Author Topic: Smart and Brown 1024  (Read 6946 times)

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Smart and Brown 1024
« on: November 26, 2009, 04:40:19 PM »
Thought I'd better make a new thread and stop spoiling elsewhere ....  :)

Some pic's, it's plonked in the middle of the garage so I didn't have much room to take these.











The threading charts show TPI, metric, BA and Dia (is that diametric ?)
Second question is Dia used for making worms ? Like wot I did for the mill ?

You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline NickG

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1890
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2009, 06:36:40 PM »
Darren, it's brilliant! Great find. I'd go with bogs and get rid of that complicated QCTP for a standard one though! You say it couldn't be converted to single phase, why is that? how have you got it wired up, do you have a rotary converter?

Nick

Location: County Durham (North East England)

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2009, 07:36:19 PM »
Hi Nick,

The 1024 has a 3 speed motor giving 12 speeds from 30-2,500rpm and anything with more than one speed converted to single phase is going to be limited. My smaller model L S&B has a 2 speed motor. So the same goes there.

My Beaver mill has a single speed 3ph motor, but it also has another two 3ph motors on the table. So no single phase or VFD for that.

A rotary converter covers them all and I have them all wired in at the same time via a 3ph lock out box come fuse box.

At the mo I can't use top speed on the 1024 but that is probably because I'm still feeding the garage with a 50m 13a extension lead. I've almost finished wiring the armoured cable to the garage and hopefully it will be OK then as my voltage drop issue should be cured.

The funny qctp is a joy to use, hard to explain why, so I'm hanging onto it while I decide what to do.


Been playing with it again and I have one small issue with the crosslide. It seems the thrust bearing has lost it's balls so there is a bit of backlash. Should be an easy fix, fingers crossed.
It's also got a suds pump and tank, but not tried that as yet. Just another bonus if it works.
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline AdeV

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1508
  • Country: gb
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2009, 08:00:48 PM »
That, looks really nice. Good score!

How do you lock the tailstock down? I can't see any obvious levers or bolts...


I've just tried it with a steel bar that I could not get an acceptable finish with on any other of my lathes. It came out perfect, smooth as anything


I still can't manage that on mine  :( But then, I've not got a tool on-centre yet, I hope that once I've got that sussed I'll be away.

But enough of my machine: Bask in the magnificence of yours, truly an object to inspire envy (in a nice way, though)
Cheers!
Ade.
--
Location: Wallasey, Merseyside. A long way from anywhere.
Skype: adev73

Offline sbwhart

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3402
  • Country: gb
  • Smile, Be Happy, Have Fun and Rock Until you Drop
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2009, 01:33:41 AM »
That looks a useful bit of kit Darren  :thumbup: did you get any goodies with it:- four jaw, face plate, steadies etc

Have fun

Stew

A little bit of clearance never got in the road
 :wave:

Location:- Crewe Cheshire

Offline trevoratxtal

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 163
  • Country: england
  • Torbay, South Devon, England
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2009, 02:31:57 AM »
Well Darren
What a machine!  the first thing that stands out is the apparent long travel of the top slide.
I have wished some times that if it was just that bit longer (top slide I mean)
The machine looks extremely robust and has a very good write up on
http://www.lathes.co.uk/smartbrown/page5.html
The QCTP should be looked after that type are expensive and fetch good money on Ebay.
From your Photos it looks like the MK2, a photo from the rear would be nice.
Congratulations.
Trev

 :clap:

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2009, 03:57:27 AM »
Quick reply as I'm going out to a tool auction today ..... well it gets me out  :ddb:

Adev, The tailstock is locked with a lever at the rear.

Stew, I got a 6" 3 jaw, 8" four jaw, a spare 5" D1-4 backplate, mic stop, soft jaws, a 127t gear for metric conversion with a bag of other gears and the toolpost as mentioned.

Trev, the crosslide travel is long because it can be connected to the taper turning attachment on the rear of the lathe that is fixed to its own ways.

I'll take some more pictures of the rear when I have more time. it would be better if it's not sited up to a wall because of what is at the back .... later... :thumbup:

You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2009, 04:01:30 AM »
Oh, I noticed last night that the carriage does not have gibs, the top surface slides on the ways as normal but the underside has eccentric adjustable roller bearings .... that's a new one on me ... but then that's not difficult  :lol:
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline NickG

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1890
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2009, 04:38:47 AM »
Sounds good! I bet it's going to be a dream to use. Are you going to ditch your other lathes?

Nick
Location: County Durham (North East England)

Offline slowcoach

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 222
  • Country: england
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2009, 06:02:49 AM »
Good lathes those S&B's, I would have one tommorow, thats if i didn't already have my Raglan, if i could just sneak it in without the wife seeing it   :scratch:
What type of spindle fitting does it have Darren?

Rob



Hey Darren, I was having a tea break and happened to find these two links for 1024 operating manuals whilst browsing the net, I hope you find them interesting  :thumbup:
 
http://www.bbssystem.com/manuals/SMART-AND-BROWN-1024-operating-instructions.pdf    and     http://www.bbssystem.com/manuals/Smart-and-Brown-1024-Spares-Manual.pdf
« Last Edit: November 27, 2009, 08:06:01 AM by slowcoach »

Offline CrewCab

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 852
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2009, 02:08:38 PM »
Nice find Darren  :thumbup: ............ looks like free time will be non existent for quite some time though  ::)

Have fun, ............... don't forget ..... lot's and lot's of piccy's  :clap:

CC

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2009, 05:18:16 PM »
Thanks Guys, only time will tell how we get on together  :ddb:

I came away from the auction today with just one item

This




You just wouldn't believe it would you ... there was another one there but it was attached to a toolpost which was in turn attached to a rather large lump of scrap metal.
It too would have followed me home just for the toolpost and toolholder as it sold for next to nothing.
But I just had no means of carrying it home and my friendly scrap man was absent today so no joy. Almost broke my heart  :(

But still, I now have three toolholders ....  :)

Some more pic's as requested ...you asked .....  :med:

The tailstock and taper attachment





The back showing the suds pump and tank which slides out



The yellow is just some dust the carrier added, I've not had chance to clean it down as yet. Low voltage lighting transformer and isolation switch can be seen at the end.





The cockpit, seems awfully complicated, but it's not ...black panel is the imperial Norton threading and feed chart.



Inside the back cover are the other threading charts when the changewheels are altered. Quite comprehensive.



The changewheels





« Last Edit: November 27, 2009, 05:27:51 PM by Darren »
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2009, 05:26:37 PM »
I finally connected the armoured mains cable to the garage this evening and I'm happy to report that my voltage drop problem has now been resolved. I can get all 3 motor speeds with no problems from my RPC  :ddb:

I took the chuck off to have a look. It's supposed to have a 5C nose, but this is not 5C  :scratch:

EDIT:  MADE A MISTAKE, IT IS A 5C NOSE ......

Do I have to take this bit off as well? Thought I'd better ask here before bodging something  :doh:

« Last Edit: November 28, 2009, 02:05:35 PM by Darren »
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline John Stevenson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1354
  • Nottingham, England.
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2009, 05:47:04 PM »
No, that's the spindle.
No certain but I think the SB has a proprietary collet.
Had a look on lathes.co.uk and it says it takes collets up to 1"
If it was 5C it would go bigger.

Spares are available here:-

http://www.barrystarling.co.uk/id4.html


John S.
John Stevenson

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2009, 06:04:22 PM »
Umm ....thanks John ... the guys on the S&B forum say 5C but this isn't .....

Trust me to get the wrong one having an L model that usually takes S&B collets but mine uses 5C  :doh:

I do have a bunch of S&B collets, I'll dig em out and see if they fit ...

PS, I have heard a whisper of a D1-4 5C chuck sitting idle  :)
« Last Edit: November 28, 2009, 12:16:32 PM by Darren »
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2009, 06:12:45 PM »
Nick, yes I'll be moving on my little un, fettled within the Bogsy emporium.

I felt uneasy letting it go after John helped me out and put so much effort in. It really is a cracking little lathe that bears no resemblance to the original banana ...
But having chatted with John on the subject I was granted the masters blessing to allow another to fondle handle it's charms ....

Yes it will be going along with the Union, which is not a bad lathe in it's own right.
I just can't keep buying and keeping, as much as I'd like to ....  :(
« Last Edit: November 27, 2009, 07:05:13 PM by Darren »
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2009, 06:49:32 PM »
I nearly forgot this picture, there is some paperwork from Barry Starling and it seems it's had new bronze dog carriers? The bronze bits that push the dog gears in and out.
I imagine they were fitted as it's had a new belt, you can see the scarf joint near the top ...

Everything in there looks almost like new, even the oil is clean.

You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline andyf

  • In Memoriam
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1796
  • Country: gb
    • The Warco WM180 Lathe - Modifications
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2009, 07:03:02 PM »
Quote
Everything in there looks almost like new, even the oil is clean.

Well, the paintwork might have seen better days, but that last photo shows that beauty is more than skin deep.

More lathe porn awaited.

Andy

Sale, Cheshire
I've cut the end off it twice, but it's still too short

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2009, 07:11:28 PM »
Yes Andy it does look a bit rough I have to admit ...

But fire her up and she's quite a quiet lass and everything is silky smooth to operate. My little Model L is a lot noisier.

Inside the head is a work of art, no warn dogs or any evidence of gear troubles at all. I just put the lid back on and left it at that.

The bed looks great, no chunks knocked out and no blooming hacksaw marks across the ways .... I hate to see that  :bang:
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline dsquire

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2207
  • Country: ca
  • Kitchener, Ontario, Canada
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2009, 07:28:54 PM »
Darren

Kind of looks to me as though you have a keeper there. I downloaded the 2 manuals mentioned earlier and had a peek through them. It appears to me that you have yourself one very fine lathe that should be able to handle most anything that you want to put to it.  :ddb: :ddb:

Remember back a year ago. Since then you have the Beaver Mill, the Shaper and now this lathe along with other miscellaneous tooling and a new shop. Throw in the one more year of experience. I would be willing to bet that even you never expected to be at this point this early. You have came a long way from when you started. Congratulations. Good things happen to people that work hard. :ddb: :ddb: :ddb:

Cheers  :beer: :beer:

Don
Good, better, best.
Never let it rest,
'til your good is better,
and your better best

bogstandard

  • Guest
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2009, 04:04:14 AM »
Don,

It was only a couple of days ago when talking with Darren on Skype that I said exactly the same thing to him.

With a little bit of luck, a lot of hard work and listening, he has now got a workshop around him him that should last a lifetime. Fine tune his skills a little more, and you have the makings of a very good machinist.

My ex internet apprentice took about two years to get to a stage of self independence and flying by himself, I think Darren is on for about the same timescale.

So all you budding whannabees, don't think it can all be done overnight. Hard work and perseverance always pays off in the end.

Well done Darren.


Now where have I put all the bits for that 5C chuck?


John

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2009, 05:53:13 AM »
Thanks for the compliments guys ... very humbling ..... ::)

But anyone can throw cash at this game and although I am comfortable using the machines I sure have a way to go yet ...  :dremel:

It might look as if I have been throwing money after money at this game, Honestly, despite what I have I really have not spent very much.
If anyone would like a simplified breakdown then just ask.

The new garage build has been by far the biggest expense and effort. Prob 3 or four times the cost of all my tooling and machines. But I did get carried away with it with all the heating and insulation. Call it an investment when the time comes to sell the place.

Now it's almost finished I will be able to spend more time discovering new machining skills ..... nearly there ...  :dremel:

Don, nice of you to remember the details, yes a lot seems to have come my way in a short space of time. Some time ago my workshop was emptied by some scum, for a long time I thought I would never get my act together again ....
« Last Edit: November 28, 2009, 06:24:51 AM by Darren »
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline slowcoach

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 222
  • Country: england
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2009, 06:11:39 AM »
She looks good under the bonnet Darren  :thumbup:

Rob

Offline Darren

  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3800
  • N/Wales
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2009, 02:03:11 PM »
Guys, I have a confession to make

I feel such a dumb ass, it does have a 5C collet nose.

I have no idea why I couldn't get one in the other night, bit of muck I suppose. But even so, I could excuse myself except I've been using 5C almost exclusively on my Model L for over a year ... !!

I must have been tired when I tried it the other night .... ah hem !!!

Sorry.... 5C it is .....  :doh:
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline John Hill

  • The Artful Bodger
  • Madmodder Committee
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1874
Re: Smart and Brown 1024
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2009, 02:19:54 PM »
Darren, nice lathe! :thumbup:

If I recall correctly you have just finished building your new 'shop, when are you starting on the extensions? :clap: :beer:
From the den of The Artful Bodger