup:


Will you be having a grand opening?   ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,with bait and beer  :)



Rob.

Offline howsitwork?

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #48 on: January 04, 2017, 05:24:11 PM »
as I'll be spending most of my time in China for a few months" - bloody long way to go for a take away ? :lol: :lol: Don't they deliver down your way?

Looks really nice and very comfy. Where does the biccy barrel live though? :scratch:

Happy New Year

Ian

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #49 on: January 06, 2017, 10:08:15 AM »
Hi Rob,

You know what, that's not a bad idea.... what with one thing and another, the "grand opening" is likely to be sometime around Summer, we should have some homebrew beer ready by then (minimum estimated strength: 8%), and the lack of insulation will mean it's not unpleasantly cold  :thumbup: Now.... if I combine the grand opening with learning to do some casting, that'd give you a bit of an excuse to show up wouldn't it? No need to book a hotel, we can throw a mattress on the pool table  :lol: :lol:
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #50 on: January 06, 2017, 10:10:27 AM »
as I'll be spending most of my time in China for a few months" - bloody long way to go for a take away ? :lol: :lol: Don't they deliver down your way?

Looks really nice and very comfy. Where does the biccy barrel live though? :scratch:


The China thing is a long story.... briefly hinted at elsewhere. I was hoping for a delivery just before Christmas, but UK Immigration put the kybosh on that, so I have to collect instead ;)

The biscuit barrel (or 205l drum, as it's more commonly mistaken for) will find a home, don't you worry! Although with luck, the homebrew beer on tap will reduce biscuit cravings due to unconsciousness  :lol:
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #51 on: January 06, 2017, 10:45:48 AM »
One of the things I want to do with this office is have an uninterruptable power supply on all of the computers & network gear. I got lucky and bought about £1000's worth of APC UPS on ebay for £50 a couple of years ago. The front panel is missing, but it works just fine, and will run 2 servers, all of the network gubbins, and my desktop computer, for about 4 hours before the battery goes flat.

Anyway, as anyone who's ever owned an APC UPS will know, they use a C14 female connector on the back, and a "special" C14 male to C13 female power lead (C13 = standard 3-pin kettle lead, C14 = the socket version of a kettle lead). Rather than having untidy power leads trailing around to the various points where I want uninterrupted power... I've decided to wire the wall plugs to the UPS. But one day, the UPS will need replacing (or bypassing), so how to do this in a tidy manner?

Answer: Buy a wall plate with a C13 male socket on it. Problem: They don't exist! Well, almost, one company sells such a thing, and it's clearly a 50p C13 socket screwed into a 50p blanking plate, for which they charge the tidy sum of £13. It's also only available in white, and one plug per single-gang faceplate.



I want four sockets on a single 2-gang faceplate.

So... break out CamBam, and before you know it:



These days, they do fancy dancin' "screwless" faceplates... which are just a faceplate, with another one clipped over the top. By being crafty with the machining order, I can cut the holes in both outer plate & inner plate, but only cut the screw holes in the inner plate (see what I did there  :dremel:), so I SHOULD end up with a nice satin chrome plate, with 4 C13 plugs showing, and no visible screws holding them in place  :thumbup:

Isn't it amazing, the lengths we'll go to to avoid actually finishing a project?  :palm: :lol:

Anyway, the upshot of that will be, I'll be able to use standard UPS leads from the unit to the wall, then that will be structured cable to the wall sockets. And if the UPS fails, I just bypass it with standard kettle leads. Hopefully, pictures tomorrow :)
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline RobWilson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #52 on: January 06, 2017, 11:30:41 AM »
Hi Rob,

 No need to book a hotel, we can throw a mattress on the pool table  :lol: :lol:

Now how can a bloke refuse an off like that Ade,   :lol:  around June the 12th is good for me, as I am off work and the wife is away that week.    :thumbup: 

I am pondering a trip to the Isle of Man, maybe I could combine the two, Booking.com says your pool table is available that week.    :lol:


Rob

Offline DMIOM

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #53 on: January 06, 2017, 01:52:52 PM »
Hi Rob,

 No need to book a hotel, we can throw a mattress on the pool table  :lol: :lol:

Now how can a bloke refuse an off like that Ade,   :lol:  around June the 12th is good for me, as I am off work and the wife is away that week.    :thumbup: 

I am pondering a trip to the Isle of Man, maybe I could combine the two, Booking.com says your pool table is available that week.    :lol:


Rob

Better still, bring Ade over to IOM with you !

 :beer:   :beer:   :beer:

Dave

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #54 on: January 06, 2017, 02:26:13 PM »
Hmmm.... very VERY tempting....

I haven't been to the IOM for years, came over a while back with the race car (we had a race at Jurby)... unforgettable memory: Our "nominated driver" (while we were getting leathered at various pubs on the front in Douglas) decided his ancient Sherpa van was ripe for a drag race with........ a horse tram! The lights went green, he nailed it, and the horse sh*t itself (poor thing). The look on the driver's face (and the horse's for that matter) were priceless....

Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #55 on: January 07, 2017, 01:04:27 PM »
Wayhey! I finally get to stop messing about with plasterboard and wood, and do some real machining for the office!! Woo!

OK, it's only a little TINY bit of machining, but even so, it's a good excuse to make sure the old CNC machine is still working (it is  :ddb:).

So, take one shiny new blanking plate, and screw to a piece of sacrificial wood. Clip decorative plate to the top. Those clips are pretty sturdy, they'll stand up to the machining forces I'm sure:



Urgh, maybe not....



The cutter bit a little hard, the feed rate was a little high, and those "sturdy" clips got ruined. Oh well, lucky I bought 2 (just in case one got messed up...).

Second setup with some bodged up ali clamps to hold the decorative bit down, there's paper underneath to preserve the finish. Slowed the feed rate waaay down, and all went well:



A few seconds with the file had the holes cleaned right up. Then, the same ops on the actual blanking plate underneath. I'd hoped this would be  a nice flat plate, but it isn't, it's got a weird shape pressed into it. Never mind, I can just squeeze everything in where I want it. So here's the finished article - note the minor "bodge" required to one of the plugs, to fit around the shape:



Of course, if I'd actually managed to hit the centre of the plate, instead of somehow being 2.5mm off in both X & Y, then I wouldn't have had that problem. Hey ho, maybe next time. This one's going to be tucked away under a bench anyway, so it's not like it's going to be in yer face.

So, one 4-way IEC C14 male plug on a 2-gang wall plate, looking pretty tidy:







Lessons for the next one:
- Measure the actual plugs, don't go by the drawings. The plug cutouts are actually slightly oversized.
- Don't rely on clips for clamping.
- Hit the bloody middle!

There's only one remaining conundrum... do I mount it vertically or horizontally?  :scratch:
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline John Stevenson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #56 on: January 07, 2017, 01:12:54 PM »
Horizontally.

The Yanks mount theirs vertically with the result the plugs always fall out.

I'm certain Capricorn One was for real.
John Stevenson

Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #57 on: January 07, 2017, 02:26:53 PM »
Glad the Interact survived the move  :thumbup:

Odd to need four individual inputs Ade - at least I hope that they are individual inputs or someone is going to have a shock  :bugeye:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline philf

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #58 on: January 07, 2017, 05:24:47 PM »
Odd to need four individual inputs Ade - at least I hope that they are individual inputs or someone is going to have a shock  :bugeye:

I thought the same but thought I must be missing something.  :zap:

Phil.
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #59 on: January 07, 2017, 05:37:48 PM »
Phil, I think we have our answer in Ade's post #51  :scratch:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #60 on: January 08, 2017, 04:02:36 AM »
It'll all be a bit more obvious in pictures... but basically the UPS has 2 banks of outputs, to get the full rated load capacity the outputs should be shared between them. Why four plugs - well, I plan to wire them as spurs rather than a ring, so I'll wire each block of wall sockets to an individual plug. It's probably overkill (I could have put just 2 plugs in and got the same effect), but what the heck. The plugs only cost 60p and the milling time is free  :loco:

Oh, Andrew - the Interact hasn't been moved yet.... I'm still in 2 workshops  :Doh:
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #61 on: January 08, 2017, 06:07:29 PM »
The new workshop has a rat infestation  :doh: Sneaky bastards managed to slide the bait off the trap without tripping it... I've been told you can stick raisins to the traps, forcing the rat to yank at said raisin thus earning itself a broken neck. It's that or glue a piece of cheese to the damn thing!



Anyway... an explanation of the UPS/4-gang plug thingy....

By each desk, there's a block of 3 double sockets. I want these sockets to be fed from the UPS. so... the sockets will be wired up as a spur (they'll only be taking computer gear, no heavy loads), and the spur will head back to the backplate & one fo the plugs. 2 of these (2 desks), plus a pair of sockets for the network switches on their own spur, and finally however many sockets I need for the servers (4 probably, that'll cover the wireless network gear as well). Each spur goes back to its own socket.

On the back of the UPS are 8 outputs, arranged in 2 groups. Full power is only available if its split between the two groups; so 2 plugs will be connected to one group, and 2 will be connected to the other. Thus, hopefully, more-or-less balancing everything.

Here's the UPS plugged in (only got 2 proper cables at the moment, the others will turn up in due course I am sure):



The front panel got smashed when it was dropped, leaving just the control panel dangling on some cable. It's connected with, of all things, an RJ45 plug/socket; so I might just run a dedicated "network" wire around to the desk, and machine up a replacement front panel of my own design. Although that'll probably be the kiss of death for the UPS...



Around back, you can see the 8 protected outputs, and the chunky (14A) input/unprotected-outputs. Out of shot is a non-standard serial port, a USB port, and an auxiliary battery terminal. Last time I used this UPS, in my office, it would run the entire server cab (4 or 5 pizza-box servers as I recall, various networking gear etc.) for over an hour. That's plenty in my book; and it'll be under even less load this time. Batteries are readily available too, when the current ones inevitably pass on. I should even be able to boil a kettle with it.... provided I turn everything else off first!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline John Stevenson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #62 on: January 08, 2017, 07:01:58 PM »
You are not supposed to give mice and rats cheese, it's not good for them................
John Stevenson

Offline John Swift

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #63 on: January 08, 2017, 07:14:43 PM »
Hi Ade

we had a mouse problem 20 or  more years ago a
 I bought a few "little nipper " mouse traps from Rapid Hardware in liverpool
day 1 the mice didn't like the Chedder cheese
day 2 used peanuts and little bu..ers took the nuts without tripping the trap  :doh:
day 3 hot glued peanuts to trigger - success , three corpses and no more mice

so you glueing the bait to the trigger makes sence to me -
just don't catch your fingers in that rat trap - a mouse trap is bad enough

 John

Online PeterE

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #64 on: January 09, 2017, 01:28:38 AM »
A short while ago I had the same problem and thought it best to set up a trap. I heard the mouse/rat but was not able to see it. So I got a rat trap of the same type as on your picture. the result was the same, bait removed without releasing the trap.

Tried again with the same result. Got angry and then tied the bait to the trigger (I used a small piece of ham and cheese) with some sewing thread. Nice knot around the empty trigger and then some turns around the bait. The idea was to make sure the little bugger was caught out by the thread and pulled the whole trap with him as he snatched the bait.

Success - one down and in this case no more to go. It also turned out I used a way too big trap as the intruder was a mouse not a rat. Could that be the reason for why the bait is snatched? The mouse is too light (-footed) to trig the trap?

/Peter
Always at the edge of my abilities, too often beyond ;-)

Offline chipenter

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #65 on: January 09, 2017, 03:22:04 AM »
Penut butter worked for us the first one the trap disapeared , so we tied the trap to a brick and covered it to stop the cats getting to it , got 6 more 1 adult the rest babys .
Jeff

Offline RussellT

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #66 on: January 09, 2017, 06:17:10 AM »
I've caught a lot of mice over the last two years in the sail store at my sailing club.  The most unusual was catching one mouse in two traps.  It got its tail in one trap, dragged that about 8 feet to another and stuck its head in that one.

I've found cheese to be perfectly good as bait although people are often telling me I should use Mars Bar or Raisins or chocolate coated raisins.  I catch enough already without attracting more with luxury foods.  It helps if the cheese is hard and so is secure on the spike.

I have found that the famous misquote "Build a better mousetrap, and the world will beat a path to your door" is incorrect.  Mousetraps aren't all that good and quite often the bait is taken without catching the mouse - but they are adequately good.

I like the type Ade has got because they're easy to set without risking your fingers.  However the Little Nipper and its Rat Trap version have a platform which the rat/mouse has to put it's feet on which may in theory make them more effective.  I have both the types I've shown  below but I can't say that I've noticed one being more effective than the other.

I think the easiest way to increase your success rate is to set multiple traps.

Russell

Offline awemawson

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #67 on: January 09, 2017, 06:36:19 AM »
An office cat is the answer.

We have a continual onslaught from rats on the farm as there is a fair amount of animal feed about. Once the cat took up residence in a Portakabin with outside access the problem reduced markedly..
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Pete W.

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #68 on: January 09, 2017, 08:09:29 AM »
What do you think of this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABffYDM9EwU 
Best regards,

Pete W.

If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, you haven't seen the latest change-note!

Offline Jo

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #69 on: January 09, 2017, 01:51:30 PM »
I have used numerous traps: For large infestations I like the coke can (with peanut butter on it) on a spindle that can freely spin over a deep bucket of water that is designed to test their long term swimming skills, the water being deep enough that they cannot cheat and put their toes on the bottom. But normally I am lazy I use poison: they can come, eat what they like, then can go and sleep it off else where :coffee:

Long term the spinning coke can over the tank is good for a couple of weeks  :thumbup: Not sure what you can use for the duration of your planned honey moon  :bugeye:

Jo
So many engines to build and yet so little time.

Offline howsitwork?

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Re: Moving shop again (again)...
« Reply #70 on: January 12, 2017, 01:42:37 PM »
 for bait nutella takes some beating as they adore it. I put some in a deep bucket of water and they drown on route ! :jaw:

Discovered by accident as I put some old bottles in a deep bucket of water to soak labels off and over 2 days found 2 drowned rats. Now I just leave the old bottles in a deep bucket of water - it works just chuck the corpses out ever week or so.

« Last Edit: January 12, 2017, 02:58:05 PM by Brass_Machine »