Author Topic: To Paint Or Not To Paint  (Read 6052 times)

Offline mexican jon

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To Paint Or Not To Paint
« on: August 24, 2016, 08:17:14 PM »
I know it really doesn't matter  :scratch: But ?

I'm about to give the myford a good service and whilst the grey paint isn't to bad it has seen better days  :(

I prefer the green that myford used  :thumbup:

So what's people views on repainting machine tools in a different colour  :scratch:

1 day I guess the lathe will be up for sale so is it better to refurbish in it's original colour or will changing the colour have little effect  :scratch:

I know that green coloured myford seem to sell easier and seem to make more money  :bang: that I guess is just a perception that they are better  :loco: or newer which could be true.
People say you only live once ! I say thank F@*K can't afford to do it twice.

Offline mattinker

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2016, 09:16:36 PM »
Whatever floats your boat! There's no accounting for taste!

Regards, Matthew.

Offline chipenter

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2016, 02:09:10 AM »
Better paint than shades of rust .
Jeff

Offline awemawson

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2016, 02:23:32 AM »
I'd always prefer a machine in its original paint albeit a bit tired and chipped than one that's been badly repainted, or tarted up, for sale.

To do a proper job most machines need to be fully dismantled and stripped, and that's a lot of work.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Jo

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2016, 03:07:29 AM »
They also need to be done in the right sort of paint otherwise in no time they are back looking worse than they started. Tool dealers used to have nasty habit of repainting Myfords before they resell them: What should have been a Grey machine was painted Green so they could ask more money for it.

When I look to buy a machine I prefer one that is in its original paint. You can see how its been used or abused.

Having said that I brought a Signal Red  :palm: painted Sixis 101 and I know of a Schaublin SV12 that was a very nasty shade of Jaffa Orange  :loco: when it was picked up. The Sixis had the offending paint scraped off leaving the original (much harder) metallic green and the Schaublin was blasted and re-enamelling its original colour.

Jo

P.S. I was told the two Swiss machines were repainted in "security paint" to make them easily recognised if stolen. If you take the case of the 101 it originally cost more new then your average 3 bed house at the time, it is easily dismantled and fits in the back of a family car, so security was an issue.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 02:44:15 PM by Jo »
So many engines to build and yet so little time.

Offline Will_D

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2016, 05:28:23 PM »
A Myford is a working lathe and is not a precious antique [unless it's the first ML7 or Super 7 made - then it is]

There is no reason to repaint it unless you want to

I personally think the green is just vomit coloured! Give me the early grey!

Dealers who repaint to take a few years off are just charlatans!

There is NO way a paint job can improve the accuracy of a lathe!
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Offline tom osselton

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2016, 07:08:41 PM »
I like the grey although my Clausing is red.

Offline ieezitin

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2016, 07:59:14 PM »
Paint it what colour you like, it dont matter in my opinion, I have been in the machinery world for thirty five years, buying and selling plus using for my own persona use, its not the paint but the quality and manufacturer of the unit that is most important.

you could have for sale a Shaublin 13 mill painted in canary yellow and have two guys look at it with two different philosophies, the practical guy will see what the quality is and dont care about the colour, the second will see the quality and ignore the colour and just re-paint it because he is a purist. Either way you wont lose.

There is a German fella on you-tube that has his entire machine shop machinery painted in German army green, i personally dont like the colour but i see the continuity effect of having a shop with one colour scheme and in my opinion makes a difference to the shop environment.

Anthony.
If you cant fix it, get another hobby.

Offline Fergus OMore

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2016, 03:43:54 AM »

I'm about to give the myford a good service and whilst the grey paint isn't to bad it has seen better days 

What is the 'filler' that builds up the body of the lathe prior to putting on the finishing coats, please?

The question has been posed many times- without anyone getting  a proper answer. FWIW My experience is that once the top coatings are removed, oil and other fluids are absorbed into the cream coloured filler- and prevents proper  re-coating.

Thanks

Norman

Offline awemawson

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2016, 05:04:01 AM »
Norman, I'm sure originally it would have been a form of putty based on 'whiting', but now a days people seem to use one of the many car body fillers based on polyester resin
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Fergus OMore

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2016, 05:51:16 AM »
Thanks Andrew! My suspicions were whiting but with boiled linseed oil  but  with a fair old bit of cobalt napthenate to accelerate the 'gel'

The trouble is trying to get adhesion with the filler soaked with a non drying oil- whereas  it was originally.

I've just acquired an ancient ML10 with the usual successive  tarted up Hammerite re-coatings over the years. 'Scotty' who invented Hammerite is no longer with the firm after leaving RCL at Dunston. Long story- not here though.

 :doh:Thinks that I'll have to  concoct my own  synthetic filler as I did after my  S7B was slideways ground. Trouble is that it is a lot of work on a dead cheap little machine .

Thanks

Norman

Offline awemawson

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2016, 06:28:07 AM »
Some foundries were notorious for making castings look 'fair' by filing blow holes and sinks with a mixture of black lead and iron filings (iron not steel - that's important). Done carefully you could barely tell what had happened  :bugeye:

I seem to remember that there was a concoction of flowers of sulphur and iron filings that set rock hard and could even be tapped (it was claimed)

From: http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/26942-repair-to-a-firepot/

A cement for stopping clefts or fissure of iron vessels can be made of the following: Two ounces muriate of ammonia, I ounce of flowers of sulphur, and I pound of cast-iron filings or borings. Mix these well in a mortar, but keep the mortar dry. When the cement -is wanted, take one part of this and twenty parts of clean iron borings, grind- together in a mortar. Mix water to make a dough of proper consistence and apply between the cracks. This will be useful for flanges or joints of pipes and doors of steam engines.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Fergus OMore

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #12 on: August 26, 2016, 06:34:29 AM »
I agree but I suspect that mercury becomes involved!

Sort of a variant on silver amalgam. Still got a lot of it-as an investment( dental pun used by my late wife) :lol:

Offline PK

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #13 on: August 26, 2016, 06:35:16 AM »
Molten sulfur is used as a rock bolt anchor in some applications.

Offline Manxmodder

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2016, 11:55:04 AM »
They also need to be done in the right sort of paint otherwise in no time they are back looking worse than they started. Tool dealers used to have nasty habit of repainting Myfords before they resell them: What should have been a Grey machine was painted Green so they could ask more money for it.

When I look to buy a machine I prefer one that is in its original paint. You can see how its been used or abused.

Having said that I brought a Signal Red  :palm: painted Sixis 101 and I know of a Schaublin SV12 that was a very nasty shade of Jaffa Orange  :loco: when it was picked up. The Sixis had the offending paint scraped off leaving the original (much harder) metallic green and the Schaublin was blasted and re-enamelling its original colour.

Jo

P.S. I was told the two Swiss machines were repainted in "security paint" to make them easily recognised if stolen. If you take the case of the 101 it originally cost more new then your average 3 bed house at the time, it is easily dismantled and fits in the back of a family car, so security was an issue.

I reckon you couldn't resist a Hardinge in hot pink   :bugeye: .....OZ.
Helixes aren't always downward spirals,sometimes they're screwed up

Offline chipenter

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2016, 11:59:42 AM »
Treat it like a car self etching primer and two pack paint , it's safe iff you brush it on only dangerous to breath the air bourn particals from spraying .
Jeff

Offline Manxmodder

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #16 on: August 26, 2016, 12:00:34 PM »
Some foundries were notorious for making castings look 'fair' by filing blow holes and sinks with a mixture of black lead and iron filings (iron not steel - that's important). Done carefully you could barely tell what had happened  :bugeye:

I seem to remember that there was a concoction of flowers of sulphur and iron filings that set rock hard and could even be tapped (it was claimed)

From: http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/26942-repair-to-a-firepot/

A cement for stopping clefts or fissure of iron vessels can be made of the following: Two ounces muriate of ammonia, I ounce of flowers of sulphur, and I pound of cast-iron filings or borings. Mix these well in a mortar, but keep the mortar dry. When the cement -is wanted, take one part of this and twenty parts of clean iron borings, grind- together in a mortar. Mix water to make a dough of proper consistence and apply between the cracks. This will be useful for flanges or joints of pipes and doors of steam engines.


I seem to remember from an old book that sal ammoniac,sulphur and iron filings was part of the mix for one foundry cement...OZ.
Helixes aren't always downward spirals,sometimes they're screwed up

Offline Manxmodder

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2016, 12:02:09 PM »
Treat it like a car self etching primer and two pack paint , it's safe iff you brush it on only dangerous to breath the air bourn particals from spraying .

Agree,we use 2 pack that way quite often on cast stuff.....OZ
Helixes aren't always downward spirals,sometimes they're screwed up

Offline JerryNotts

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2016, 12:09:02 PM »
I think I ought to throw in some of my relevant experience here as I used to work in a technical role for the two paintmakers which supplied the 'finishing' scheme to most of the manufacturers of machine tools when most were 'Made in Great Britain'.

'Oil based' fillers went out of use in the late 60s due to their slow setting time.

The most recent products used, especially in Nottingham ( where the sales manager lived) and across the '600 Group' involved the use of a polyester body filler followed by an Oil resistant alkyd topcoat.  The filler is closely related to auto body filler but with the binder content sufficient to prevent oil penetration, sanding properties were secondary, unlke those used on  cars. Unfortunately the experts in this field got taken overn over by european owners and as the British machine tool industry, lke the paint industry, is only a shadow of its former self who knows what happes now?

Jerry :beer:

Offline Jo

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Re: To Paint Or Not To Paint
« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2016, 02:24:10 PM »
I reckon you couldn't resist a Hardinge in hot pink   :bugeye: .....OZ.

My Mr Silky is in original Exeter Grey  :thumbup:

Jo
So many engines to build and yet so little time.