Author Topic: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock  (Read 52808 times)

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2014, 11:03:18 AM »
Okay Folks--It's opinion pole time!!! This morning as I was going through the model adding all of the bolt holes, I decided I didn't like those yellow angle end supports. A bit of quick modelling gave me the flat plate base as you see it here to support the engine instead of the angle plates.  Since the engine has a dry sump, I don't have to contain any oil in the crankcase. True, it exposes the spinning crankshaft and con rod, but any-one who sticks their finger in there would pretty well have to do it on purpose. I like this new base better. I want to know what you guys think. Do you like this plate base better or the yellow angles as in previous versions I have posted.

Offline philf

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2014, 11:18:47 AM »
Brian,

This version looks much nicer.  :thumbup:

The base plate and the separate fan make all the difference.

Which version of Solidworks are you using?

Phil.
Phil Fern
Location: Marple, Cheshire

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2014, 04:51:55 PM »
philf---2012 basic

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2014, 05:00:48 PM »
I like the base better, but personally tend to think enclosed engines look better -- admittedly less educational, though. A thin removable cover plate with small screws on the second version would be my preference.
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
www.sredmond.com

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2014, 05:02:21 PM »
Okay--The plate gets it by a mile, from all 4 websites I post on.---A plate it will be!!!

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #30 on: August 06, 2014, 07:36:38 AM »
For those of you who have been asking about how I will adjust the valve lash on this engine----This is it. The "tappets" will be of 3 piece construction, having an internally tapped bottom that will ride on the cam, an externally threaded top section which rides against the end of the valve, and a lock nut.  The bottom section of the tappet is 5/16" diameter, and is hardened "01" steel. the top portion will also be hardened "01" steel. The internal thread is a #10-24. I left the cylinder head off in this model so you can see that I plan on using pressed in valve cages.----Brian

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #31 on: August 06, 2014, 08:49:44 AM »
Well Sir!! I think that just about covers it!!! Oh, I've got to so something about a place for my started spud so I can use my variable speed drill as a starter, and probably add a few keyways and bolt holes, but I think the overall design is 99% done. everything on there I have built before on my previous 7 i.c. engines, except for perhaps the adjustable tappets----and that doesn't look like brain surgery. I think this will be a really neat project for a new engine this fall, and as usual I will be posting the engineering drawings fro anyone who wants to join in the fun. I guess my next step will be to make a list of all the bushings and bearings and go have a chat with my bearing supplier.---Brian

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #32 on: August 06, 2014, 08:52:20 PM »
I am going to "borrow" the crankshaft design from Malcolm  Stride's "Lynx" engine. The crankshaft will be made up from individual components which will be silver soldered together. However it will remain as two totally separate assemblies. The 1/2" shaft with keyway, the counterweight/web and the 1/2" diameter rod journal will be one assembly. The other end of the crankshaft will be 3/8" diameter and consist of only the shaft and the counterweight/web. This second counterweight/web will have a 1/2" hole reamed through it, which the rod journal will pass completely through, ending flush with the other side of the counterweight/web. The rod journal will be made from "01" water hardening steel, which will be quenched immediately after silver soldering to harden it. Both ends of the full crankshaft will be supported by two bearings, to prevent any potential misalignment. (The crankcase and outboard bearing support will be assembled, doweled, and all bored in one set-up.) This arrangement will allow me to use a sealed roller bearing on the big end of the con-rod. The width between the counterweight/webs when all is assembled is sufficient to allow a .015" thick spacer washer on each side of the con rod bearing.

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #33 on: August 08, 2014, 12:16:34 PM »
This morning I got bored!! Daughter is getting married next week---whole week will be crazy. Customer is squealing like a pig wanting me to come over to his factory and do some design on a new machine, but I can't because I'm waiting for a courier to bring me a new Solidworks disc. A friend wants me to machine some mounts for his new fishing downrigger but I'n waiting on material.---And yesterday I just bought a second house!!!--However, being stuck between all things and unable to do any of them, I decided to machine something this morning.----So---I rooted around in my scrap bin and found a piece of aluminum big enough to make the spacer bar that fits between the backplate and the crankase on my fall project engine.

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #34 on: August 08, 2014, 12:25:19 PM »
Sent out a list of bearings and bushings for the new engine to my bearing supplier.--Wouldn't you know it----Their system is down!!---I may just go upstairs and drink wine for the rest of the day!!!

REQUEST FOR PRICE AND DELIVERY
ONE—SEALED NEEDLE ROLLER BEARING .25” I.D. X 0.478” O.D. X 0.375” LONG #SCE46PP  INA
ONE--- SEALED NEEDLE ROLLER BEARING .375” I.D. X 0.563” O.D. X 0.5” LONG #SCE68PP   INA
TWO SEALED BALL BEARINGS  ½” I.D. X 1.125” O.D. X 0.5” LONG #R1616-2RS    RBI
ONE OILITE BRZ. BUSHING 3/8” I.D. X ½” O.D. X 1/2” LONG
ONE OILITE BRONZE BUSHING  3/8” I.D. X 5/8” O.D. X Ύ” LONG
TWO—OILITE BRONZE BUSHINGS 3/8” I.D. X ½” O.D. X 1” LONG

Offline PekkaNF

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #35 on: August 08, 2014, 12:54:27 PM »
Sent out a list of bearings and bushings for the new engine to my bearing supplier.--Wouldn't you know it----Their system is down!!---I may just go upstairs and drink wine for the rest of the day!!!

Bit like my day at the office. We need 6-7 systems to do the work. Each of them is can of worms, inherited, outsourced, offshored....uptime something like 90% - EACH. Meaning all is up and running about 50% of workday. MAX. Unless someone on HR ot IT has revoked all priviledges. And by 10:00 we had fire alarm and everyone had to leave the building. Half an hour later burnt light on the storage was found. Rest of the day went downhill....

Pekka

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #36 on: August 08, 2014, 01:19:25 PM »
Damn!!!---And I mean that with all my heart!!! Three weeks ago I called Canadian Bearings and inquired about the sealed needle bearings, their sizes, and the fact that they could be sealed. Got the green light on everything, so went ahead and designed the engine based on that info. Today I sent out a request for quote for all bearings bushings, etcetera on the engine to Canadian Bearings. Just got an answer back----The 1/4" needle bearings I planned on using for the wrist pin  (gudgeon pin) are not available anywhere in North America. The 3/8" needle bearings for the big end are available, but they are no longer selling them as "sealed" bearings. This doesn't totally beat me, because I can still go to a 3/8" needle bearing at the wrist pin--(I do have sufficient room). The only pain in the arse is that now the rod bearings will have to be manually oiled. Oh well, none of this is a deal breaker, but it sure annoys me!!! (All the bearings and bushings including taxes came to about $40 Canadian, including taxes.)

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2014, 06:39:10 PM »
So here we have a pair of gears being born!! I had a 7" length of 1144 stress proof steel x 1 3/8" diameter left over from making the crankshaft for the Jaguar/Canadian Cub, and the o.d. of the timing gears for my side valve engine is 1.33 major diameter. I cut the 7" length in half, turned the short end to 5/8" diameter, turned the o.d. to 1.33" diameter, and drilled and reamed the 3/8" bore 2" deep all in one set-up. I then reversed the part in the 3 jaw chuck and turned the other end to 5/8" diameter. Next step will be to set it up in the chuck on my rotary table and make one long gear, then saw it in half in the bandsaw and turn the face of each remaining gear half to the correct length, then cut off the long hub to leave a .343 long hub. Then I will add the set screw holes.

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #38 on: August 10, 2014, 09:06:19 AM »
I got thinking about how I was going to loosen off the gears on the cam-shafts to adjust the cams, and realized that there would be no portion of the shaft (which has the cam fixed to the end of it) available to grab hold of and turn. So---I extended the shafts to extend through the backplate 3/8", and made up a couple of knurled caps to fit over the ends of the shaft and bolt on with a #8 shcs. This will act as a retainer washer to keep the shaft and cam from sliding out of the bushing, and will give me something I can grip to turn the cam and shaft manually when the set screws holding the gear are loosened off. There is no danger of getting my finger sucked down between the knurled rollers, because they both turn the same direction---they don't roll in towards each other.

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #39 on: August 10, 2014, 02:31:17 PM »
Last night I lay in bed thinking about the crankcase for this engine. It looks kinda neat with that rectangular hole all the way through it.--But I am beginning to think that perhaps it doesn't need that big rectangular hole through it. That big rectangular hole, which would be a bit of a pig to machine, doesn't serve any real purpose that I can see. (except to give access for oiling the big end of the rod with a squirt can)The crankshaft is two piece, and can be inserted through the big round hole in the side for the bearing housing.(I designed the hole to be 0.030" greater in diameter than the largest diameter on the crankshaft.) So, for assembly, the driven side of the crankshaft that eventually has the cam gear mounted on it would be inserted first. Then the con-rod (with piston attached) would have the big end lowered down through the hole in the top of the crankcase, then the main (dark blue) section of crankshaft would be inserted,with the rod journal going through the rod big end bearing and passing on through the reamed hole in the web of the first piece of crankcase--(that hole is just a sliding fit, not an interference fit). Then the bearing housing and bearings would be slid on over the end of the dark blue crankshaft and bolted up to the side of the crankcase. Of course all of this depends on whether or not I can find a sealed needle bearing or not.

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #40 on: August 11, 2014, 07:48:48 AM »
Unless somebody can convince me otherwise, I am going to build the crankcase as shown, with no rectangular hole running through it. The hole does nothing in terms of running the engine, and the crankcase becomes so incredibly much easier to machine, since all of the material from inside the crankcase can be removed with a boring tool in the lathe, using the 4 jaw chuck. I am still chasing down "sealed fro life needle roller bearings", but even if I can't find them and have to run an oil sump, this should still work.---Brian

Offline DMIOM

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #41 on: August 11, 2014, 11:21:46 AM »
Brian,

You may not be getting much feedback but I'm sure there are many like me who, whilst never likely to build an engine, are enjoying watching the evolutionary process and appreciating the design skills.

Dave

Offline philf

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #42 on: August 11, 2014, 12:21:39 PM »
Brian,
You may not be getting much feedback but I'm sure there are many like me who, whilst never likely to build an engine, are enjoying watching the evolutionary process and appreciating the design skills.
Dave

Brian,

I second Dave's comment.

Keep the posts coming.

Phil.
Phil Fern
Location: Marple, Cheshire

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #43 on: August 11, 2014, 12:34:43 PM »
I went back to Canadian Bearings today and chewed on the salesman for a while about these damned sealed needle bearings. Now it seems that I can get a 1/4" sealed needle bearing x 7/16" long. This will work fine for the wrist pin, because my piston is 1" diameter. I had previously asked for a 3/8" long bearing, and it is NOT available. The 3/8" needle bearing for the con rod big end is only available in an unsealed version, but I can probably find a work-around for that.---One word about needle roller bearings---When I built my Kerzel hit and miss engine, I put a set of needle roller bearings on the crankshaft to make it spin easier. It worked, but they are very noisy little devils. I didn't pack them with grease, just oiled them which may have been a mistake. What I am thinking now is that if I go to the solid crankcase without the rectangular hole all the way through it, the engine might be a lot quieter, in terns of bearing noise.

Offline awemawson

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #44 on: August 11, 2014, 12:42:54 PM »
What I am thinking now is that if I go to the solid crankcase without the rectangular hole all the way through it, the engine might be a lot quieter, in terns of bearing noise.

It'll still be just as noisy - only you won't hear it   :nrocks:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #45 on: August 11, 2014, 03:43:00 PM »
My small mill did not enjoy cutting this 1144 stress proof at all -at all.  This stuff cuts much harder than mild steel or brass. Poor mill was shaking and quivering, and I could tell that I was hurting it. I did cut all the way round, and I did get the right number of teeth, but I think all the shaking and shuddering may have thrown the 3 jaw chuck out of center, as the teeth on one side are deeper than the other, and the tooth form is off. I will center up the 3 jaw on the rotary table and see if I can re-cut this gear and save it. So---A lesson learned here. If you have a small mill and not a full size Bridgeport or equal, you probably shouldn't use 1144 stress proof for gears.


Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #46 on: August 11, 2014, 07:21:51 PM »
It seems the day is saved!!! I tore everything down re-centered the chuck on the rotary table (it was about .008" total runout), then set everything up again, eyeballed to make sure I was cutting in a space, not on a tooth, and went around again--all 30 spaces. Gear now looks good, all teeth are the same height and same shape. I will know better when I get all the gears made and mounted, but I think it's going to be okay.

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #47 on: August 12, 2014, 02:12:20 AM »
It seems the day is saved!!! Gear now looks good, all teeth are the same height and same shape. I will know better when I get all the gears made and mounted, but I think it's going to be okay.

It's a good feeling. When a wonky component can be easily salvaged. 

Especially, when only you know.......  :thumbup:

David D

David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #48 on: August 12, 2014, 08:47:10 AM »
David--That's why I keep all my failures a secret and never let anyone know about them :doh: :doh:

Offline Brian Rupnow

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Re: Side Valve i.c. engine from Bar stock
« Reply #49 on: August 12, 2014, 01:49:14 PM »
Old age and treachery triumph once again!!! The gear has now been split and finished and mounted on two 3/8" diameter dowels mounted in two reamed holes exactly 1.25" apart (The pitch diameter of the gears)---They mesh perfectly. Hurray for my side!!!