Author Topic: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project  (Read 106479 times)

Offline cedge

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Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« on: April 30, 2009, 10:28:28 AM »
Winter is past and the shop is much more environmentally friendly, so the time is here to begin a project I've been studying ever since I bought the "Two Shop Masters" book at cabin fever. The book has plans for a number of engines, but this one caught my eye, so it jumped to the top of my build list. I've never messed with small IC engines until now so I'm curious as to how the project will go. You're invited to come a long as I attempt to take on the "Victorian", designed by the late Philip Duclos. 

The project began with a 4 1/2 inch piece of 6061 aluminum, faced off to length and counter bored on one end. It was them moved to the mill and two flats were added to create a set of datum points for positioning the work piece as things progressed. The piece was turned over in the vise and marked for a hole which has to be bored perpendicular to the length of the work piece. once this hole was center drilled, the work piece was moved to the lathe. A threaded hole was also placed on the "back side" which was supposed to help secure the piece to a face plate when it returned to the lathe.

Things didn't quite work out that way due to the length of the slots in my new face plate. The bolt hole couldn't be used if the work piece was to be centered on the center drilled hole. A few minutes of head scratching was under taken and a simple strap was the solution I came up with. Not extremely elegant, but at least it worked....(grin)



Since I only have two hands and the setup required more, I enlisted the tail stock and a dead center to help hold things while they were secured and rough centered. The dead center was fitted into the center drilled hole to get things close and to apply pressure as I was securing the work piece. This got things close, but the engine will have a crank that is suspended on both ends with close tolerance sintered brass bushings. This means things have to be dead nuts or binding will become a problem... especially since the two support points are going to be located in separate and independent components.



Once things were close to being centered on the center drilled hole, it was time to get everything where it needed to be. Since it is rather difficult to put a DTI on an irregular shaped object, I had to find a way to get a measure from a specific point of interest. In this case it was the center point of a somewhat tricky multiple step boring operation that has to run perpendicular through the length of the engine body.

To achieve this, I employed my friendly "wiggler",  mounted in the tail stock and mated to the center drilled hole. The wiggling motion gave me a fair visual reference of how far out things were, but it's almost impossible to spot which way the work piece needs to move.



In order to get the center drilled hole perfectly centered, I used a DTI and measured the ball at the end of the wiggler. First indications were showing about .030 run total indicated run out (TIR). With a few gentle taps of the brass hammer, things quickly moved to within a couple of thousandths of the lathe centerline. The last couple of thousandths were a ticklish bit of adjustment but the final reading indicated a TIR of .0005. That should be more than close enough to work.



The engine body is now ready to be drilled and bored. Lots of parts yet to make, so this promises to be a long thread.

Steve 
« Last Edit: April 30, 2009, 10:33:07 AM by cedge »

Offline Brass_Machine

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2009, 10:55:36 AM »
Ahhhh very good.    :clap: I bought that book 2 years ago only for the plans of that engine. I will be watching this thread closely!

Eric 
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Offline sbwhart

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2009, 12:35:00 PM »
Steve Very interesting  :thumbup:

looking forward to seeing the engine develop.

Stew


A little bit of clearance never got in the road
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Location:- Crewe Cheshire

Offline cedge

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2009, 01:29:22 PM »
Eric
After having the chance to look through both of the Duclos books, I too have become quite the fan of his work. After trying his "curved flywheel" instructions, I quickly learned that he is not to be ignored. He had the instructions distilled down to their essence.... no more or less information than is required to do the job properly. Ignore a step and you'll come to a dead end in a hurry. I really hope this one turns out well. I'll be quite disappointed if it doesn't.

Steve

Offline Darren

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2009, 02:07:23 PM »
I'm going to enjoy watching this one Steve, got a picture of what it looks like finished? I did google but the chap seems to have built many engine  :bow:
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline cedge

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2009, 08:43:44 PM »
A photo can be seen at http://216.197.127.227/Gallery/exhibitorpages/kipp.html .  Third photo down the page

Steve

Offline sbwhart

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2009, 01:02:50 AM »
That's a nice looking engine thanks for showing, it will make a real interesting build

Stew
A little bit of clearance never got in the road
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Location:- Crewe Cheshire

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2009, 03:51:09 AM »
I`ve no idea what you are building Steve.  ::)

But, I really love your wobbler/ dti set up!  :headbang:

I`m watching........  :thumbup:

David D
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2009, 11:50:18 AM »
Ok Steve,

I'm interested in where you are going with this one... I haven't and do not intend to see what the original looks like... I'll wait for you to finish before I do that  :)


I just like it that way :thumbup:


If it comes anything close to your other engines this should be quite a thread  :headbang:




Ralph.
I know what I know and need to know more!!!

Offline cedge

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2009, 08:16:20 PM »
After a couple of days delay due to soccer games and a local engine show, I managed to get back in the shop today, for a few minutes.

The work piece will eventually become a contoured body for the engine which will house the crank and piston rod. This required, what was for me, a bit of a challenging bore cut. The first cut was your typical straight through bored measuring 1.125 in diameter. The outer cut will soon accept a plate with a "oilite" (sintered) bronze bushing and measures 1.8125. Neither were difficult, although the larger diameter was an interrupted cut.

The challenge came in when the third cut was made. The cut had to be centered within the work piece, it would be 15/16 inch (.9375) wide and 1.975 (1 /78) inches in diameter.  OH yeah..... it would be made completely in the blind with only a couple of witness marks and the dials to guide me.  NOOOOOO Sweat....right?

The delay getting back in the shop gave me time to do some mental machining and by the time I began I felt like I had a fair grip on the procedure. The photo below shows the completed cut.



The recently acquired boring bars offer me the ability to mount HSS cutters at 45° or at 90° and are significantly more rigid than the cheap carbide set I bought so long ago. The added plus of being able to easily adjust the cutter depth was indespensible for this particular job. The huge honking tool holder seems to help dampen vibration a bit.... even if it looks funny.



Yeah... the cutter does look a little odd too. Duclos suggested the strange looking end grind to reduce chatter and it really did make a noticeable difference. The sides also have a tapered cutting edge which made for encountering the side walls of the cavity with very little chatter. The double edge is there because the cutter would be running to corners in both directions of travel. The "cupid bow" end minimized tool contact and further reduced chatter. This is an idea I'll be experimenting with when doing other types of bore cuts. 



For those considering doing a Duclos project, be prepared to follow his instructions to the letter. After having taken on this, my second of his tutorials, it has become obvious that he has boiled procedure down to it's essence. He offers up no wasted steps and you skip one at your own peril. He makes things as easy and common sense as they can be made. Case in point....

Since the cut is being made in the blind, he suggested using tape and a couple of witness marks to keep you in control of things. He also takes you step by step while making sure you properly zero the dials, taking into consideration the adjustments to compensate for the tool size. In short, he's been there, done that and doesn't want to abuse a newbie, but he is never condescending about it.



From here the work piece will be transfered back the mill for a couple of steps before it comes back to the lathe for shaping.

There were some concerns about the face plate setup. It proved to be quite stable, however, I was still quite cautious about my proximity to it and the lathe was run no higher than 180 RPM to make sure it all stayed stable. This was my first time using a face plate and I must admit it won't be my last choice anymore. It certainly offers quite a wide range of possible setups. More tools in the arsenal...eh?

Steve

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2009, 08:47:12 PM »
Steve,

That is a very interesting shape on the boring bar, I can only assume it is designed to act like a round nosed turning tool, but multiplied by two, to give a progressive cut as it is fed and leave behind a nice surface finish. I can definitely see where it would reduce chatter after the initial plunge. I have seen a similar style used on parting tools, but with sharp outside edges.

If the man says do it, then you should. Even though maybe a bit terse, he has been there before and is trying to help out in difficult situations that are not normally encountered, allowing the engine to be built when someone has limited technique knowledge. You can always do a bit of shape changing if you want to put your own mark on it at a later time.

I can't wait to see the next bit.

John

Offline Darren

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #11 on: May 05, 2009, 02:40:04 AM »
That's looking good Steve, Interesting ideas there.... :ddb:

I shall be watching this one develop.....nice idea with the tape, some joe scratched marks in the paint on my S&B lathe to do this job.... :doh:
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Offline sbwhart

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2009, 03:40:26 AM »
Very nice write up Steve and a very interesting bit of machining,

I like your comment:-

"The delay getting back in the shop gave me time to do some mental machining and by the time I began I felt like I had a fair grip on the procedure. The photo below shows the completed cut".

Mental machine is something I do all the time gets me into trouble with the Boss, you know how it goes:- Boss- "shall we go and visit my Sister" - no answer - "is there something else you want to do"  no answer - "well if you don't want to speak to me I don't know what I've done wrong"  - "ho what were you saying I wasn't listening "   :hammer:  :wack:  :hammer:  :wack:    :lol:

Back to your machining I've seen that forked tool recomended before I think it was in one of Tubal Cains book he called it a snakes tounge.

I was wondering:- in doing the recess you can't see what your doing as things a round the corner would you get a better vew if you ran the machine in reveres and had the tool on the other side this way the action would be facing you.

Have fun

Stew
A little bit of clearance never got in the road
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Location:- Crewe Cheshire

Offline cedge

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2009, 11:48:53 PM »
Managed to get the mill work done and then moved the engine body back to the lathe to begin shaping it. Contouring began with lots of rough cutting to get some generalized dimensions. I chose to free hand the contours, rather than sticking totally to Duclos's stylization.  This proved to be an interesting exercise in both patience and eye hand coordination. To avoid any sharp edges ort corners, I used a rounded end cutter that is used for everyday roughing cuts.

As you can see.....things sometimes have to get to looking pretty bad before they get better....(grin)



Here is the work piece as the foot of the engine body began to take shape. Notice the roughing cuts..... not pretty and a bit brutal, but they did move a lot of metal fast.



Here the contour of the lower half is beginning to take on its final shape. The roughing cuts were refined a bit and then I broke out the files to fine tune things. A bit of sand paper was then used to remove the file marks. The base end was contoured first since the other end will be rounded and will no longer lend itself to being chucked in the lathe. The flat surfaces of the base will chuck just fine.



Lots to do.  Gears and bushings to order, a crank to turn and a platform and support to shape before I begin the upper engine section and governor. One perfect part at a time.... one perfect part at a time.... one perf....

Steve

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2009, 12:30:18 AM »
Lovely stuff Steve, that sure is a nice seductive and tactile curve on that part. Makes you just want to stroke it.

Many people are scared to death of trying to hand contour pieces like you have, but you have shown it to perfection. A little time, plus one eye on the chuck for safety, and the other on the job in hand, can produce wonderful works of art, and this is getting back to the basics of turning, before toolposts et al. Plus it produces the finished article a lot quicker than people realise.

When I show some of my own work off, people can't believe that it was turned by hand, and expect it to be produced on a CNC machine.

I can see this engine becoming an absolute stunner, with your eye for detail and artistic flair.


John


BTW, if Chris is reading this, have a look at Steves' toolpost, it is the same type as Arc Euro do for your lathe.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2009, 12:38:24 AM by bogstandard »

Offline cedge

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #15 on: May 06, 2009, 01:36:02 AM »
Thanks for the support, guys. I'm having a lot of fun so far and the challenges have been part of it.

Stew
I looked at the idea of running in reverse, but the tool would still have been out of sight. The well was nearly an inch inside the outer surface and disappearing behind the flange it was creating. There was barely enough clearance to use a long pair of needle nosed pliers to dig out the rapidly collecting swarf. It was pretty much Hobson's Choice, so I did it the way the book suggested. It wasn't that bad a cut, although it was a little "awkard". I just had to trust the dials since there was no readily apparent way to get in there to measure the well.  Luckily, the C4 lathe is a good deal more trustworthy than my old 7x14 in that respect.

John
As you've already guessed, I like things with an organic look... and yea... I've already found myself stroking the surface to confirm what my eyes were showing me. It definitely has that nice organic feel. I too have been called a liar for claiming to have hand machined my last engine project. A local CNC guy looked me in the eye and told me those flywheels were impossible to make manually, and with his 30 some years in the trade, he knew for sure that I had them CNC'd.  I just smiled and said nothing... not wanting to endanger my best source of scrap aluminum.

Once I sorted out the best way to make stepped cuts predictably, the contouring was not a bad bit of work. The tough part is working over the open holes with a file. That has proven to be a little tricky. I'm currently using steel wool and sand paper to remove the last of the marks where the file bounced and left some nasty cross hatch marks. Tomorrow, I swap ends and try for a pair of much tighter radii.

Steve

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #16 on: May 06, 2009, 02:37:43 AM »
Now that's what I like......  :clap: 

That there has a fantastic shape  :thumbup:  (still no idea what the original looks like either.... I'm quite looking forward to seeing the comparison at the end  :))

It's great what a man can do when he just lets his hands do the work  :headbang:





Very much looking forward to the rest   :ddb:




Ralph.

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Offline sbwhart

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #17 on: May 06, 2009, 02:58:56 AM »
Nice Job Steve.

I have problems getting nice smooth contour like that I think it must be my eye sight I wear veryfocul safety glasses in the shop it may be down to them.

Good work getting that recess done as well it souded like a real tricky job, I take it you like the C4 I've got a new lathe on my long term shopping list and the C4 is one of my options.

Look forward to your next post

Cheers

Stew
A little bit of clearance never got in the road
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Location:- Crewe Cheshire

Offline Darren

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #18 on: May 06, 2009, 05:07:20 AM »
Steve, just wanted to let you know there's another watching this build with keen interest.... :nrocks:

Looking great so far  :thumbup:
You will find it a distinct help… if you know and look as if you know what you are doing. (IRS training manual)

Offline kvom

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #19 on: May 06, 2009, 08:48:15 AM »
This is cool!  Being within driving distance I expect to see it in person one of these days.  :thumbup:

Is there a reason you couldn't make the holes by boring on the mill rather than turning?

Offline cedge

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #20 on: May 06, 2009, 09:00:39 PM »
Today saw the engine base contouring completed and the crank bearing plate fitted. The rest of it was mostly touching up the final shape and polishing out tool marks. Not a lot of excitement, but a nice feeling of accomplishment. Below are the front and rear views. If you look closely, you can also see the opening for the connecting rod in the top of the base.

Steve





Offline Bernd

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #21 on: May 06, 2009, 09:10:48 PM »
I'm reserving comment for when the engine is done and running, but I just have to comment on the nice finish on that part Steve.

All I can say is WOW.  :jaw:

Bernd
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Offline sbwhart

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #22 on: May 07, 2009, 01:25:10 AM »
Coor Blimey Steve what a shiner.

Great Job

Stew
A little bit of clearance never got in the road
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Location:- Crewe Cheshire

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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #23 on: May 07, 2009, 10:57:42 AM »
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo........... Shiny    :headbang: 



I like that Steve, I like that a lot  :thumbup:





Ralph.
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Re: Philip Duclos "Victorian" IC engine project
« Reply #24 on: May 07, 2009, 11:19:21 AM »
Now about the top picture.


Just who's ashes are inside it?


Bogs