Author Topic: Another homemade milling machine  (Read 3054 times)

Offline shipto

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Another homemade milling machine
« on: March 12, 2017, 04:31:44 PM »
Since I have allowed this to get in the way of other stuff I should be doing I thought I would start the thread.
I have wanted a mill for a long time and despite following searches for one close to to me I havent been able to find one thats the right size, the right money or combination of those.
pic 1) Is a bit of 150mm X 100mm x 5mm wall box section that was left over from a one off job at work which I have held onto for years with bits for my origional idea for knee slide welded on.
pic 2) It needs some holes for mounting it on the lathe for facing etc. These will probably be no use other than increasing the rigidity after it has been machined so I will just put some caps over them.
pic 3) I want to be able to move the head up and down to allow drilling operations so this pad will have the dovetail for that bolted to it. If all goes to plan I will be able to get rid of the terrible drill press I have.
pic 4) Finally for now the discussed (in the design shop) bit to allow future use as a horizontal mill and a extra clamping hole.
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2017, 06:45:35 PM »
So first post was all pics taken at work and after I had finished trying to work out if I needed anything else on it I took it home and mounted it on my lathe so I could face of the bits that matter flat pic 1 and 2.
Another item I have been hoarding was aquired when our company brought out a failing competitor many years ago (missed out on a arbour press which was chucked while I was in between factories  :doh: ) Anyway it was a old solid cast iron bender capable of bending probably 8mm X 100mm flat with a big enough tube to pull it round. I used it a few times but it needed a permanent solid base and it wasnt useful enough to warrant the space. Now it may seem like sacrilege but I cut it up for this project and pic 3 shows a bit of it being turned into a dovetail guide for the head of the mill while pic 4 shows it in place.
As you can see the bandsaw at work struggled a little to cut it up but the mark will have no effect on the operation of the mill.
Not sure if theres a better way to check but pics 5 and 6 tell me its not bad at all for straightness.
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2017, 04:12:01 PM »
After much tedious machining with my lathe during which time I often thought really need a mill to do this  :doh: I have 3 of the bits for the knee slide sorted out the pic shows them in place but not yet fixed I am still mulling over how to ensure they are fixed on straight.
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Offline ieezitin

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2017, 04:57:36 PM »
Interesting... Very nice work, you will be rewarded well when its finished..

Anthony.
If you cant fix it, get another hobby.

Offline sparky961

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2017, 08:44:16 PM »
After much tedious machining with my lathe during which time I often thought really need a mill to do this  :doh: I have 3 of the bits for the knee slide sorted out the pic shows them in place but not yet fixed I am still mulling over how to ensure they are fixed on straight.

Are you trying to attach them by welding and have them come out straight/flat enough to use as ways?  I hate to sound like a doubter, but that's not likely to happen without some work post-welding.  Bolting, maybe... but not welding.

Maybe you should build a lathe.  It is said that's the only machine tool that can replicate itself.  :bang:

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2017, 09:30:43 PM »
No the slides are all cast iron so will be bolted onto the steel

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Offline sparky961

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2017, 10:04:37 PM »
Ah, yes you did mention that above.  My apologies.

For measuring flatness/parallelism, the best would be to set it up on a large surface plate, but you may not have access to that.

Can you set up an indicator to run on one side to check the alignment to the other?  If it isn't aligned, then you're probably going to need shim stock and tapping things around with a small plastic hammer to get it aligned.  Once you get it where you want it, you should drill for dowel pins (tapered, usually) to enable disassembly/reassembly and to make sure they stay where you put them.

Or, using a smaller surface plate (or other surface flat enough by your own standards) you can print it and scrape it flat.

There are a few ideas here, but I'm just kinda throwing them out there because I can't quite visualize exactly how you need to align things.

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2017, 04:32:36 AM »
Parralel between the head slides and the knee slides is my biggest concern if flatness became a issue I could sort that by skimming it as I did with the mounting points as above.

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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2017, 05:40:08 AM »
Ok I think I have it I am going to hold off doing anything with knee slides and get head slide finished and lapped in. Then once that's running nicely I can clock against the side of the upright which should get me straight enough. I can then use the top slide to set up the knee.
What could go wrong :)

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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2017, 05:17:16 PM »
Might be jumping the gun but my lovely wife brought me the collet set for it.
I actually want the one with a 80mm chuck but they had sold out of those so got me the 100mm for the same price.
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2017, 05:29:12 PM »
Wohay ..... keep that woman  :thumbup:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2017, 05:49:47 PM »
Wohay ..... keep that woman  :thumbup:
:lol: she going nowhere for some strange reason she seems to love me  :loco:
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2017, 06:21:59 PM »
Yet another job that needs milling  :doh:
I have almost done the head saddle but I need to mill out a recess to fit the rack that will let me use it as a drill.
The rack and pinion are from a drilling machine that went kaput at work and this is part of the bits I salvaged from it. Sometime pays to be a hoarder especially when you can hoard stuff at work  :lol:
I am going to have to think very carefully about my next steps because I would like a 3 speed milling head which will require sourcing or making 6 gears and if I am going to make them I will probably make a temporary head so I can use it to make them.
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Offline sparky961

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2017, 09:39:39 PM »
That lapping plate video from Tom Lipton you mentioned in another thread had him using a carbide tipped circular saw blade on cast iron.  I admit I was cringing a bit, but if that's all you have then have at 'er.

I recall one of my first "milling" projects, which was to "mill" out a slot in aluminum using a Dremel tool, cylindrical burr, and router base.  Very slow, but it did work.  I bet if you stuck a 1/8" carbide end mill into a rotary tool and took small depth cuts using a straight edge on either side as a guide you'd have it done pretty quickly.

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2017, 06:00:43 AM »
I dont need to resort to that sparky I can manage on my lathe it just seems ironic how many milling operations I am having to do with my lathe to make the mill and I havent even started the knee yet.

rather than new post I will put what little I have been able to do today on this one. Been making the wife some shelving for her greenhouse or STAGING as the know-it-all-father-in-law once told me its called but anyway I was going to use m3 bolts to fix the rack in but then thought why bother just make it fit in tight and it cant move anywhere so thats what I did.
Tomorrows task is to make a hole in the saddle to let the pinion mate with the rack in the right place.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2017, 03:57:28 PM by shipto »
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Offline vintageandclassicrepairs

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #15 on: March 25, 2017, 05:36:34 PM »
Hi Shipto,
Have you thought about using a VFD and 3phase motor rather than going to all the trouble making a gearbox and then only having three speeds ?
Another option would be variable pulleys ala Daf variomatic ? also used on most modern mopeds
you would need to be able to control the movement of the pulleys rather than the centrifugal(?) mechanism used on them
I have seen old motorcycle gearboxes used to provide usually four gears on "Mad Mod" machines  :scratch:

John

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2017, 06:30:35 PM »
A vfd would be nice but probably too expensive for me at the moment and to be honest I hadnt even considered the variomatic option I may look at that  :coffee:
However it wouldnt be just 3 speeds as my plan is to have a 4 or 5 speed stepped pulley running a quill which would then go to the 3 speed gearbox allowing up to 15 speeds. It will most likely have to have a temporary head setup to start as whatever I decide to do will be too difficult to do with the lathe and thus it will have to make its own final head setup.
I did think for a short while about using a 150w dc motor I have which came off a micro lathe but I think power would be a issue with that.
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Offline mexican jon

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2017, 07:53:12 PM »
A vfd would be nice but probably too expensive for me at the moment

I'll happily send you a brand new (ABB Part # ACS55-01E-02A2-2) 0.37KW / 1/2HP rated VFD if you got a motor to suit or even if you can get a motor easily  :beer: (I've got 1 or 2 from an old job)

I believe that anyone who is mad enough to build there own mill  :loco: deserves a little help  :thumbup:

People say you only live once ! I say thank F@*K can't afford to do it twice.

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2017, 09:28:25 PM »
A vfd would be nice but probably too expensive for me at the moment

I'll happily send you a brand new (ABB Part # ACS55-01E-02A2-2) 0.37KW / 1/2HP rated VFD if you got a motor to suit or even if you can get a motor easily  :beer: (I've got 1 or 2 from an old job)

I believe that anyone who is mad enough to build there own mill  :loco: deserves a little help  :thumbup:
:nrocks: sent a pm Jon thank you  :nrocks:
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Offline mexican jon

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #19 on: March 25, 2017, 09:58:45 PM »
Replied to your PM  :clap:
People say you only live once ! I say thank F@*K can't afford to do it twice.

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #20 on: March 26, 2017, 02:54:43 PM »
Due to the limitations of my milling fixture on my lathe I couldn't mill out the opening for the pinion so in a blatent misuse of handtools I cut it out with the jigsaw. I have made the shaft for it and put some nasty bits of metal to hold it in place. The reason for them being so long is that they will provide a shoulder for aligning the shaft I did think about cleaning them up but it would have been a vanity operation because once the spindle housing is on they will be hidden.
Ignore the other misuse of tools the tap wrench was handy to turn it and it runs up and down reasonably well, bit of a tight spot but its probably better than most drilling machines out there and given time it should wear in nicely which will do given that it will only be used like this for drilling. During milling operations it will be locked up and the knee will provide the adjustment up and down.
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Offline sparky961

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #21 on: March 26, 2017, 04:34:16 PM »
Misuse, or ingenuity?  I'll argue for the latter.  It always takes more skill to get things done with only the tools at hand.

It's an interesting project and thread.  I look forward to seeing it progress.

Offline awemawson

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #22 on: March 26, 2017, 04:39:25 PM »
In the tradition of the early English tool makers, make the first one, then use it to help make the next - that as a progression, should be an improvement.

'tis has ever been thus  :clap:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2017, 05:24:20 PM »
I have made a bit of progress. keep having to stop myself messing with the slide and reminding myself just how sloppy most drilling machines are but anyway I made a start on the fixtures for the head first off I worked out where the studs go and put them in along with the mounting plates for the rest of the head.
These two plates will form the basis of everything else relating to the head. I have drilled and tapped for the adjusters which I have circled in red and as you can see I have plenty of adjustment to get the head lined up left to right \ | / if everything goes anywhere near right I wont need anywhere near as much adjustment as I have available.
I also took a pic of the X,Y table which seeing as this was done before I started the body I should have pictured before but anyway it has the base from a cheapo XY table that has been discussed on these forums before but I did some work on it and changed the screw to a 1mm pitch and it seems pretty good now. The other axis is bits from the very first lathe I had a clarke 300?? I will go into that in a bit more detail later in the thread.
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #24 on: March 31, 2017, 03:39:07 PM »
got the bit together for the head drilled holes in them and used a bit of 12mm threaded bar to hold everything in place while I welded it all up. Just need to clean it all up tomorrow and maybe get the riffler on the corners because I forgot to leave room for a weld when I drilled the mounting holes.
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #25 on: April 01, 2017, 02:35:50 PM »
Today I started on machining the head but I had to cut a extra bit out of it to fit to the four jaw chuck, just goes to show no matter what you have its not enough my 4 jaw is 10" and when I got it off my uncle I thought it would be plenty for anything I would ever want to do in fact I think I am going to have to resort to the 14" faceplate to machine for the bearing in the top.
If I had tried without cutting the extra bit out the chuck would have been as shown in pic 2, not good but took a action shot of the first drill 25mm and finally the end result is a space where the bearing and a oil seal I ordered today will sit.
Tomorrow I am going to attempt the hard job of lining it all up to do the top bearing as i said probably on the faceplate.
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #26 on: April 01, 2017, 02:58:47 PM »
In my experience NOTHING is big enough for everything you need to do - it's just the way of home shop workshops  :(

This is particularly true of floor area and shelf space  :lol:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #27 on: April 02, 2017, 01:53:02 PM »
I managed to get the other side lined up, machined and get the bearing shells fitted however after I had put the last one in I remembered something. I should have made a way to get them out again if I ever need to  :doh:
Too late now however so fingers crossed it all goes to plan or the head will have to be remade unless anyone has any ideas?
Now for the bit I have been dreading the spindle.
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Offline vintageandclassicrepairs

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #28 on: April 02, 2017, 02:18:40 PM »
Hi Shipto,
A run of weld around the inside of the bearing rings will shrink them when they cool
the rings then usually fall out
That or tack a strap across the old race and drift from the far end

John

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #29 on: April 02, 2017, 02:24:30 PM »
excellent suggestions John now I think about it a disc tacked to it would do great.
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Offline mexican jon

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #30 on: April 02, 2017, 04:44:12 PM »
I"m with John  :scratch: on the run a bead of weld around the bearing shell and they just drop out  :ddb:
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Offline Houtenkrullen

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #31 on: April 06, 2017, 06:03:18 AM »
Another option would be variable pulleys ala Daf variomatic ? also used on most modern mopeds
you would need to be able to control the movement of the pulleys rather than the centrifugal(?) mechanism used on them

If you are interested to use the moving pulleys idea, I am overhauling an old flott drill press that uses just that. I could send you a parts diagram and some pictures if they would be of any use for inspiration?

I am following your thread in awe...
I am not brave enough to start a machine build from scratch, but you seem to be doing just fine

Peter

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #32 on: April 06, 2017, 03:00:41 PM »
Another option would be variable pulleys ala Daf variomatic ? also used on most modern mopeds
you would need to be able to control the movement of the pulleys rather than the centrifugal(?) mechanism used on them

If you are interested to use the moving pulleys idea, I am overhauling an old flott drill press that uses just that. I could send you a parts diagram and some pictures if they would be of any use for inspiration?

I am following your thread in awe...
I am not brave enough to start a machine build from scratch, but you seem to be doing just fine

Peter
Thank you for the offer Peter but I have a inverter coming thanks to Mexican Jon and so the machine will at least in the first place will be directly driven.
As for building the machine I just kept bits for ages before starting then jumped in two footed, I have made mistakes even in the very little I have done so far wait till you see the latest one which I will take pics of tomorrow actually not tomorrow me and wife are going to see mrs browns boys so saturday its a real  :doh:
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2017, 04:23:02 PM »
Well here in pic1 is the latest mistake It wasnt till I had welded the flang on, cleaned it up and centered each side that I set it up and did a cut along the length and I noticed it had been cut half way through  :doh: cant even remember what I started to cut it for.

Well went back to my bits of steel and started again and pic 2 is the result. I am very pleased with it this is the first time I have cut a thread and made nuts to suit which is where I was at the end of today and apart from my parting tool of sorts breaking part way through meaning I had to finish it on the donkey saw even this went reasonably well.
I still have to clean up the nut and cut the lock nut off the bar which is the job for tomorrow.
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Offline hermetic

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #34 on: April 09, 2017, 05:10:20 PM »
 Nice work Shipto!

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #35 on: April 10, 2017, 03:36:49 PM »
So today I finished the nuts and gave the head a lick of paint, I chose black because, well its was either that or white no expence spent  :lol:
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #36 on: April 11, 2017, 04:45:38 PM »
fitted the shaft and I am really chuffed with it rotated image so it in the right orientation just need to make a housing for the top seal but its got to have a channel for the grease nipple.
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #37 on: April 14, 2017, 03:28:40 PM »
Seal housing is made and fitted and head is fitted to slide. Drilled the housing at a slight angle so the grease is delivered just under the lip of the seal.
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Offline krv3000

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #38 on: April 14, 2017, 07:07:35 PM »
shaping up nice

Online PekkaNF

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #39 on: April 15, 2017, 01:55:08 AM »
Very interesting project. I'm cheking this one out every day!

I see you go exremes....but did you have to mount the lathe on the wall!

Pekka

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #40 on: April 15, 2017, 03:58:52 AM »
 :lol: have you never heard of the Harrison 14 wall mount lathe?  :lol:
Actually I need to lock the head up to get it turned upright at the moment I am still trying to decide how to keep the head in the top position the options I have concidered so far are springs in various configurations, gas struts or probably my favourite right now counter balance system where some weight is connected over some pulleys to hang down at the back of the upright.
Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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Online PekkaNF

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #41 on: April 15, 2017, 04:37:24 AM »
Nope. First time ever. I swear.

About the counterbalance....that must work:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/elliott%20mini%20jig/index.html

Pekka

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #42 on: April 15, 2017, 05:43:43 AM »
Nope. First time ever. I swear.

About the counterbalance....that must work:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/elliott%20mini%20jig/index.html

Pekka
Yes that one they have the weights inside the upright which is a good idea but may not be possible in mine due to the supports I have welded inside but maybe if I put a couple of tubes down the sides the weights could travel inside them  :coffee: still have to decide if I should fill the body with concrete yet however. The main upright is quite a substantial bit of box section with 5mm walls but it may still have some flex.
Actually another idea comes to mind I could just put a guard on the back to cover the weights and leave the inside clear.
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Offline kayzed1

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #43 on: April 15, 2017, 04:47:28 PM »
You could put the tubes down for the weights and then infill around them. :beer:

Online PekkaNF

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #44 on: April 16, 2017, 10:50:32 AM »
.. :coffee: still have to decide if I should fill the body with concrete yet however. The main upright is quite a substantial bit of box section with 5mm walls but it may still have some flex.

Concrete sucks inside the steel shell...concrete shrinks and when it shrinks it delaminates from the skin fron that on it's just dead weight. If you consider that: read the Bamberg's paper.

It's all very good reading, but this is best short story I could find of it from interweb:
http://www.mech.utah.edu/~bamberg/research/ConcreteCastDamper/concreteCastDamper.html


Actually another idea comes to mind I could just put a guard on the back to cover the weights and leave the inside clear.

Best of all. You can can go trough iterations and finalize the weight.

Pekka

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #45 on: April 16, 2017, 05:53:39 PM »
If thats the case I guess I am going to have to hope it doesnt need anything, that viscoelastic stuff looks complicated and probably expensive.
I wish I had put more diagonal supports in before I welded the bottom on now but I guess I am not going to know for sure until its up and running and making swarf.
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Offline DaveS

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #46 on: April 17, 2017, 05:47:15 AM »
It's looking good Shipto :beer:
Counterbalance weights are a well tried and tested method and can be fine tuned but I would suggest using bicycle chain and not Brass machine's latest (and good looking chain mail)  :nrocks:

Dave

Offline PK

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #47 on: April 17, 2017, 07:31:21 AM »
Sorry if I'm restating something, I've come to this thread late (It must be outside this 'box' thing they keep telling me about)
Here's my take on a torsionally rigid mill column.
http://caswa.com/cncathome/X3.html
Scroll down about 2/3rds

I like the idea of filling with concrete. Adding mass is one of the simplest things you can do to a small machine to improve it.......

PK

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #48 on: April 17, 2017, 05:36:02 PM »


I like the idea of filling with concrete. Adding mass is one of the simplest things you can do to a small machine to improve it.......

PK
I do too but Pekka disagrees and I see his point about shrinkage. However upon doing some extra reading it seems that most of the shrinkage comes from adding more water than is needed to make the concrete move better it seems that if the added water is calculated correctly then little shrinkage occurs but the mix is extremely thick. Will have to look into it a bit more.
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Offline vintageandclassicrepairs

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #49 on: April 17, 2017, 06:38:16 PM »
Hi Shipto,
Research "epoxy" concrete as a filler,
There was a long discussion on it on the CNC forum some years ago

John

Offline AdeV

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #50 on: April 18, 2017, 12:05:28 AM »
Since it's only the weight you're after, and not the constructional qualities, why not just use a bag of sand? Seal the bottom as best you can, but leave a removable panel; pour sand in the top until desired weight is achieved - it'll find its own way past the internal structures obviously. Then, when you need to move the machine at a later date you can simply open the removable panel and let the sand out...

The only thing you need to be sure of is that the sand is bone dry before you pour it in, wet sand will cause untold rustiness...
Cheers!
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2017, 02:18:34 AM »
If it's a closed box structure i.e. No holes for stuff to flow out, dry sand or pea shingle will work just as effectively as concrete, and will settle into a dense packing over time. Also in extremiss it can be removed if you make a suitable plugged hole in the base.
Andrew Mawson
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Online PekkaNF

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #52 on: April 18, 2017, 03:26:57 AM »


I like the idea of filling with concrete. Adding mass is one of the simplest things you can do to a small machine to improve it.......

PK
I do too but Pekka disagrees and I see his point about shrinkage. However upon doing some extra reading it seems that most of the shrinkage comes from adding more water than is needed to make the concrete move better it seems that if the added water is calculated correctly then little shrinkage occurs but the mix is extremely thick. Will have to look into it a bit more.

The thing is that concrete shrinks for 400 years. First faster and then slower. Many factors affect on shrink rate and some you have influence and some not.

Worst shape for concrete "filled machine" is a hollow thin steel section that you fill with concrete...some machine manufacturers tried this -70/80:s and failed. Concrete filling will shrink in time and delaminate from the skin...if you weld rebar to avoid that it will pull the skin out of alingnment. There are ways to reduce the shrink rate or compensate it, but it will not work in machine building scale.

You can make a servisable machine if you know what you are doing. Basically you cast more or less square section, no voids in it, you may cast some features to it. You don't need rebar and other "iron" on it, unless you have hanging beam or such bad idea. And then let it cure and age some time - longer the better. Then use this cast as a sandwitch between steel members and have it on compression. You must use epoxy concrete, injection epoxy or grind the concrete surface flat prior mechanically mounting the steel sructure to it.

Epoxy concrete works.

And as Andrew et.al. said sand or such will dampen "ringing" pretty well too, it's cheap, reversible and has all good qualities to home build.

Pekka

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #53 on: April 18, 2017, 05:13:57 AM »
What about a dry mix? www.precast.org

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Offline awemawson

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #54 on: April 18, 2017, 05:38:13 AM »
It will eventually harden from moisture in the air and you'll lose the advantage of being able to remove it.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #55 on: April 18, 2017, 06:07:15 AM »
Won't want to removed it there's nothing I need to do from inside. The only advantage of being able to remove it would be weight but once it's in place it would be my kids job to get rid of it 😃

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Online mattinker

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #56 on: April 18, 2017, 06:32:14 AM »
If you want weight only, lead!

Regards, Matthew

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #57 on: April 18, 2017, 06:42:16 AM »
It's not just weight it's helping rigidity too. However as I have said I won't make a decision until it's running and I have tested to see if it's needed, fingers crossed it won't need anything extra.

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Offline PK

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #58 on: April 18, 2017, 06:49:35 AM »
If you want weight only, lead!
In my experience....

Mass is the main advantage. Particularly on a small machine as it reduces the resonant frequency of the structure below the excitation frequency of the spindle+tooth count combination. 
This resonance (and some terrible engineering in the case of the X3 mills) is what causes the most grief, and it's why the 20KRPM Chinese spindles for chump change have revolutionised the CNC router business. They increase the excitation frequency above the resonant frequency of even the tiniest mill

But there are others.  When the structure is made up of parts of different densities, a portion of energy that travels through it as waves (rather than displacement/vibration) is reflected at each interface. This forces a portion of these waves to travel long paths and get absorbed by the substrate.

Offline awemawson

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #59 on: April 18, 2017, 07:53:09 AM »
Blimey PK that's a bit impressively technical  :bow:
Andrew Mawson
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Offline PK

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #60 on: April 18, 2017, 09:26:04 AM »
Blimey PK that's a bit impressively technical  :bow:
Yeah, sorry 'bout that. It was a big chunk of my PhD.... Buy me two beers and I can bore you to death with the numbers... Oh, and I've had two beers......

Online PekkaNF

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #61 on: April 18, 2017, 10:15:38 AM »
Blimey PK that's a bit impressively technical  :bow:
Yeah, sorry 'bout that. It was a big chunk of my PhD.... Buy me two beers and I can bore you to death with the numbers... Oh, and I've had two beers......

By all means. I'll get you drunk. Please tell more! I used go on trips with one professor, we hooked acceleration sensors and other transduces to measure vibration and find out excitation sources/sympathic frequences. Laymen had no idea how involved in real life it is.

And granules are different animals. We measured some of them too in one big machine...Big beam filled with sand or glassballs...So, which one is "better"? it all depends what is your question.

So...all this is pretty basic (from post #44):
http://www.mech.utah.edu/~bamberg/research/ConcreteCastDamper/concreteCastDamper.html

Everyone seriously considering should least read this:
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/5487/82f4c63376150991dd323d0ef15a7da2fee8.pdf

At this phase of this project it's all pretty academic and best to forge forward.

Pekka

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #62 on: April 18, 2017, 01:28:29 PM »

At this phase of this project it's all pretty academic and best to forge forward.

Pekka
I agree I didnt intend it to get this much of a discussion its more a "what if" situtation at the moment I could get it set up and it runs like a dream or it could be so bad that I scrap all but the expensive bits and not even want to waste a bag of cement. I hope it the first option  :lol:
« Last Edit: April 18, 2017, 03:18:21 PM by shipto »
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #63 on: April 23, 2017, 04:28:47 PM »
So I have now turned my attention to the knee slides and in yet another operation that would have been done better with a mill I made 4 elongated slots in each and made some blocks to help me get them lined up straight and keep them there. I have decided that I will get one side lined up as best as I can to the column and pin it, then everything will be lined up to that.
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Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #64 on: April 27, 2017, 05:24:39 PM »
The knee is going to have to go back to the drawing board (what theres a drawing board?) at the very least temporarily as the bits are nowhere near straight I suspect its down to the rubbish jig I made to mill them on the lathe. So I am thinking of borrowing ideas from the gingery lathe and make the ways and carriage from some bright drawn stock which will hopefully get me running the mill well enough to straighten up the cast iron bits. Finger crossed.

Nearly had a major oops moment tonight while try to move the carriage along I pushed a little too hard and dropped it amazing how fast you move when your feet are in danger  :lol: that will teach me to secure it before messing.
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Offline tom osselton

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #65 on: April 28, 2017, 01:05:43 AM »
Yep watch them toes!

Offline shipto

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Re: Another homemade milling machine
« Reply #66 on: April 28, 2017, 07:35:11 AM »
I do wear steel toecap boots but I doubt they would have helped the rest of my foot.

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