Author Topic: Solenoid engine Build  (Read 35129 times)

Offline CallMeAl

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Solenoid engine Build
« on: November 21, 2010, 11:04:26 PM »
I have been intrigued by the solenoid engines I have seen on this forum and on Youtube.  When I acquired a rather large hydraulic valve solenoid off a surplus valve at work I thought it might be the seed I needed to start building such an engine.



I also had an old cast iron barbell weight to use for a flywheel.



The scale of these two items is going to make for a fairly good sized engine.  When I consider how fast these engines get going, I thought it would be interesting to make it a fly ball governed hit & miss style engine.  So I started by building the governor first.  This will control a switch to interrupt the electrical current as needed to throttle the engine.

Someone posted this drawing - forget who - I liked the design because it screws into the end of the crankshaft, at least that's how I'm going to use it. 



Here is my stab at building it, it seems to work on the drill anyway!







Here is a test run:




One part down, a lot to go.  I plan to cast the base.  It will be a horizontal engine - the design is still in progress.  Don't expect the speed of others builds one this forum, I'm in no hurry and I am still figuring out how to build it!
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Offline crabsign69

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2010, 01:12:55 PM »
ill be watch very close here . nice flyball too

Offline Powder Keg

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2010, 07:28:12 PM »
I've always been fascinated with those solenoid motors. I'll be watching this one close:o)
Wesley P
A Gismo ??? If it has a flywheel or spins and is made with small parts. I'll take one! If it makes noise, moves, or requires frequent oiling and dusting it's a better deal yet. It's especially right if its shiny and bright; but if it's dirty and dull it wont mater at all...

Offline andyf

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2010, 07:59:48 PM »
I have to confess that I've never come across a solenoid engine before.

 :scratch: How does it work? Contacts arranged so that the plunger of a solenoid moves to and fro, like the piston in a conventional steam or IC engine, with a con rod and crank to convert the linear motion to a rotary one? Does it have any advantage over a normal electric motor, or is it something to build just for the fun of it? Not that there's anything wrong with fun, of course  :)

Andy
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I've cut the end off it twice, but it's still too short

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2010, 03:38:46 AM »
Hmmm...... Yes..... I'm confused too!  :scratch:

But, watching!  :thumbup:

Nice work on the governer.  :clap:

David D
Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline madjackghengis

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2010, 08:28:41 AM »
That's quite a good looking governor arrangement you've got made, it looks very sturdy and workman like.  I'll have to file that one away for future use.  Looking forward to the build as well, I've got a handful of solenoids with nothing to do with them, so they would be useful for something after all.  That governor looks very fine indeed :bow: :jaw: mad jack

Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2010, 10:54:08 PM »
Thanks all for the comments on the governor.  Yes, I am just building to see if I can make it work and I wanted to make something different and because I have the stuff laying around to do it. :D

Here is a small version of a solenoid engine I found on the net. The one I am attempting to build will be about  4 times the size!



I bored out the end of the solenoid tube end to get the floating piston that was inside:



Temporally added a rod. I don't have to worry about sealing the cylinder and actually the slits in the piston are a good thing since I do not want any compression at all!



I cut some 2.5 inch x 1/2" discs for the crank counter weights, pasted a full size pattern on one, bolted the two together, and whittled away till I had this result:











Next is the pattern for the base casting.  Can't do to much more till I get that poured.  I also need to figure out the governor cut out switch and the timing actuator and switch.
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Offline raynerd

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2010, 04:25:23 AM »
Nice work, like the governor video!
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Offline madjackghengis

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2010, 09:22:51 AM »
Well Al, that picture is about what I had in my mind, and my immediate thought was finding sufficient solenoids to make up a V-8 or V-12, and have a nice "distributer" to apply power to all the solenoids in turn, just to hear it run.  I remember building a solenoid engine as a project out of an old boy's project book from the thirties, when I was a boy, it was a fascination for everyone who saw it.  I'm looking forward to seeing this one, with a governor. mad jack

Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2010, 12:24:52 AM »
Thanks craynerd for the comment.

Mad Jack: Wow a V-8, that would be sight to behold and I can't image what it would sound like, fairly quiet I would think except for the spark arcs snapping on the distributor!

I got a start on the engine base.  It still needs a lot of clean up a coating of paint.

It's not in the same league as Rob Wilson's beautiful patterns, but it should pour OK. I'm still learning how cast items and every pour is a new adventure!





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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2010, 04:35:00 PM »
Hi Al 


Sure going to look a fine engine , :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: great to see more casting on the forum  :thumbup:

Every pore is still an adventure for me to ,,,,,  :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:


Rob

I faff about way way to much with my patterns  :doh:

Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2011, 10:13:37 PM »
Well I'm finally getting back to this project

I made a flange to put on the solenoid core tube:






Solder on the flange:





Ready to go:





Pattern painted and waxed ready for casting attempt:



I had to make a new flask since none of mine wood fit:





OK - time to melt some aluminum turn wood into metal tomorrow!
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Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #12 on: February 13, 2011, 04:28:12 AM »
Looking really good Al!  :clap: :clap:

Good luck for tomorrow.....  :thumbup:

David D
Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Mascobe

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2011, 12:52:19 PM »
Hey there, Just ran across this post and love to see that someone found my work and posted it here. Here is a link to the motor running:


http://www.youtube.com/user/mascobe#p/u/57/1UiPdkCwDIc

More different designs are found on my YouTube Channel:

http://www.youtube.com/user/mascobe

Enjoy!

Mascobe

Thanks all for the comments on the governor.  Yes, I am just building to see if I can make it work and I wanted to make something different and because I have the stuff laying around to do it. :D

Here is a small version of a solenoid engine I found on the net. The one I am attempting to build will be about  4 times the size!



Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2011, 09:49:43 PM »
Hello Mascobe,

Thanks for posting the links to your videos and Youtube page.  I think I found the picture of your engine when some requested what a solenoid engine, after I started this, was by doing a image search in google.  You do wonderful work and I hope everyone will take look.

 Your work is much more ingenious and detailed than mine will be, but mine will be more massive - if it works!
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Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2011, 09:53:47 PM »
Looking really good Al!  :clap: :clap:

Good luck for tomorrow.....  :thumbup:

David D

Thanks David - here comes the saga of the pour.  :palm:
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Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2011, 10:47:42 PM »
Ok Scottie, prepare to ram!



I ran low on sand so I used what I had.  I have not poured anything this size and have never used any weight on top of the flask.  So with the reduced sand load and no weight holding the flask together - disaster!  The metal lifted to half up and started spilling out between the cope and drag!  I didn't take any photo's because I was scurrying around and shouting bad things! :bang:



To top it all off the sand had broken apart in the mould!   :palm: 

The results..



The next attempt, after re-mulling the sand with a little more water and clay, I clamped the flask together and stacked on some weight.  This had better work!



Oh, when I was pulling the pattern for the second pour, I dropped it!  :bang:  So it really better work!



Success!  Not too shabby looking after shake out, no clean up other than cutting the sprues off.



Comparing the two results.  More lessons were learned the hard way on this pour..



That's it though with my homemade green sand.  It works OK, but you have to be fiddling with it all the time to make it preform well.  Life being shorter that it was, I am too creaky, cranky, and lazy to deal with it.

I got online and ordered a pile of Petrobond.  Now I have to build a moulding bench..

The saga never ends.
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Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2011, 10:40:17 PM »
I cleaned up the casting a little and fly cut the base:





My shop built fly cutter:



Here it is in action.  The base was remarkably flat so I only had to make three lite passes.  I'm not showing the full cut - boring!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eo5-uPHKabM

All the parts made so far, much left to figure out since I'm making this up as I go along:



Thanks for viewing

 AL

 
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Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2011, 03:35:34 AM »
Well done Al!  :clap:

A lesson learned, first try. Then a gem produced from the "wreckage".......  :thumbup:

It's all looking good to me!

David D
Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Rob.Wilson

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #19 on: February 17, 2011, 11:01:09 AM »
Hi Al  :clap:  :bow::clap:  :bow::clap: :bow: :clap:  :bow::clap:  :bow::clap: :bow: :clap:  :bow::clap:


I am  pleased to see the bed plate  casting came out  great in the end :headbang: ,it looks a good solid casting  :thumbup:, I no what was going through your head when the mould split  :doh: , i seam to learn more about casting when things go wrong  :lol: :lol:


Rob

Offline saw

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #20 on: February 17, 2011, 11:16:48 AM »
This is looking very intressting, keep on good work  :clap:
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Offline cfellows

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #21 on: February 17, 2011, 11:55:59 PM »
Very nice looking build you got going there, Al.  I, too, have a keen interest in solenoid engines of the hit n miss variety.  One of the issues I've noticed with all solenoid hit n miss engines is that they don't make very many revolutions between "hits".  I think the secret to making a good running hit and miss solenoid engine is to drive the solenoid at maybe double or even 4 times it's rated amperage.  Since it is only operating maybe 20% of the time, it shouldn't overheat.  However, yours may run perfect right out of the box so would only try overdriving the solenoid if you're disatisfied with the way it runs.

Chuck

Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #22 on: February 19, 2011, 10:03:28 PM »
Stilldrillin:  Wreckage is correct.  Some times you just get lucky

Rob: You are correct, I learn something every time I pour and sometimes I relearn what I did wrong the last time!

Chuck: Yes I hope the heavy fly wheel I intend to use will let it coast awhile before it "hits" again.  This whole thing is just an experiment so I have no idea if it will work like I want it to or not.
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Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #23 on: February 19, 2011, 10:44:49 PM »
Now that I have a bed casting - time to move on:

When I built the building my shop is in I never intended it to house a rather tall mill, so I put a simple shed type roof on it.  When I bought the mill and moved it in, it was a tight fit, in fact after I insulated the roof the motor was trapped. 



It didn't really bother me till I need to move the ram on the mill for this project.  So I had to take the time to build a tunnel to traverse the head out.



The reason was to get some head room for some operations and boring on the engine base.  I wanted it to hang off the edge of the table on an angle plate.





First drill and ream for the cylinder guide rods:



Drill and bore the cylinder mounting hole:



Fly cut for the solenoid tube mounting flange:



Drill and tap the tube mounting flange screws and cut the guide rails to length.  The guide rails are held in place the tube flange.



The solenoid coil sides on the tube and is held on by it's original nut.  I also drill some holes for the wiring connections which will have to be insulated.  I'm hoping to have no exposed wires:



The results so far:





Calipers for scale:



That's it for now - more fun to come..

Thanks fro viewing.

AL
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Offline CallMeAl

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Re: Solenoid engine Build
« Reply #24 on: March 02, 2011, 12:06:12 AM »
Da_Kengineer_Meister:  Hey, I was up in your area last week - Kent, WA. for a business meeting.  Yes, I was worried about the bit wandering off.  I even bought a extra long centering bit, but it really flexed when I tried to start the second hole because if the angle.  I ended up using the next smaller bit I had than the hole size I needed and slowly let it rub in.  Worked out just fine.   
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