Author Topic: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?  (Read 7490 times)

Offline PekkaNF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1818
  • Country: fi
How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« on: November 20, 2016, 04:40:54 AM »
Silly guestin, but needs to be asked.

Normally I just use a dab of clean straqight gear oil and paper/rug...but I gues not everybody does: I boug an very nice small two sided  cast iron lapping /surface plate. Left it on the trunck onf the car few hours and then took it inside. Next morning it has a sheen of rust on it. Took some oil and paper and cleaned, but then startted to think that I will use it irregularry and this one will be inside on one spare bedroom (my hobby room). Clear oil sent is not the chrismass sent that wife likes most.

So: How do you guys protect cast iron surface plates and measurement tools and still keep your hide inside of the premises?

I had a look on WD40 and it looks like it would leave waxy surface, that is great on hand tools, but not necessary on measuremet tools.

I had a look on camellia oil that I use for japanese wood working tools, but vegatable oils leave very hard surface when they oxidise.

Is there odor free anti aromatic and not the harmfull oil that can be cleaned easily without petrol and other antibedroom substances?

Actulally this surface plate is not anymore of the problem, but I'm going to lug tad under 100 kg of same sort of stuff little by little on that "clean hobbyroom" I have acclaimed and I don't wish to have to raise the "greasy iron" syndrome.

Thanks,
Pekka

Offline smiffy

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 91
  • Country: gb
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2016, 05:31:27 AM »
 I use this and find it good at rust prevention much better than wd40 Mike
http://www.workshopsupplies.co.uk/contents/en-uk/d274_sas_attack_universal_maintenance_spray.html

Offline PekkaNF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1818
  • Country: fi
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2016, 12:57:57 PM »
Not too happy with all those solvents.

I'm thinkking of more like lanolin or mineral oil, something "oil" that can be easily wiped on and then wiped out.

Pekka

Offline DavidA

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1167
  • Country: gb
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2016, 01:33:38 PM »
Pekka,

I think 'Finnigan's Wax Oil' used in the car trade is mostly lanolin.  It certainly works well as a rust preventer.

Dave.

Offline chipenter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 731
  • Country: gb
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2016, 02:44:29 PM »
Gear oil stinks thin machine oil dosn't I put a oily cloth on top and a wooden cover , or wax furniture polish works as well .
Jeff

Offline Will_D

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 479
  • Country: ie
    • National Homebrew Club of Ireland
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2016, 02:57:57 PM »
Depending on your age what about Vaseline?

Btw: KY Jelly is water based so that's a no-no
Engineer and Chemist to the NHC.ie
http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.ie/forum/

Offline Spurry

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 256
  • Country: gb
  • Norfolk, UK
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2016, 05:36:44 PM »
In my experience, WD40 stains the metal it is supposed to protect. I found some 'new' stuff ACF50 (http://www.acf-50.co.uk/acf-50.htm) which seems to be quite good. Time will tell, though.
Pete

Offline howsitwork?

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2016, 03:16:51 PM »
Pekka

Lanolin is OK but very sticky and will go rancid ( not a good thing when SWMBO is checking for the source of the smell!)

Why not use baby oil? This is just liquid paraffin with a bit of fragrance in it. It will coat, doesn't oxidise quickly, and remains slippy. You might get a few strange looks when you buy it depending upon what you say it's for.... :lol:

You could even use it to lubricate the lapping plate at a push ( no pun intended)

Ian

Offline PekkaNF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1818
  • Country: fi
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2016, 03:51:58 AM »
OK. lanolin is out then. Sales pitch was great.

I'll get liquid paraffin, baby oil or clean. That is pretty odourless and does dry hands and contaminate everything.

Those wonder chemicals could be fine for other ocassions, but hard to order airmail or any other ways.

Pekka

Offline Ed ke6bnl

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 24
  • Country: 00
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2016, 08:24:33 AM »
1950 Ford F1 streetrod
1968 ecotec powered Baja Bug kink coil overs
1953 Chevy AD ready for 4 cyl. cummins and nv4500

Offline PekkaNF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1818
  • Country: fi
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2016, 09:04:53 AM »
That is what I was talking about....
"This item does not ship to , Finland. Please check other sellers who may ship internationally. "

Pekka

Offline appletree

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 139
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2016, 09:35:33 AM »
For things like surface plates, drill chucks, lathe chucks and moderate sized items I mix 10% oil in Panel wipe cleaner (Basically a liquid in which oil dissolves) the solvent evaporates leaving a very thin layer of oil.
The items can be left, or placed in resealable plastic bags or as I do use an electric bag sealer.

Phil

Offline PekkaNF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1818
  • Country: fi
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2016, 12:29:08 PM »
For things like surface plates, drill chucks, lathe chucks and moderate sized items I mix 10% oil in Panel wipe cleaner (Basically a liquid in which oil dissolves) the solvent evaporates leaving a very thin layer of oil.
The items can be left, or placed in resealable plastic bags or as I do use an electric bag sealer.

Phil

That is an idea....so something like this?
http://gtechniq.com/products/auto/perfect/exterior/paint/panel-wipe
+ 10% of volume of mineral oil (liquid paraffin or such) and we are good to go?

On winter time there are plenty of nearly pure denaturated ethanol or IPA at discount prices, used as winshield washer liquid (-40C proof), could try that one out as a solvent. Nicer than stronger aromatic solvents.

I got a 0,5 l prettu pure liquid paraffin and a small bottle of baby oil, just got home and they are untested.

Now that you mentioned surface plate and I have cast iron one sorted - how about granite surface plate? I have used kitchen detergent (grease remover) this far. Recommendations? I have heard that alcohol/solvent ones cause cooling and therefor are not ideal...then again I don't have temperature controlled measurement lab and I can wait.

Pekka

Offline appletree

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 139
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2016, 12:58:41 PM »
Panel wipe is a rapid evaporating degreaser used to clean repaired automotive panels ready to repaint is is about 25 dearer that petrol in the uk as you say there are several solvers available. The idea came from my apprenticeship in the 70s we used to clean the Myford down this way each Friday the solvent used was paraffin.

Phil

Offline nrml

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 167
  • Country: gb
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2016, 04:09:06 PM »
For all non delicate tools / machines I use this http://www.bilthamber.com/corrosion-protection-and-rust-treatments/dynax-uc

For more delicate items where I am likely to want to wipe it clean before using : http://www.acf-50.co.uk/motorcycle/streetbike.htm

I initially bought the ACF50 for use on my motor bike, but I now use it for almost everything I used WD40 for before. It is a bit more expensive but a little goes a long way and it doesn't need reapplication often. I am not too worried about the solvents in ACF50. It doesn't seem to harm the plastics, composites and alloys on my motorcycle and it was developed for use in the aerospace industry where damage to materials would be an absolute non no. I use WD40 is now mainly as a cutting fluid for aluminium these days.

Offline Biggles

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 215
  • Country: gb
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2016, 10:37:59 PM »
I found Anchor Wax dose the job. When dry it leaves a thin clear film of wax which protects the metal. I think it is also used on boats to protect metal parts. http://www.morrislubricants.co.uk/ankor-wax-preservative-fluid.html  :coffee:

Offline PekkaNF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1818
  • Country: fi
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2016, 07:43:37 AM »
Thank you

Bilt Haber seems te popular here too, some shops sell it. I might even buy one.

ACF50 is mildly interesting...probably resides in same ecological niche than WD40 (slightly scented, slightly usefull, much hyped). Haven't seen it in the selves here and it does not seem to be readily shipped to another country.

Anyway I tried liquid parafin and unsented baby oil. Both seem to work well. Only snag was that when I used paper towel to clean/oil surface of the chekered lapping plate, sharp grooves shred the paper and I need a nylon brush to clean that out. Also looked like some of the blue has found it way into this lapping side, but I don't think it really matters, probably will be repeated again soon.

Might try home cooked mix of alcohol (or IPA) and oil on misting bottle.

Pekka

Offline Cymro

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 6
  • Country: wales
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2016, 09:48:37 AM »
For larger items (lathe beds, shaper tables etc) I use a mixture of lard, camphor and fine graphite powder. For smaller items (dividers, micrometers etc) I use yellow Vaseline rubbed on and rubbed off - just enough to leave a film.

I found the lard mixture recipe in a Victorian book on workshop practice - the camphor prevents the lard from turning rancid and also acts as an anti-rusting agent. The old machinists' chests used to have a little enclosure built in to keep camphor in as it's a known rust preventative.

And they all work . . .

If you ain't the lead dog, the scenery never changes . . .

Offline appletree

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 139
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2016, 12:01:09 PM »
Whilst looking for something else I came across a tin of a product which was recommended to me for use on woodworking machinery, I have yet to use it but could be useful.

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&sqi=2&ved=0ahUKEwjNycmArb_QAhUMOsAKHWiuAt4QFggvMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.axminster.co.uk%2Fliberon-lubricating-wax-ax22593&usg=AFQjCNH2qGTlLedCNShOjLvbWViSgveiZQ&bvm=bv.139782543,d.ZGg
Phil

Offline Lew_Merrick_PE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 662
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2016, 01:41:54 PM »
I've been watching this "thread" for a while.  My two cents worth -- (1) tools such as squares, scales, and the like get "clothed down" with carnuba wax with great regularity (call it once a month);  (2) tools such as dial indicators, micrometers, and the like get (A) stored in tightly closing wooden boxes with (B) a "cloth stoppered" vial of a (1/3rd each) mixture of oil of wintergreen (penetrent/dispersent), light mineral oil, and acetone; (3) tools such as files, scrapers, and gravers get cleaned and dried before being stored in (powdered) railroad chalk;  (4) all my "metal table surface" get will cleaned with solvent, light machine oil, and (again) with solvent and polished with carnuba wax (call it monthly).

I live in western Washington State (which used to be called "The Soviet of Washington") where "rust" is considered a camouflage color.

Offline awemawson

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5554
  • Country: gb
  • East Sussex, UK
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2016, 02:01:04 PM »
We are in a low lying shallow valley - in fact a flood plain. Regularly when I get up in the morning at certain times of the year, there is a thick layer of mist hovering above the ground so dense you can't see the sheep.

And yet my machines and measuring equipment in the main workshop  don't rust. Why ?


















... I heat the workshop - daytime 18 deg C and 8 deg C over night. Works for me  :ddb:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline PekkaNF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1818
  • Country: fi
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2016, 02:33:46 PM »
Now this is getting interesting after people tell what they use and why.

I enjoyed answers.

My primary motivation here is that Swimbo let me have one bedroom for measurement and other clean stuff.

Garage is somewhat warm too.

Problem is that outdoor is not heated and here it is half half a time very humid and cold or freezing. When I lug stuff between garage and house stuff tends to cool and moisture condensates. Small parts can be put on zip bags and/or sealed plastic box. This does not really work on big stuff.

Pekka

Offline Lew_Merrick_PE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 662
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2016, 04:00:33 PM »
Pekka -- My "trick" with steel parts when they either need to be stored or shipped is to (A) wax them, (B) give them a light coat of WD-40 (where the "WD" stands for "Water Displacing"), and (C) wrap them in "cling wrap" (food wrap -- common here in the U.S. under the "Saran" brand name) and then wrap that in either newspapers or rags (depending on the ultimate "task").

Offline ieezitin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 676
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2016, 06:28:38 PM »
camphor is in Vicks vapor rub so is Vaseline i believe.. interesting,,,, 
If you cant fix it, get another hobby.

Offline Ed ke6bnl

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 24
  • Country: 00
Re: How to prevent rust in measurement equipment?
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2016, 06:35:25 PM »
here is one that has proven itself for the last year, although I live in a very dry environment of So. california, long story short, I used HCl in the garage and a few days later my entire buggy tube frame went from shiny steel to a  surface rust frame.  I sanded it down and used some evaporusts rust-block and to my amazement there is no rust for over a year.
https://www.amazon.com/Evapo-Rust-RB015-Rust-Inhibitor-oz/dp/B0037ZAJ88
I have nothing to do with the company, I just was trying all forms of rust removal from electroylisis to vinager then tried some evaporust on some garage sale milling bits find and I put them in an old crock pot from my wife. heated it with the parts covered with evaporust and in less then a half hour they were derusted, they were not terrible just surface rust. This seems to be working better then the fluid film I am also using. I am sold on this product.
1950 Ford F1 streetrod
1968 ecotec powered Baja Bug kink coil overs
1953 Chevy AD ready for 4 cyl. cummins and nv4500