Author Topic: Shop vacuum cleaner  (Read 12997 times)

Offline AdeV

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Shop vacuum cleaner
« on: July 11, 2010, 04:37:00 PM »
Some months ago, I bought myself a 50 quid Brush wet&dry vacuum cleaner from Argos, for use in the shop. It looked ideal, cheap & cheerful, and it ought to be able to handle oily swarf.

One of these:

Apparently not.... tonight, it let the magic smoke out in pretty spectacular fashion. Which is annoying, and means I had to finish off tonight's machining with the air compressor, so now I have little bits of aluminium swarf in my hair, ears, nose, .... you get the picture.

What vacuum would you recommend I use? Obviously it needs to be available in the UK, and I'd like to avoid paying silly money if possible... its typical task will be hoovering up chips as I make them (normally, they'll be dry if I'm doing that), or cleaning up an oil/swarf mixture after a machining op is complete - either WD40 (ali) or heavy cutting oil (steel).
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline colin563

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2010, 05:08:22 PM »
ive been using a dyson i paid £20

been going about 12 months oil and swarf no problems 

i did use the missus dyson but she moaned about oil on the handle


colin

Offline John Stevenson

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2010, 05:46:55 PM »
Don't buy a Black and Decker, their shop vacs are the only Black and Decker product that don't suck...........

.
John Stevenson

Rob.Wilson

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2010, 06:19:26 PM »
Kobe vac from Cromwell tools ,   http://www.cromwell.co.uk/KBE2792523K   ,I got it free when the company i was working for  bought 200 9" GRINDING DISC'S  :med: ,

Must be good n  has an "I" at the end of the model number  :lol: :lol: :lol: :D

Rob
« Last Edit: July 11, 2010, 06:23:03 PM by Rob.Wilson »

Offline Divided he ad

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2010, 08:17:22 PM »
Try a bit of this Ade.....


&feature=channel



Looks like just the job?




Ralph.
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Offline andyf

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2010, 02:16:08 AM »
At present, I use a very old cylinder vac, with its paper bag replaced with a cloth one (the sleeve cut off an old shirt, with a clip closing the nether end for emptying purposes) and a custom super-thin crevice tool to fit down T-slots. It won't last forever, though, so I too was thinking of a cyclone.
Here's another one, rather neater - well, it would be, because Mr Ishimura  :bow: made it:
http://homepage3.nifty.com/amigos/57_cyclone_dust_collector/cyclone_dust_collector-e.htm 
It's in English, so if that's your language, click Cancel if offered a translation.

Andy
Sale, Cheshire
I've cut the end off it twice, but it's still too short

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2010, 02:22:18 AM »
I also use an  old cylinder vac. Still got 3 spare bags in stock.  :thumbup:

I love your idea of an old shirt sleeve  Andy!  :clap:

David D
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Offline HS93

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2010, 03:14:31 AM »
we Have a built in ,BUT I got a tub from Aldi last year that was for hoovering hot ash from a grate with any hoover (yes there are other's) it cost a tenner and came with a metal hose, great for swarf its about a 10 gallon drum with overcentre clips.

but I like the last two posts very nice and neat

peter
I am usless at metalwork, Oh and cannot spell either . failure

Offline kwackers

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2010, 05:16:54 AM »
I'll second the cyclone idea further up - except it doesn't even need to be a cyclone. Just get a drum and put two fittings in the lid separated from each other.
Metal is heavy and the airflow in the drum slow so there's not enough airspeed to carry it to the intake.

tumutbound

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2010, 05:43:36 AM »
Here's an excellent forum []http://www.woodworkforums.com/f200/]that is all about dust collection.
Most of the users are woodworkers but there's a lot of them that do metalwork as well, they just don't talk about it as much.   :thumbup:

MrFluffy

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2010, 06:16:00 AM »
I'll second the cyclone idea further up - except it doesn't even need to be a cyclone. Just get a drum and put two fittings in the lid separated from each other.
Metal is heavy and the airflow in the drum slow so there's not enough airspeed to carry it to the intake.


Add a simple mesh filter onto the out pipe and you have a ash vacumn cleaner adapter (buche d'cendriers). I know we all make our own usually but theyre only 10e to buy here and come with overcentre latches for the drum lid and are made of steel with a spiral wound metal hose for the job etc.
I use one on my vax in wet mode...

Offline raynerd

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2010, 06:17:53 AM »
I have a Henry which works super!

Offline andyf

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2010, 06:24:28 AM »

Add a simple mesh filter onto the out pipe and you have a ash vacumn cleaner adapter (buche d'cendriers). I know we all make our own usually but theyre only 10e to buy here and come with overcentre latches for the drum lid and are made of steel with a spiral wound metal hose for the job etc.
I use one on my vax in wet mode...

Just don't get one that's too thin walled, or it can collapse under the suction. DAMHIK  :(

Andy
Sale, Cheshire
I've cut the end off it twice, but it's still too short

Offline AdeV

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #13 on: July 12, 2010, 06:43:31 AM »
Lots of great ideas here, thanks! I shall look at doing something with a cyclone I think, they look easy enough to fabricate out of common-or-garden kitchen equipment...


 :nrocks:
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline Rog02

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #14 on: July 12, 2010, 11:21:47 AM »
YEP!

Oily swarf will kill the shop vac.  I regularly use on to vac out the intake valley and rocker galleries on engines after scraping gaskets and such so I have killed more than one.  Not a worry since they are common "garage sale" commodities over here.  The biggest problem is the oily mess that was left in the canister.  If I needed to use the vac for wet service it took a lot of cleaning before I could even start the needed job so I ended up with two.

I built a "separator" like the ash collectors others have mentioned and am VERY happy with it.  I am now down to one shop vac, saving some storage space.  The one I built is simply a 5 gallon paint bucket (metal for fire proofing) and a few common hardware store PVC fittings.  The trick for our needs as opposed to the swirling cyclones that wood workers use is that our swarf is considerably heavier and it drops into the bucket rather than being carried on to the vacuum source.  With this in mind I simply made a baffle that made the air flow turn a 90* corner before turning a second 90* into the vac hose. 

Cleaning the units is a a simple task of dumping the canisters into the trash.  The "separator" catches all the oily swarf and the vac now has only the usual dust and stuff it was designed to collect.

My next mod will be to make some stand offs to mount the shop vac on top of the "separator" so as to reduce the foot print of both units and to allow me to simply switch out hoses as needed for the task at hand. 

I saved the hose and tools from the discarded units and use those as dedicated "dirty work".

I got the idea from the wood dorkers and they pointed me to this site for more info.http://www.cgallery.com/smf/index.php?board=1.0

My total investment including the scrounged "fiver" and lid was around $10 USD. 

Good luck with the project.  Hope this helps.
Roger
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Offline AdeV

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #15 on: July 12, 2010, 03:10:03 PM »

Here's another one, rather neater - well, it would be, because Mr Ishimura  :bow: made it:
http://homepage3.nifty.com/amigos/57_cyclone_dust_collector/cyclone_dust_collector-e.htm 


I like that one.... I reckon I can use the body of the dead vac to catch the bits, and my other old dead vac (who's motor still pulls like a champ) can provide the suction...

Question: How important is it that the bottom of the cyclone is conical? I'm assuming it must have some importance, as ever cyclonic vacuum bar none that I've seen, have a conical dust collector. Even the cheap heap pictured at the top of this thread tried to throw the dust into the container sideways - unfortunately, despite this I think it tended to go straight to the suction point in the middle, judging by the condition of the filter. I'd like to avoid that problem if possible...
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline kwackers

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #16 on: July 13, 2010, 05:10:33 AM »
I think the conical bit simply keeps the rotational speed up and thus prevents the intake sucking it back up since centrifugal force keeps the crap against the side.

You really don't need to bother with the cyclone bit, I use a bin for wood (and wood's light!) the only nod to keeping the airflows separated is two elbows that keep the airflows moving in opposite directions. All the heavy stuff simply falls into the bin since the airflow is so low. With my woodworking setup all that makes it to the filter of the vac is the very fine dust - a bag lasts a year or more, with metal I doubt anything would make it back to the vac.

If you really want to play it safe - place a baffle between the input and output (as suggested above). Whilst the cyclone would help get some of the really fine stuff out - they don't remove it all and it's a lot of extra work for very little gain particularly for metal.

Offline old-biker-uk

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #17 on: July 13, 2010, 04:25:09 PM »
Walking past Burtons (UK residents will know) on dustbin day saw these little wheels poking out of the bin, thought 'They look useful'. They were attached to a vac. Took it back to work, cleaned out the accumulated carpet fluff and have been using it in the workshop for the last 25 years.

It's a Nilfisk and now also does duty as a dust extractor when I am woodturning.
No wheels on it anymore, they went on my 29K sewing machine...
Mark
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Offline RichardShute

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2010, 07:59:50 AM »
I have a Henry which works super!
I'd second that. I got mine for free by dragging it out of a skip, cleaned the filter of cement dust and I've used it for the last 8 years or so, much of that for cleaning cement and similar building material dust. It recently packed up when the slip-ring contacts broke, got some new ones for a fiver and it's back on song. No good for wet stuff 'tho.

Richard
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Offline dsquire

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #19 on: July 14, 2010, 02:22:42 PM »

If any body is interested in playing around with modifying or building their own vac system here is a thread that may be of interest

http://www.floweringelbow.co.uk/projects/the-cyclone-dust-separator/

Cheers  :beer:

Don

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Offline Darren

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #20 on: July 15, 2010, 07:00:40 PM »
Henry does it for me and has done for a couple of years now. Everything goes, swarf included and he's never missed a beat. No mods or bag, just use as is... he's old too ....

http://www.onestopcleaningshop.co.uk/vacuum-cleaners/office-home-vacuums.html?gclid=COCGxPfQ7qICFdWX2AodPUBG-A
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Offline doubleboost

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Re: Shop vacuum cleaner
« Reply #21 on: July 15, 2010, 08:05:58 PM »
I bought a cheap cylinder vac from tool mart £50 works great no bags just a foam filter.
I remember working on a chevron racing car 25 years ago .
It was late one nite we were fitting the fuel tank , these are a neoprene bag tank filled with foam
The tank was second hand we coverd it with talcom powder (french chalk but we had none ).
The tank fitted in to a aluminium box behind the driver , we used a vacume cleaner to "suck"the tank flat so we could install it .
The smell of petrol was very strong , we new it was a BIT DODGY BUT WE HAD DONE THE SAME THING BEFORE.
The resulting bang was amazing
The hoover top literally went through the roof
Talk about health and safety we pissed our selves with laughter , my ears rang for days after that (sorry for rambling)
John