Author Topic: Close. But, no Cigar.......  (Read 5034 times)

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Close. But, no Cigar.......
« on: April 05, 2017, 05:57:18 PM »
Hello All.....

I'm just emerging, from the winter hybernation period, spring cleaning, round toits, gonna do's, etc......

Mid February, another orphan flame licker arrived. This one's, tiny!   :scratch:
 As I understand. Made in Germany. Travelled to Denmark. Then to Hereford. (UK). Finally, to my door, in Derbyshire.

No arrival pics. Here's, Little Munchkin.......







Bore, 13mm. Stroke, 11mm. Not ideal dimensions.......

The cam, was an eccentric.......




Now, it is a 120* cam. With 6mm lift.........




The undersize, alloy piston. Was replaced with graphite. The cotton wick replaced with s/s mesh.

I've done all I can think of, to bring this orphan to life.........




Close. But, no cigar! (I think, I'm trying to change the laws of physics)......

Any further ideas? Anyone? Pleese.....

David.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 05:39:50 PM by Stilldrillin »
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline sbwhart

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3520
  • Country: gb
  • Smile, Be Happy, Have Fun and Rock Until you Drop
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2017, 03:13:13 AM »
Hi Dave

Good to see your back in the shed, working on the orphans. I've no suggestion with this one, but I'd take a bet that you'll get it working.

Stew
A little bit of clearance never got in the road
 :wave:

Location:- Crewe Cheshire

Offline fcheslop

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
  • Country: gb
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2017, 11:08:46 AM »
Thinner valve or try Jan Ridders newer valve idea. Poppins is about three thou from memory
cheers
History is scarcely capable of preserving the memory of anything except myths

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2017, 05:52:22 PM »
Hi Dave

Good to see your back in the shed, working on the orphans. I've no suggestion with this one, but I'd take a bet that you'll get it working.

Stew

Hiya Stew!
 Thanks for your confidence, in my prowess....... I'm having a few doubts, with this one!  :scratch:

David.
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2017, 05:58:39 PM »
Thinner valve or try Jan Ridders newer valve idea. Poppins is about three thou from memory
cheers

Frazer.
 Thanks for the drawings!  :thumbup: Though, I don't see how I could adapt, to this one......  :scratch:

I think, the last try, will be a piece of feeler gauge.

Thing is.... There's nothing actually wrong with it! It's so tiny, anything slightly out of spec is a problem....   

David.
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2017, 12:42:07 PM »
After some deliberation. I made a couple more mods.

New cam. This time, 180*. Which seems more logical, to me.......




Modded the wick tube, slightly. To give a wider flame, at the port area......




The test, (not quite), run......




That's the second time, it has perked up, on camera!
 Though..... Mrs. Drillin was doing the filming. (We all try harder, when She's around).......  :thumbup:

Seems. The only mod left, is to ditch the 1/4" dia saucer, and fit a shim valve. Like Poppin(?).....




Beginning to feel a little desperate, now....

Thanks for looking in!

David.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 05:41:51 PM by Stilldrillin »
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline SwarfnStuff

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 529
  • Country: au
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2017, 02:35:28 AM »
Getting betterer and betterer David. You will get that cigar yet,  :clap:  but, by then you might have given them up.
        Your rescue efforts are always a good read.
Thanks for posting.
John B
Converting good metal into swarf sometimes ending up with something useful. ;-)

Offline fcheslop

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
  • Country: gb
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2017, 02:04:36 PM »
Hi marra, just looking at youre pics and the cylinder head thingy ma bob. On all my gulpers when the port is closed the valve only just covers it yourse seems to have a lot of over lap maybe talking out of my backside just an observation
cheers
History is scarcely capable of preserving the memory of anything except myths

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2017, 04:29:56 PM »
Getting betterer and betterer David. You will get that cigar yet,  :clap:  but, by then you might have given them up.
        Your rescue efforts are always a good read.
Thanks for posting.
John B

Thanks for that, John!  :thumbup:

Hi marra, just looking at youre pics and the cylinder head thingy ma bob. On all my gulpers when the port is closed the valve only just covers it yourse seems to have a lot of over lap maybe talking out of my backside just an observation
cheers

Heyup Frazer.

 Do you think it really matters?  :scratch:  ..... As long as the port is fully opened/ closed. Any, over movement, would be absorbed in the very imprecise timing.......

Frankly. I couldn't get the disc any lower down. Cos' it's too close to the operating lever....... 


Anyroad!
 After making two, shim valves. Which broke, as they couldn't stand the necessary bends, to seal the port......  :bang: :bang:

I went onto something else.

A rig, to allow all day running of my low temp engines, on show days......




A decent result, at last!  :D

Thanks for looking in.
David.
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline tom osselton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 964
  • Country: ca
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2017, 02:45:48 AM »
Very nice!

Offline fcheslop

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
  • Country: gb
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2017, 02:30:22 PM »
It may alter the timing as the port will be closed earlier. I had a similar problem on my first ever gulper build  a Duclos one and it was due to to much overlap and from memory he mentions in the build article to just allow it to overlap. May not be of any help but you never know with these little beggars
Nothing hot air this end just building steam engines at the mo
cheers
History is scarcely capable of preserving the memory of anything except myths

Offline BillTodd

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 818
  • Country: 00
  • Colchester Essex (where the lathes were made)
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2017, 07:01:44 AM »
 Random thoughts….

Polish the inside of the cylinder.  These engines rely on the lowering of pressure as the plasma condenses to a hot gas,  The plasma (flame)  has very little thermal mass so cools and condenses very very quickly,  To get as much of the good stuff in the cylinder as possible  you need to keep it hot . The plasma loses heat mostly by radiation , so polishing the internals will keep those energetic photons bouncing back into the plasma.


Lap the valve or have a larger overlap (smaller hole? ).   The pressure difference is tiny so any leakage  will reduce power. I wonder if someone has drilled the hole oversize to let more 'gas' in?

Bill

Offline vtsteam

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5421
  • Country: us
  • Republic of Vermont
    • www. sredmond.com
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2017, 09:56:00 AM »
Love reading your threads, David!  :beer:
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
www.sredmond.com

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2018, 05:58:22 PM »
Well......

I was so browned off, with this tiny bundle of bits. Wasted enough time on it. So, I sent it back to Herefordshire.

This afternoon. A video arrived.......




Seems, Phil has the necessary magic!  :clap:

I think. In future. He can do the commissioning for me......
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Chuck in E. TN

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 566
  • Country: us
  • USAF Retired
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #14 on: February 20, 2018, 08:06:02 AM »
Suspense is killing us! What did he do to fix it? You can't leave us hanging...
Chuck in E. TN
Famous TN last words: "Hey ya'll, watch this..."
MicroMark 7x14, HF X2 mill, Green 4x6 saw. Harbor Freight 170A mig

Offline Brass_Machine

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5274
  • Country: us
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #15 on: February 20, 2018, 02:01:34 PM »
A little late to the party. Nice to see it running Dave!

BUT that LTD!

 :bugeye: :bugeye: :bugeye: :bugeye: :bugeye: :jaw: :jaw: :jaw: :jaw: :jaw:
Science is fun.

We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #16 on: February 20, 2018, 05:25:12 PM »
Suspense is killing us! What did he do to fix it? You can't leave us hanging...

Chuck. This is his explanation, on our steamtoys forum......

David ( Stilldrillin ) did so much work on a little flame gulper engine of mine and sadly he had to send it back last year as it just wouldn't run .

I just wouldn't give up on this little beauty so every now and again I would get the engine out and maybe have a fiddly with it or adjust something then I got to looking at the meths burner  so I tried different wicks and adjusted the length of the wick then it sort of run SO back in the cupboard it went then perhaps a week or so later I would get this little FG engine out and I noticed the slide which covers the cylinder hole was knocking the wick so I then altered the height of the burner and found if
I altered how close or far away from the cylinder it was then the engine WOULD run but at different speeds.

Well some have asked how small  " Little Munchkin " is  ..


David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #17 on: February 20, 2018, 05:29:35 PM »
A little late to the party. Nice to see it running Dave!

BUT that LTD!

 :bugeye: :bugeye: :bugeye: :bugeye: :bugeye: :jaw: :jaw: :jaw: :jaw: :jaw:

Thanks, Eric.

The LTD? I'm a bit disappointed, no-one thinks it is worth a comment.......  :scratch:

I guess, everyone has moved on. There's little interest in engines, on here anymore.......  :(
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline vtsteam

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5421
  • Country: us
  • Republic of Vermont
    • www. sredmond.com
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #18 on: February 20, 2018, 06:29:54 PM »
Not so fast!

I love engines David -- just hadn't seen that one, because I often don't watch YouTube links -- they're blocked for me (I just see a black square in the post), unless I specifically enable them for some reason. Sorry to others also, who only post videos, and not pix -- I rarely read those threads, unless what your video is about is explained and there are photos in the post -- just me..... I'm a reader more than a viewer.

Anyhoo, love the little engine David, and the LTD, well what can I say, but obviously I like that one, since I've owned the same one for several years! Here's mine:



BTW when I first got it I did an experiment with it, I made a new displacer from white ScotchGuard and it worked quite well with a porous displacer -- as a regenerator.

Anyway, the more engines the merrier as far as I'm concerned!
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
www.sredmond.com

Online RussellT

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 411
  • Country: gb
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2018, 05:16:43 AM »
David

I'm always interested to read your posts - I'm sure there are lots of other lurkers too.

Russell

Offline kayzed1

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 203
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2018, 07:10:34 AM »
Me as well, i love all these motors/engines that you bring back to life, just wish i could do the same/or even make one that works..Thanks for all your good work.
Lyn.

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2018, 07:57:36 AM »
Hello Steve.

I have to agree. The two engines, do show a close family resemblance.....

Anyhoo, love the little engine David, and the LTD, well what can I say, but obviously I like that one, since I've owned the same one for several years! Here's mine:



BTW when I first got it I did an experiment with it, I made a new displacer from white ScotchGuard and it worked quite well with a porous displacer -- as a regenerator.


But. Based on Eric's enthusiastic reaction.
 I assumed, he was referring to this posting....... https://madmodder.net/index.php/topic,12389.0.html
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Stilldrillin

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4923
  • Country: gb
  • Staveley, Derbyshire. England.
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2018, 08:00:47 AM »
Russel, Lyn. Thank you! :thumbup:

It's nice to know, someone's appreciating.....
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline Brass_Machine

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5274
  • Country: us
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #23 on: February 21, 2018, 01:20:11 PM »

The LTD? I'm a bit disappointed, no-one thinks it is worth a comment.......  :scratch:

I guess, everyone has moved on. There's little interest in engines, on here anymore.......  :(

Nope. I wouldn't say that. Plenty of interest here.
Science is fun.

We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.

Offline Brass_Machine

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5274
  • Country: us
Re: Close. But, no Cigar.......
« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2018, 01:22:11 PM »

But. Based on Eric's enthusiastic reaction.
 I assumed, he was referring to this posting....... https://madmodder.net/index.php/topic,12389.0.html

That one is beautiful too... But I was talking about the one in this post.
Science is fun.

We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.