A New Year's resolution

[Bernd]

Well Bogs got us off on the season greetings. So I thought I'd get one up on him by posting a New Years resolution of sorts.

I have a habit of starting a project with great enthusiasm , get into the project and then something else comes along that piques my interest and I forget about the project I began. This why I have many projects started or "want to build" and none are finished.

So with that in mind here's my resolution, "I will begin a project and see it through from design to the finished stage."

Now for the project. My first hobby is model railroading, my second is live steam model railroading and I've always wanted to build a live steam engine to ride behind. The project is to take the old "CliShay" design and redesign it.

What I want to build is a 1890 12 ton Climax engine pictured below. This is actually a model in what is known as G gauge, what some of you may recognize as LGB.


This is a side plan view of the locomotive.


This is a print of the real engine used in these locomotives. They were basically launch engines from steam powered boats.


The original "CliShay" looks like this.


Here's a size comparison to a human being.


I actually started the CliSahy back in 1993. Didn't get very far. So now I would really like to redesign it to look like that model in the first pic.

I've been collecting raw stock and looking at modifying engine designs and drive train designs. I would like this to be a design to completion project by modifying what has already been done.

Now I will need your help to stay on track and keep prodding me to keep at this project to see it through. Along with this project I plan on documenting it in detail on my web site, plus posting updates here on the MadModder.

When will I start? Well I've already started. I've been gathering pics, drawings and raw stock. This will be the biggest hobby project that I've ever tackled both in size and work involved.

Wish me luck as I know I'm going to need it. This won't be a "get her done" in a month project. I'm looking at a couple of years at least. So let the fun begin.

Bernd

[Brass_Machine]

A good resolution you have there Bernd. I will be constant thorn in your side providing encouragement if you want.

On a side note... I started a new job a few weeks ago. On Friday I was introduced to a man who is a live steam railroad fanatic. He told me the scale, but it slipped my mind. Apparently the club he is in has some tracks in PA. He has invited me up when it gets warmer to hop on a loco and give it a run. I think I am in trouble... this may start a new obsession! 

Back to your resolution, I have the same affliction as you. I get geared up and start... then get side tracked. I hope to correct that as well this year.

Best of luck to you... I will give my encouragement to help.

Eric

[bogstandard]

Blamn and dast Bernd, beat me to the resolutions.

Now about your 'little' project .

I am not into railways since the grandson gave up wanting to play with a very large LGB 'G' setup I had bought him on my regular visits to Germany. But as you know, I was into model boats for a good few years, and this engine, as you said, uses a marine type of steam engine.

If you need any help on that score, don't be afraid to ask.


John


BTW, Stew is researching a small engine as a long term project like yours, that was used in the factory where my father was employed. Maybe if we push him a little, he could share his little project as well (that let the cat out of the bag Stew).

[Bernd]

A good resolution you have there Bernd. I will be constant thorn in your side providing encouragement if you want.

Your going to have to be a bigger thorn than the wife though. 

On a side note... I started a new job a few weeks ago. On Friday I was introduced to a man who is a live steam railroad fanatic. He told me the scale, but it slipped my mind. Apparently the club he is in has some tracks in PA. He has invited me up when it gets warmer to hop on a loco and give it a run. I think I am in trouble... this may start a new obsession! 

The one club in PA that sticks in my mind is the PA Live Steam club. Oh ya, I think you might be in big trouble there.

Back to your resolution, I have the same affliction as you. I get geared up and start... then get side tracked. I hope to correct that as well this year.

Best of luck to you... I will give my encouragement to help.

Eric

Well I figured if I made it public then I'll have a few people poking and prodding on how the project is going and hopefuly that will help. Also it's good to know there will be help coming in the form of "How to do it".

Thanks for the encouragement and good luck with your new job. I hope you like it.

Bernd

[Bernd]

Blamn and dast Bernd, beat me to the resolutions.

Sorry to burst your bubble Bogs.

Now about your 'little' project .

I am not into railways since the grandson gave up wanting to play with a very large LGB 'G' setup I had bought him on my regular visits to Germany. But as you know, I was into model boats for a good few years, and this engine, as you said, uses a marine type of steam engine.

If you need any help on that score, don't be afraid to ask.


John


BTW, Stew is researching a small engine as a long term project like yours, that was used in the factory where my father was employed. Maybe if we push him a little, he could share his little project as well (that let the cat out of the bag Stew).

Don't you worry I'll be sure and ask questions from the collective group when I've run into trouble. I know the steam engine is gong to be a bit tough to design and build.

It doesn't matter if your not into railways, what matters is your years of experince in model engineering.

I'm sure Stew will be posting his project. RIGHT STEW 

Of all the projects I've read about in both forums (you know the ones I'm talking about) you never get the story of the how's and why's. I thought I'd like to add what has given me the insperation to go this route and how I went about it.

And since I have your attention now I've been meaning to ask. When you post your Crap-O-Cad do you scan it or do you take a picture of it with a camera? I was just courious.

Bernd

[bogstandard]

Bernd,

With crap-o-cad being such a very temperamental program, it has to be treated very carefully.

So here goes.

Draw it, wack it into scanner, post it.

Done and dusted, usually in under five minutes.

Great proggy eh?

But there is a secret. Fold a normal sheet of printer paper in half (no not longways), that way you have four drawing sides, and there is no need to rescale at all after you scan it, it is ready to go. WYSIWYG (pronounced w-y-s-i-w-y-g), What You See Is What You Get.

Bogs

Like this.

[sbwhart]

Hi Bernd

That looks a real interesting engine I just love some of the less conventional engine designs I'm shure you'll have great fun building it, and we'll all keep you to your resolution. Looks like Johns set me up nicely  regarding my long term project:- this is the engine I'm researching



Its a Ramsbottom narrow 18" gauge tram engine five we're built Tiny, Pet, Nipper, Topsy and Midge between 1862 and 1870, they were used on the narrow gauge ralway that serviced Crewe Loco works and as such was the first in the world the works eventualy having over 10 miles of track.

I'm planning to build a 5" gauge vertion of this engine, I've done some CAD drgs, I thinks I've got the valve gear etc sorted out in my head, just got to detail them, it's the boiler that's causing me most concern, again I've got something skeemed out and I've done some calculation  but in loco terms its not the usual sort of boiler more like a marine boiler, just how good it will perform I've no idea, perahaps thats where you guys can help out. 

Any way I'll get something on the project page in a few days, I've on domestic duties  at the moment

From myselve and my family Dorothy, Alistair, and Kirstin I'd like to wish all you guys a very merry Christmas and a Good New Year

Have
 
Fun

Stew

[Bernd]

Excellent John. I can handle those three steps very easy. Draw. Scan. Post.  Got it.

Reason I asked was that I usally can draw something up quicker than using the cad program to try and get something across or ask a question. I'll give it a try when I need to.

Thanks again. 

Bernd

[Bernd]

Stew,

After studying that print you included for a while I see your going to be in for some challenges.

Hard to believe that they put the cylinders between the frame on such a small gauge. The whole locomotive looks a bit top heavy. It would seem that a good stiff side wind would knock that loco over on it's side.

Don't know if you've ever seen or heard to this guy in Sweden. He's built a couple of steamers. Take a look at how he solved some of his boiler needs. Might give you some ideas.  http://www.sci.fi/~animato/steam/index.html

Here's wishing your family a Merry X-mas and a Happy New Year.

Bernd

[sbwhart]

Hi Bernd

Yes I've seen animoto site some time ago in fact I'd forgotton about him I'll have another look through his stuff thanks for bringing it to my attension.

The drawing is an actual works drawing and it does at first look a bit of a birds nest, but when you start to look at it its quite asimple design, the inside cylinder with inside valve work would be a bit of a night mare her's a photo of a symilar set up from http://www.stationroadsteam.co.uk/ if you look at their archive they've got lots of loco on file.



I've decided to use top valve gear operated with a lever arm similar to the loco I'm building at the moment that will simplify  things a bit.

As for being top heavy:- yes it does look top heavy just how stable it will be on the track is a bit of a poser if it works I will have to watch the speed. 



Have Fun

 

Stew

[Bernd]

That does look like a tight squeeze with all those rods.

Looking at the Tiny I see that it's sort of a tank engine. So what kind of fuel did they use to boil the water? I'm going to assume coal, but were would you carry it?

Bernd

[sbwhart]

Hi Bernd

Yes your correct about it being a tank engine, water was carried in the front part of the tank, coal in the back, where the driver stands, the interesting bit is that the driver only stoked the boiler when he was stopped, but as he was taking bits arround the works he was stopping regularly so thats was no problem, and I supose they would have stashes of coal strategicly placed arround the works, apparently one of these engines Midge had a driver who was 20 stone thats 280 lbs in your money.


Have Fun
 
Stew

[sbwhart]

Hi Bernd

Bin thinking about the Climax are you planning to use a Stewart twin for your motive power, they probibly sell something prity close to what you want, also are they front and back bogies or are they fixed ?.

Noticed on your shop photos that you've got a Sieg mill is it an X2, I'm planning on getting an X3 after a shop reorganisation, are they any good?.

Cheers
 
Stew

[Bernd]

Hi Bernd

Yes your correct about it being a tank engine, water was carried in the front part of the tank, coal in the back, where the driver stands,

Have Fun
 
Stew

Ok. That's what I thought but wanted to make sure.

Now that I see a driver standing on the engine I can get a better perspective of the size. I had thought that it would have been larger for some reason.

Nice pics by the way.

Bernd

[Bernd]

Hi Bernd

Bin thinking about the Climax are you planning to use a Stewart twin for your motive power, they probibly sell something prity close to what you want,

No I plan on modifying a design I saw in Model Tech magizne. It will be based on an engine design that somebody came up with for the CliShay. It's a bigger engine, but I didn't like the looks of it but I liked the 2" bore by 2" stroke. The original engine had a 1.256" bore by 1.5" stroke. I would like to make it as close looking to a launch engine as I can.

also are they front and back bogies or are they fixed ?.

Again refer to the pics and line print. They are bogies. Both will swivel. I know what your next guestion will be.
How are they powered? I'll scan a few pics of how I'm going to do it.

Noticed on your shop photos that you've got a Sieg mill is it an X2, I'm planning on getting an X3 after a shop reorganisation, are they any good?.

Cheers
 
Stew

That's a Grizzly or X2. Take a look at my web site and check out the mini-mill page. I show how I converted the metric thread to an imperial thread. Still looking to go to a belt drive. The machine is fine for small work. I won't use it to make 1 1/2" live steam parts. it's not rigid enough and I don't like the whole head moving up and down. Not very accurate for doing any boring of holes. But for small table top steam engines of the Elmer Verburg size it's ok. The X3 I believe has a separate spindle movement from the column. I think that's much better.

I'm thinking we are going to need a separate thread for this subject of engine building, what do you think? I'm open to suggestions.

Bernd

[sbwhart]

Hi Bernd

Yes good idea having a seperate thread for engine building I've got my engine well documented with photos so ther's one for a start. 

Cheers
 
Stew

[Bernd]

Stew,

Since your somewhat ahead of me I'll leave that one to you to start a thread on your engine build. I'll follow up on a thread of my own on my build.

I've broken the construction down to several componenets but nothing soilid yet.

Bernd

[sbwhart]

Hi Bernd

As I'm a bit of a new boy at this I take it that by Thread you mean on the project section Open up a topic on engine building ?. 
I could always nip round to Johns and I'm shure he'll help me out on this.

Cheers

 
Stew

[rleete]

I have a habit of starting a project with great enthusiasm , get into the project and then something else comes along that piques my interest and I forget about the project I began. This why I have many projects started or "want to build" and none are finished.

Now I will need your help to stay on track and keep prodding me to keep at this project to see it through.

Bernd, I'm in the same boat.  Having many, varied interests (although all mechanical in nature) keeps me hopping from one project to the next.  That, coupled with the fact that one needs to balance "fun time" and family, home maintenance, work, etc. means there never seems to be the time.  Motivation is sometimes laking as well.

Maybe, the solution is not to embark on yet another major undertaking, but to complete some of the forever in-process ones.  I see you have the PM research coke bottle engine.  I do, too.  Perhaps we can collaborate to motivate each other to get these done?

[bogstandard]

Nice one lads,

It looks like the new year is going to start with a bang, with all these new projects getting under way.

Looking forwards to it.

Bogs

[Bernd]

Hi Bernd

As I'm a bit of a new boy at this I take it that by Thread you mean on the project section Open up a topic on engine building ?. 
I could always nip round to Johns and I'm shure he'll help me out on this.

Cheers

 
Stew

Yes , that's exactly what I mean. I would suggest you post in the "Project Logs". You can post the how's and why's building the engine. I'll follow suit as I get closer to getting the idea on paper.

Bernd

[Bernd]

Bernd, I'm in the same boat.  Having many, varied interests (although all mechanical in nature) keeps me hopping from one project to the next.  That, coupled with the fact that one needs to balance "fun time" and family, home maintenance, work, etc. means there never seems to be the time.  Motivation is sometimes laking as well.

Maybe, the solution is not to embark on yet another major undertaking, but to complete some of the forever in-process ones.  I see you have the PM research coke bottle engine.  I do, too.  Perhaps we can collaborate to motivate each other to get these done?

Well that's what I'm trying to do now, get some definite plans on what I'm going to do and stick with it. At present I have Elmer's "Educational engine" I'm working on for another forum I belong to. I need to finish that first before I seriously will start on anything else. Half my problem is motivation. I can think great things but never get around to doing it. That's one reason for committing it to the memebers. I now have to at least show some progress or I'll get poked by you guys to keep it going. That's what I need, a bit of prodding. I'm surre John will be at the front of the line with a cattle prod making sure I move forward. 

So I guess I can commit to the two projects then. One being the design and build of a CliShay and the other the coke bottle engine. All right I here by commit to these two projects and will stick with them until completion. Or I pass on to the big boiler in the sky. 

I'll let you start the first post on the Coke Bottle engine then since it was your suggestion.

Bernd

[Bernd]

Nice one lads,

It looks like the new year is going to start with a bang, with all these new projects getting under way.

Looking forwards to it.

Bogs

Ok Bogs I nominate you as over-seer of said projects. Rules are we can't build anything else of hobby interest until said engines are done.

Sir, turn on your cattle prod.

Note: Of course this is all said with a lighter side to it. I'm sure it will be lots of great fun to keep each other motivated to finish something we have started. In all seriousness I think this will be great fun and MOTIVATING.

Bernd

[rleete]

Rules are we can't build anything else of hobby interest until said engines are done.

Yeah, like that's gonna happen...  I do want to keep working on my first engine and hopefully post pics of it finished.  I'll use the PMR kit project to keep both of us heading in the right direction.

I plan on contacting you after Christmas to take you up on that offer to visit your shop.  You can dig out all your toys and show me, and maybe that will pique your interest.   

[bogstandard]

I daren't tell you lot everything I have got planned, all because at the moment I am having trouble getting into the shop, never mind using the machines.

But the first priority is fixing Darrens lathe, then I have a private two day job to do, then I need to finish off my poppet valve engine, then I have to finish off a super sized ball turner, but before that, I may mod my lathe by putting t-slots in the cross slide, followed by finishing off three egg cup stirlings, then I fancy doing the full range of Halo builds, one to five cylinders, five engines in all, plus also I have to make a couple of beam engines followed by the full range of stirling engines from Jan Ridders stables, Oh! I forgot, finish off the workshop, then ................................................

All before New Year (no mention of what year).

You lucky bu**ers with only a couple of projects to get out of the way.

Who is going to poke me with a pointy stick to keep me on track?

Bogs