Author Topic: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder  (Read 49381 times)

Offline Joules

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3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« on: December 18, 2015, 03:22:14 PM »
Right, suspending all disbelief that anyone could be as insane, as to suggest a "PLASTIC" tool and cutter grinder.  How would you go about making the Quorn using off the shelf components for shafts spindles and bars.  Would you use steel pipe/cut up cycle frame, copper water pipe!!! for the bars.  Can we print a mould to cast the spiral column onto a metal or carbon fibre tube, will it be anchored as much to the base board as fixed in the printed "casting".  Incorporate skateboard bearings where rotation is needed in parts and so spread the load through the printed part.  The 3D printed parts could mostly hide the skeletal subframe, or maybe, the printed parts will be strong enough ?   Until its been tried and disproved don't assume it can't be done.   How would you go about tackling it.   I will make a start on this idea (that doesn't mean it will reach completion, or maybe abandoned due to it sagging on a hot day)  Lets try pushing the tech here and see if it can't inspire others to try.   More and more people are going to have 3D printers, so they might as well have decent projects to try making.   Those fortunate enough can look on this and think, well I could make patterns that way for casting.   Let the chaos commence

 :mmr:
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Offline chipenter

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2015, 03:27:04 PM »
Plenty of groung bar available for linear bearings I would start with reserching those .
Jeff

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2015, 03:33:45 PM »
Good thinking Jeff, but lets assume our hapless adventurer doesn't have the knowledge of such stuff and only his local hardware store etc. and what he can find as scrap if he's lucky.  This guy has a Mini lathe and maybe a small mill/drill at his disposal, otherwise why is he trying to build a tool and cutter grinder.   :scratch:  Oh, and of course he bought a 3D printer thinking it would be the end of him ever having to learn how to machine stuff or buy any other materials and he would bang stuff out like an Argos conveyor belt.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline awemawson

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2015, 03:34:49 PM »
No reason that a Quorn like machine couldn't be made from weldments. Have to be normalised after welding to stabilize them.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2015, 03:45:09 PM »
Ahhh Andrew, this guy spent his hard earned on the 3D printer, he's young and somewhat foolish.  Welding is one of those tasks to be feared, for setting fire to the shed, or discovering that arc welding in the house ruins the lino or carpets, if your posh....   Try to focus on this as being primarily a 3D printed challenge, but Screwfix is only a bus ride away if it gets really tough.

We all have experience in machining, but what about the next generation builders being brought up on 3D printers.  How to entice them to the denser side of materials technology.  One day they will have 3D metal printers, but not quite yet.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline sparky961

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2015, 04:20:22 PM »
If we're just talking about slides/ways, here are a few ideas:

Cold rolled round stock - Found at many hardware stores, farm stores, and steel suppliers that cater to small business and hobby.  About the most dimensionally consistent material you can find at a hardware store.  Polish it up in a lathe and you can make it even better.  Gingery's books talk about using rectangular CRS bar for the box ways of the lathe and mill.

O1 (Silver steel, tool steel) - Found at the small steel supplier.  Though more elusive than cold rolled, it's also much smoother and closer to size (though not as good as many people expect).  TGP (turned, ground, polished) is much better yet, but also much harder to find.

Galvanized angle iron - I'm thinking about the stuff made from sheet metal with holes punched in it.  Sold at most any large hardware store around this area.  I'm willing to bet it would make for a pretty smooth ride for a bearing with a V-groove.  Again, even better with some hand work polishing things up a bit.

Drawer slides - The heavy duty kind with ball bearings have always whispered to me that they need to be made into something interesting.  Some sort of arrangement would need to be in place to take up the play but definitely a smooth ride and likely quite linear.

ERW Tube/Box Section - In long sections this can have some pretty bad twists and bows.  Also if it sits around for too long or out in the weather you end up with rusty scrap.  However, get it new and from a reliable mill and it would probably make a good track for a bearing.  I'm sure the guy that spent money on the 3D printer would spring for a grinder with wire wheel to polish things up a bit.

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2015, 04:26:41 PM »
Sparky961, that doesn't sound bad and yep, recon our adventurer might spring to an Aldi angle grinder and brush, if nothing more that to brush the worn teflon off his stainless frying pan, beats using a pan scrubber...
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2015, 04:42:22 PM »
Does anyone have the approx weight of a built Quorn.  Ours isn't going to weigh that much, but its not a bad idea to design it for that weight and some.   Looking at the base bar supports now and thinking they need to be fully supported along the bottom of the casting/print rather than just a foot.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline chipenter

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2015, 04:42:58 PM »
There is also key steel found in tool stores and bearing supplies in 300mm lenghts .
Jeff

Offline PeterE

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2015, 04:47:50 PM »
I guess you could use ordinary steel plumbing pipe for ways, clean them up in the lathe and fill with concrete/epoxi+sand for weigth  :scratch:

/Peter
Always at the edge of my abilities, too often beyond ;-)

Offline mattinker

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2015, 05:02:16 PM »
I may be being somewhat of a wet blanket, but why would your individual know what a Quorn was? With his limited machines what use would he have for a Quorn. He could of course look at the Bonelle, it uses steel stock and no weldments.

Regards, Matthew

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2015, 05:03:04 PM »
As I will be printing in PLA this will actually be a Corn based Quorn   :bugeye:
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline RotarySMP

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2015, 05:05:37 PM »
Precision ground shaft is cheap. Dont waste your time looking for an alternative. 3d print the caasting parts with minimal infill, then lost PLA cast them in iron.
Mark

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2015, 05:06:23 PM »
Matthew, he spotted one on the internet when he went hunting to find out why all his blunt tools wouldn't work.   Whilst he was search he found some MAD old fool in 2016 made one out of PLASTIC !!! on a then 3D printer and he left all his plans for others to try.    :thumbup:
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline awemawson

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2015, 05:15:51 PM »
"Whilst he was search he found some MAD old fool in 2016 made one out of PLASTIC !!!"



Blimey, as well as not welding he must be psychic - can he tell me what else is going to happen in 2016  :lol: :lol:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #15 on: December 18, 2015, 05:47:25 PM »
He didn't win the lottery   :(

I have just started scaling parts and found that some of the castings done full size exceed the size of the print bed I am using, so not only is it PLASTIC, but it's scaled down a bit  :palm:

Like I said our hero was pretty desperate and was probably related to said MAD fool....

We are just going to see how far we can go with 3D printed parts...  It may or may not work   :poke:
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline Pete49

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2015, 10:39:23 PM »
interesting project here and quite apt. I've got a cold drink(s) and popcorn ....let the build begin  :lol:
Pete
oops..........oh no.........blast now I need to redo it

Offline Baron

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2015, 07:24:37 AM »
Good Morning Norman,

Mine- the Quorn is under the bench unused for years

Norman

I reckon that it needs a little loving  :bugeye:
 
 
Best Regards:
                     Baron

RobWilson

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2015, 08:04:20 AM »
looks like this thread will be going South  :bang:


Rob

Offline nrml

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2015, 11:03:19 AM »
Why not make the larger 'castings' in two or more pieces and mount them on a metal slab or bar? Alternatively, for someone with your skills, making a cast polyurethane item would be a walk in the park.
He didn't win the lottery   :(

I have just started scaling parts and found that some of the castings done full size exceed the size of the print bed I am using, so not only is it PLASTIC, but it's scaled down a bit  :palm:

Like I said our hero was pretty desperate and was probably related to said MAD fool....

We are just going to see how far we can go with 3D printed parts...  It may or may not work   :poke:

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #20 on: December 19, 2015, 11:10:36 AM »
nrml, looking at that as an option to make best use of printed grain in parts.   Post some CAD ideas in a few days, once I cobble a list of materials I have or need to get started.  Not expecting a printed Quorn to behave and handle tooling as per a metal engineered machine, but hope it will handle fine work without too much flexing.   Thats the aim anyway, and to just see where we go.  Norman got it, in that rigidity will be the biggest issue.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline tom osselton

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #21 on: December 19, 2015, 02:39:45 PM »
How big is your print area on your 3d printer? It is posible to make it in two halves with a reinforcing shaft that goes through it along with locating pins.

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #22 on: December 19, 2015, 03:16:28 PM »
I am just having a mess about with the CAD file now.  The bed on this machine is 150mm square so I can almost squeeze it in at 45 degree across the bed.  However I am looking at making this part in two pieces as I want the printed layers in two planes to maximise the material strength.  I think the vertical column part of the casting will have a section tee'd into the main casting to pick up one of the bars.  I can then plastic weld these parts together.  Otherwise my option is to split the casting between the bars and insert an alloy plate that has been bored to tie the bars and bridge the printed parts, this could also be applied to the other printed casting for the other end.   I am still doodling those ideas.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup:

Offline awemawson

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #23 on: December 19, 2015, 03:45:09 PM »
Does anyone have the approx weight of a built Quorn.  Ours isn't going to weigh that much, but its not a bad idea to design it for that weight and some.   Looking at the base bar supports now and thinking they need to be fully supported along the bottom of the casting/print rather than just a foot.

Looking back through my records, the last Quorn that I sold, which was fully equipped, with all collets, spare wheels etc and in a fitted case had a packed weight of 40kGs.. This was a particularly nice one that I had bought from a deceased estate but had been left in a shed to rust by the family for far too long before they sold it.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Joules

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Re: 3D Printed Quorn Tool & Cutter Grinder
« Reply #24 on: December 19, 2015, 04:01:05 PM »
This is what I propose to do with the printed casting.  I have done parts like this in the past and then welded the edges.  The column part will be printed as is, the bar support printed on its side to make best use of the printed parts strength.



As for motor, I am not expecting to use the standard motor, maybe a brushless outrunner as I don't expect to grind the same amount as a full cast iron based Quorn and thank you for a guide on weight.
Just get doing and make swarf, you can decide what its going to be later.   :thumbup: