Building a 31/2" Gauge Locomotive Engine

[sbwhart]

Nick

Got the body of the water feed pump made tried to see how it fits in the frame, I can't get it to fit checked everything out and all seems OK can you post a pic of your loco showing how the water pump fits between the frames.

Cheers
 
Stew

[NickG]

Stew, just seen this, been in workshop tonight, will take pic tomorrow. Thanks for the lubricator drawing.

Nick

[sbwhart]

Well her's the water feed pump body, I fabricated it up, but not yet soldered together, still got the inner poppet valves to do, the drawing calles for ball and spring valves, my poppet valve pump design fits inside the space envelope of the drawing valve



And this is where its got to fit about an inch forward of this pic with the front between to motion frame:- according to the drg 



Interested to see how Nick's pump fits

I'm going to post the problem on the Model engineering forum to see if any one can come up with a solution.


Puzzled

Stew

[NickG]

Stew,

Took a few photos, unfortunately it's not quite as clean as yours  Hope these help but if not, I will strip it out and take some more detailed ones. It's coming to bits anyway.

From Top



From underneath



From what I can see there is a bracket with a cut out that bolts to a cross brace and the nut on your pump secures it to the pump.

Nick

[NickG]

Looking again at your pic it needs to be further towards the front of the engine. It looks like the gland nut is almost under that cross-brace on mine.

I have just looked at the drawings and the gland nut does not secure the bracket to the pump. The bracket is 3/8" back from the end of the thread for the gland nut, which means the nut does infact sit under the motion plate. It has to be that far forward to clear the crank.

Don't know which drawings you are working off but the electronic ones you sent me have it on, (sheet 5).

Nick

[sbwhart]

Nick thanks for posting the pics.

I've had another go at fitting the pump, your pics confirm my conclusions, the bracket fixed to the motion frame needs to be cut away to clear the bearing plate for the lifting shaft bearing (not shown on drawing), and the bracket on the cross head goes towards the cylinder to give room for the pump body to be set far enough forward to clear the throw of the crank, (I missed this on the drawing  )

Its a right tight fit, with not much clear space at all.

Thanks again, those pics helped a lot.

Stew

[NickG]

Stew,

Yeah it looks a tight squeeze! Bet it's pretty fiddley to assemble all that lot! will have to take a bowl of warm water to keep thawing my fingers out when I get to the reassembling stage!

Glad I could be of some use.

Nick

[sbwhart]

Thanks to Nick I understand now how the water pump fits between the frames. Before I silver soldered the fabrication together I completed the two mounting bracket, so that I could try everything in place to make sure that it would fit. This is the forward bracket that I misread the drawing on.



I was going to show the set up for soldering it together but I forgot, the only pic I've got is how I fixed the the outlet coupling. there's a 1/8" hole in the body that a little stud on the coupling fits tightly into, the feed hole in the coupling only goes part way through I drill it through when its all soldered together.

This is a C-o-C of how it goes.



And this is the fabrication soldered together.



Its turned pink due to the acid being contaminated with iron from the fixing bracket.

Cheers

Stew

[Divided he ad]

Fair do's Stew, you make some cracking pieces 


I do like watching the progress of a damn fine engineer     




Ralph.

[NickG]

Wondered what that was Stew, looks like it has been copper welded!

Good stuff. The pump is a tiny bore isn't it? You don't happen to know whether there is a by-pass valve anywhere in the system do you? I think mine is just permanently plumbed in to the boiler - which is a bit weird as you can't control it, but the pump is so small that maybe they assume you need it running all the time and just top up with hand pump or injector if need be?

Nick

[sbwhart]

Hi Nick

Used to put that coppering effect to good use, as you know I used to be involved with making a brass item in high volumes, from time to time when we had specials to put through the line, to identify them, at the end of the shift when the acid baths were due to be changes we'd chuck a couple of bolts into the baths put the specials through and hay presto they were pink, made it a lot more difficult to get them mixed, (but it still did happen but thats another story). I've forgotten the chemical reaction that made it happen, but I think it had something to do with the zinc being removed from a micro surface layer.

As for the bypass valve there should be one in the system I've got a copy of Curley's words and music for his loco build I'll have a read through to see what I can find.

Cheers

Stew

[NickG]

Interesting stuff! 

Ok thanks, it must need one really. I can't remember seeing one, just a pipe from tender to pump bottom and top goes straight into clack if I remember rightly.

Nick

[sbwhart]

Ok:- Drilling the through holes to finish the body off.



Then turn the poppet velves and the rest of the couplings up, this is all the bits.



I had to do a bit of reshaping to get it to fit but her's the finished pump.



And squessed in between the frames not perfect but near enough to give me convidence that when I strip the loco down I'll be able to fettle things to get a better fit.



I've tried it out by hand and it does work but a bit of a pain to get it primed tried to take a vid but by the time I'd got it primed and then reached for the camera it had lost the prime, I'm using ellcheap orings (£1 a box from the market) and I suspect they are not up to the Job. I try and pick up some better quality rings.

Well I enjoyed that bit madmoddering I took what I thought were the best parts from two design and put them together, If I get time I may do a CAD drawing of it.


Well that my loco build on the back burner for a little while, I've got a couple quick kit improvement jobs to do then I think I'll do a engine build I've been fealing the urge for a little while know, 

I was going to work on my cutter grinder idea but I need to get things outside for that and the weathers taken a turn for the worst so I leave that for another time.

Cheers

Stew

[bogstandard]

Very nice indeed Stew. 

Modifying things to get them to work exactly how you want is what it is all about.

Take it steady and you won't lose interest.


John

[NickG]

Excellent work Stew! Oooh an engine build 

[redpiperbob]

Hi Stew
thanks for the warm welcome I have over the last few days read your above thread with much interest. A great build. I will take some pics of the RobRoy
later today and post them.
Bob

[sbwhart]

Well the loco has been on the back boiler for long enough and I keep getting the od  about it but I keep getting infected with  and side tracked away, so decided that I would have to do somthing stern to get myself back on track:-


RITE A TO DO LIST
This is it pinned up in the shop, now thats stern stuff 



First part to get started on the regulator stand, you can get a casting for this but decided it could be easily fabricated, its mainly brass with a phos bronze port face.

These are the bits for the stand machined.




I then silver soldered the bits together, I was going to take a picture of the soldered stand:p but desaster struck I'd had it in the pickle for 1/2 hr took it out and went to wash it off in the garden pond.

Yes thats correct I dropped it in the pond 

I've currently got the pump going emptying the pond, it has got me a few brownie points the boss's been on about cleaning the pond out for ages, I havn't told her why I'm doing it. 

A wet and muddy Stew

[Stilldrillin]

A wet and muddy Stew

Yes, it sounds like you do good stern stuff, Stew! 

David D

[dsquire]

Stew

I've heard of all kinds of excuses for playing in the mud but this is a new one

Cheers 

Don

[Divided he ad]

I havn't told her why I'm doing it.   

      Now that's funny... Watch out for people reading over your shoulder though....       


If it's any consolation Stew, the parts look nice in the picture 




Glad to see you on with the build 





Ralph.

[sbwhart]

Found it




Along with 1/2 dozen frogs

Stew

[Divided he ad]

Well done Stew..... What you done with the frogs?          



Ralph.

[sbwhart]

Well done Stew..... What you done with the frogs?          

Ralph.

Blimey you'll be wanting a wild life program next with Sir David Atenburgh presenting.
 


Stew

[Divided he ad]

Blimey you'll be wanting a wild life program next with Sir David Atenburgh presenting.

Cool, can you do that too? There's no end to your talents   



I've pictures of newts, moths (I hatched from pupae) a lizard, spiders and a mouse all found over the last few years mostly in the garden or at work.... if anyone is interested?  .... possibly 


Sorry Stew.... We await the next instalment on the loco 




Ralph.

[NickG]

Good to see you back on this project Stew. I really need to get started on my restoration but as you say -   

Have to say, having looked at mine, I hate the design of the regulator so will be watching this with interest. The worst bit is how it's attached to the boiler with 2 csk screws through the barrel - how you are meant to effectively seal this I'm not sure - silver solder them in and hope you never need to remove it? You could still take the disc off, I think.

Can't believe you were washing it off in the pond!

I think that number 7 on your list might spurn a few more lists of its own!

Nick