Author Topic: Drum/ Thickness Sander  (Read 64393 times)

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #100 on: February 25, 2015, 01:15:41 PM »
For the thinnest finish I'd use a clear brushing lacquer, first coat mixed with talcum powder. This makes a very easily sanded sanding sealer. Use 300 grit paper on that by hand and you can easily sand by hand right back to the wood grain. Do a second coat (they dry in minutes) and sand that back w/ 300 grit paper, and you're ready for a color coat (if you want one. In the U.S. Krylon standard spray cans are colored lacquer. So I use that for fine and thin finishes.

Lacquers are super thin, not like oil based paint, or acrylics, polyurethanes, or just about anything else.

If you do use wax, that may work, but be aware you won't be able to paint it if you change your mind. The only thing that removes wax is ammonia, and not if it is penetrated into the wood. Paint won't generally stick to waxed wood.
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Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #101 on: February 25, 2015, 03:30:28 PM »
Removed the table to put a bar across for the height adjusting screw to push against. I also found out that the motor gets in the way of the table when trying to remove it, so I had to take the spindle off. With it like that I thought I might as well paint it. The only paint I had that wasn't white was some purple emulsion. I don't think it'll do anything to seal the wood or protect it, but I figured that won't be a problem since I usually leave things bare.



I think the lighter spots are just where the paint is still wet. At least I hope that's the case, since i'm out of paint.

I guess I'll try think of a good colour to go with the purple to paint all the furniture.

Also that talcum sanding sealer tip sounds good. I'll have to remember it for when I finally get around to making a banjo.

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #102 on: February 25, 2015, 08:17:00 PM »
re. talcum powder -- modern baby powder is often corn starch, now, which you definitely don't want for a sanding sealer. The type to use is the real talcum powder, which is made from talc.

I have only ever used it in lacquer, or on early model airplanes, "dope." Dope is actually lacquer of two different types, butyrate dope or nitrate dope.

Anyway the main thing to remember is lacquer and talc for a sanding sealer. It sands incredibly easily, and when sanding smells like baby powder. Not so nice when it first goes on, though. Lacquers require powerful thinners.

I don't have any experience in using any other vehicle with talcum powder than lacquer, and suspect the they would NOT work well at all. Lacquer dries very quickly and very hard and quite thin. Most enamels, varnishes, etc are the opposite of all of those traits, and would probably be  real mess.

The only exception I can think of is shellac (actually related to lacquer the lac in the name) that also dries fast thin and hard -- and is thinned with denatured alcohol. It  might work.....
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Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #103 on: February 25, 2015, 09:08:17 PM »
I always thought when I got as far as needing to finish a banjo i'd be going with nitrocellulose lacquer. It seems like it's the easiest to work with from what i've read. The meranti i'm using has some pretty huge open pores so I figured a sealer would be necessary, but I find the world of finishing pretty complicated. Especially so when it's hard to get ahold of alot of things in the UK. So i'm liking the idea of only having to source one kind of lacquer.

Although one problem might be the talc being white. I wonder if any kind of dye/ pigment would work well mixed in..

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #104 on: February 25, 2015, 09:13:47 PM »
Simon if you don't put too much in, and you sand it back, the talc becomes pretty much transparent, so you could bright finish it if you liked it with un-talcumed lacquer. Or if you wanted to transparent pigment it, most any aniline dye mixed with lacquer thinner would tint it to the degree you wanted.

If you want, try it on some scrap.

I use the sanding sealer on all of my casting patterns. In fact I just worked on my pulley pattern tonight and hit it with a coat.
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Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #105 on: February 27, 2015, 03:08:11 PM »
Simon if you don't put too much in, and you sand it back, the talc becomes pretty much transparent, so you could bright finish it if you liked it with un-talcumed lacquer. Or if you wanted to transparent pigment it, most any aniline dye mixed with lacquer thinner would tint it to the degree you wanted.

If you want, try it on some scrap.

I use the sanding sealer on all of my casting patterns. In fact I just worked on my pulley pattern tonight and hit it with a coat.

Yeah testing it sounds like a good idea. I've got plenty of meranti scraps hanging about.

Did some more on the sander.

Made the belt guard. I had this geet fancy thing planned with a nice but complicated shape, but decided I couldn't be bothered with all the angled cuts so I made this monstrosity. Needs tidying up after the glue dries.


Also got the thing re-assembled.

Shame about the patchy paint, since I'm probably not going to give it a second coat.

I put a new (and longer) cable on the motor while it was all apart. I might redo it again though since i've just got the wires wrapped around the posts. Some crimp eyelets would probably be less likely to shake loose over time.

Also i've started making a list of what I should probably do after this thing is finished. First is to fix the bike and the ladder to the roof so I can get into the far corner, then get the dust collector finished (I was putting it off for the price of soil pipe fittings), then I really need to improve the lighting in the garage. I should probably also paint the roof white to try get some light reflecting.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #106 on: February 28, 2015, 11:54:25 AM »
Rob Wilson popped in today with some belts and a bunch of other stuff, including break cleaner which is something i've been meaning to get for a while. Thanks Rob!


The belt is a bit smaller than the pulleys i'd made, but that gives me a chance to make some better pulleys out of aluminium.

So I got about 20 seconds into cutting off a chunk of aluminium with a dull hacksaw blade and decided to try clear the garage a bit instead.


I got the bike hung up in this corner. Doesn't give me alot of room for the step ladders. I suppose i'll try sort them out when one inevitably gets knocked down.

With the bike out the way, I could get into the corner by the doors and clear that up. It's still a bit messy but it's one hell of an improvement.



The next corner to tackle will be this one on the other end. Also looking at this photo, I found my missing funnel. It was camouflaged in front of the red box..


Then I need to sort out my basket of hardwood. It's difficult getting into this corner to sweep the dust up with it and the site lamp in the way. Hopefully better lights on the ceiling will remove the need to use that lamp when filming.


I think tomorrow I'll try relocating the big ladder to the roof. With that off the wall I can then start working on finishing the dust collector.

The drum sander is close to completion but I want to have dust collection working before I start running it.

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #107 on: February 28, 2015, 01:17:53 PM »
Blood hell you have been busy Simon  :clap: :clap: :clap: so there was a floor in that corner of your shop  :lol:


I got to cast my eye over the sander today and its just as impressive in really life  :thumbup: its going to be a cracker when its fully up and running  :med:


Rob   

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #108 on: March 02, 2015, 09:57:28 AM »


I tried painting the ceiling and... well. I'm hopeful it'll help improve the lighting cuz it sure as hell hasn't made my garage any prettier. I've been shining the site lamp onto the ceiling and using the reflected light to light alot of my filming. I'm planning to get some more tube lights (the one thing B&Q seems to be good at is the price on tube lights. It's the same price as eBay at least) but chances are i'll still need to use the site lamp.

With the roof painted (or as much as I can be bothered to paint it) i'm gonna have a go at hanging the ladder on the roof next, but I need a break. Spent 3 hours walking around Consett (there's some good hardware stores in that town) and it's about the most exercise i've done all year. I felt I was forgetting something important the whole time I was there though, and I just realised what I'd forgotten; hacksaw blades.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #109 on: March 02, 2015, 12:20:42 PM »
Got the ladder on the roof. The thing is alot heavier than it looks, I couldn't lift it all by myself. Had to rest one end on the floor and lift it up to a pair of hooks, then go through the house to get behind it and lift it up/ tie a rope around it. Then get up on the step ladder to screw the next pair of hooks in.  I decided to point the hooks towards each other so the only way to remove it is to remove the hooks. I didn't like the idea of inevitably bumping the thing and having it slide off the hooks and onto my head.



I also moved the tool chest Rob gave me (a year or so ago) to somewhere more convenient. In the far corner it was only being used for storing my rust collection. I'll probably move my drills and lathe tools to it at some point. I also need to get some wheels for the bigger bench grinder I bought at a boot sale last year. I'm also thinking about making a pedestal for it


Despite all the work, the garage still looks a mess.


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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #110 on: March 02, 2015, 12:28:15 PM »
Looks allot lighter   :thumbup:

Rob

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #111 on: March 04, 2015, 09:12:06 AM »


Work on the dust collector. I'm not too happy with how it's attached to the wall though, the wall plugs pull out a bit if I pull on it lightly. Really I should probably take it down in case it slowly works its way loose.

I might try make some angled brackets to hold it on a bit more at the top or something.

But it does seem to be working (although light dust is making it through. I've got a filter bag to stick over the outlet to catch anything that makes it through). It's just clamped together and nothing is sealed so hopefully efficiency will improve.

I'm hesitating on glueing it together/ sealing it up because I've got that terrible feeling that i'm forgetting something important.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #112 on: March 04, 2015, 01:58:38 PM »

Glued the thing together and also attached the filter bag to the outlet.

Then with nothing else to do till I get some soil pipe fittings, I started hacksawing that aluminium bar. Got about a centimeter in when I had a different idea...

I used this circular saw I bought from aldi for cutting sheet steel a while ago. It's a fairly underpowered thing and stalls very easily (even when cutting things within the stated limits), but that turned out to be a good thing since it eliminated the risk of kickback. I was able to saw through the 64mm aluminium bar cutting from both sides.

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #113 on: March 04, 2015, 08:45:44 PM »
It feels good to attack a shop and get things the way you imagined they should be. Good on ye!  :thumbup:
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
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Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #114 on: March 05, 2015, 09:08:49 AM »
It feels good to attack a shop and get things the way you imagined they should be. Good on ye!  :thumbup:

Yeah it does! It's also good to do stuff you don't have to think too hard about. The sander is one of those things where, if I let myself, i'd think about every minute problem to the point that I never make the thing. I've been lucky that stuff like the motor I wasn't planning to use just fit, as did the stock sanding belt I bought for the conveyor. It's the kind of thing I should've thought a bit about ahead of time.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #115 on: March 05, 2015, 05:15:37 PM »
Made a pair pulleys. It took me all day to make both of these, most of the time was spent changing tools in the lathe. Some day i'll get a quick change toolpost and make that cam lock tailstock...



Got to try a couple of things i've been wanting to do for a while. First was using a reamer for the first time, at 3/4". And second was heating a thing up to fit it onto a spindle.





I'll have to wait for them to cool down to test them though. Hopefully I got them spaced right, or I'll have to use a puller to get them back off.

I'm really on the home stretch though. Tomorrow i'll sand the drum round and get the electronics properly hooked up. After that it's just getting and installing the windscreen wiper motor for the conveyor. If all goes well I could have the video made by Monday.

Offline micktoon

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #116 on: March 05, 2015, 06:44:22 PM »
Hi Simon , nice job on the pulleys  :drool: :thumbup: as you say on the home stretch now, I look forward to seeing it in operation, keep up the good work  :dremel:

 Cheers Mick.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #117 on: March 06, 2015, 06:35:12 PM »
Did a little thing today.



Height adjusting screw. I had a brain fart with it at first, intending the disk part to stay still vertically and push the threaded rod up, but I didn't consider that it'd just spin freely and not move. So there's a nut wedged into the wooden brace.

I had alot more planned today but I ended up working on the garage lights, since with them propped up against a wall I thought it was inevitable that i'd crash something into them.

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #118 on: March 07, 2015, 03:43:51 AM »
Nice job machining the pulleys Simon  :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :thumbup:

Must be really close now  :ddb:



Rob 

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #119 on: March 07, 2015, 11:37:20 AM »
Nice job machining the pulleys Simon  :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :thumbup:

Must be really close now  :ddb:



Rob

Thanks!

I got the windscreen wiper motor today.

I also sanded the drum true. The thing is at its maximum capacity doing this, which isn't too thick. I suppose I could always change it if or when I need to sand something taller.


Then I varnished the drums. Rob's suggestion was to hold the paper on with spray adhesive, and it sounds like a better idea than relying on just holding the ends. Hopefully the varnish will make it easier to remove/ clear the glue residue off.


Shame i've got to wait for the stuff to dry though. I've got a few things to do in the meantime at least.

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #120 on: March 07, 2015, 11:56:08 AM »
They make spray adhesive especaly for holding disks on automotive sponge rubber sanding disks. I used to use those when building stripper canoes. You have to play with how much to put on, and how long to wait for it to tack before sticking it together, and whether to spray both the drum and paper, or just one of them. So don't give up if it doesn't stick well or sticks too well and the sandpaper shreds when trying to remove it. Keep experimenting and you'll find a happy medium.
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
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Offline Swarfing

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #121 on: March 07, 2015, 01:04:40 PM »
I use 3M photo mount like a contact adhesive for my sanding blocks. It sticks firm enough to stay but not enough so you cant take it off easily.
Once in hole stop digging.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #122 on: March 09, 2015, 03:56:05 PM »
So much for a video today. I'm gonna pretend I meant next monday. I've mostly been waiting for that varnish to dry enough to sand. It's slow in the cold garage.

Yesterday I made a little box for the electronics, and got it hooked up and tested. Turns the motor/ adjusts the speed just fine but with a proper load and running for a long time, i'm not so sure how long that transistor will hold up in an enclosed box. Won't be hard to replace it and improve the cooling if that happens though.


I spent most of today waiting for glue to dry, sticking two bits of oak together to make a block wide enough for part of the motor mount. It's clamped on here. Didn't get any glue squeezing out vertically so hopefully it wont seize the thing up.


I got to use the dust collector to suck up dust from the thickness planer today though. It's still not sealed up at all but it seems to be separating the dust fairly well. That said the planer produces mostly large chips and i'd imagine the thing would struggle more with the sander dust.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #123 on: March 11, 2015, 10:22:27 AM »


Made a thing for locking the motor. It's cut down on vibrations but they're still there. It'd probably be a good idea to replace the cable ties with jubilee clips but that'd require taking the whole thing apart to get access. I'm not sure if I can be bothered at this point. I guess i'll wait and see how much of a problem the vibrations cause; i'm worried they might give the sanded wood an undulated surface.

It's kind of funny but I never get too excited about finishing projects. I think i've said it before but I started making videos partly as a motivator for finishing things.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Drum/ Thickness Sander
« Reply #124 on: March 11, 2015, 02:57:29 PM »


Had the belt going for a bit and then the epoxy bond broke. I've been fussing most of the day trying different methods to couple the thing till I realised that garden hose has an internal diameter of about 12mm. There's a bit of bar threaded and screwed onto the end of the motor that's epoxied to the hose, and it's held on with a jubilee clip at the roller end. Life is hard without a lathe.

Anyways I kind of jumped the gun in trying it out, so i'm trying it again and letting the epoxy cure overnight. There's room in there to fit two jubilee clips but I'd have to head out and buy a second.

It's all these little things that seem to take the longest. Tomorrow i'll head out and buy another junction box (the one I bought I ended up using with the new lights) and get it neatly wired up. Then there's finishing off the dust hood and attaching the sandpaper to the drum and it should be complete.

I think for the last 10 or so posts in this thread i've been saying it's nearly complete but I think I really mean it this time.