Author Topic: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose  (Read 5475 times)

Offline Swarfing

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revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« on: June 24, 2013, 09:39:41 AM »
After a long period of messing about trying different things, i'm going to attempt to make a D1-4 nose to fit over the existing. As some of you may remember from threads a while back i had been having problems obtaining appropriate chucks at reasonable prices. I've managed so far with adapter plates which work fine, just a real PITA when i want to switch. Long term this is not acceptable and i am fed up loosing my knuckles undoing so many cap head bolts each time.

Does anybody have any details/ dimensions (camlock holes, screw holes, position around circumference etc) of a D1-4 nose? plenty of info on web i know but i would like to make this to a known standard. Would like to keep it metric so any help would be grateful. An alternative is to re-machine the nose end of an existing D1-4 spindle to mount over my A1-4, so if anybody has an old spindle they care to sell then would be very interested.

Thanks

Paul
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Offline Swarfing

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2013, 10:11:11 AM »
For those interested in what the existing nose looks like a pic.

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Offline 75Plus

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2013, 10:18:27 AM »
The D1-? spindle is an American design and all of the dimensions are imperial. This site can provide those dimensions.

http://shopswarf.orconhosting.net.nz/chuckmt.html

Back in 2009 one of the members, "DeereGuy", posted a build log detailing how he made a D1-4 receiver from aluminum. Here's the link.

http://madmodder.net/index.php/topic,1350.msg12735.html#msg12735

Hope this is helpful and good luck with the project.

Joe

Offline Swarfing

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2013, 10:36:18 AM »
Hi Joe i would like to say that is true but they do come in metric versions too.

British &  I.S.O.. Standard Spindle Noses, Mine is the A1-4 and the d1-4 follows the exact same dimensions for the spigot.
Check here.

http://www.lathes.co.uk/latheparts/page10.html

There are also German DIN standards

http://www.lathes.co.uk/latheparts/page11.html

Not a lot in the difference but there are differences. My lathe is French and follows the British standard where the outside is only 108mm.
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Offline 75Plus

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2013, 11:49:33 AM »
No matter where the spindle is made the dimensions, imperial or metric, must match the original design else it would not be a universally supplied  spindle. I found this page on Tony's site that notes both imperial and metric dimensions. (Bottom pic)

http://www.lathes.co.uk/latheparts/page9.html

Offline Swarfing

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2013, 01:10:08 PM »
Joe this is were i have to be careful, you are right in matching the design but unfortunately :-) this is where standards are great....Sooooooooo many to choose from :-)

The principle pattern and layout plus spigot are identical between them all, but mounting holes and pins are different. The A1-4 is a good example. The American standard shows in UNC sizes, mine is M10. An American chuck i'm sure would fit on my nose but i'm not sure a D1-4 would mount to a metric spec nose? Not owning one i can't say. I'm hoping this sort of info wall fall out on this thread. I even looked at the option of ordering chucks for from the states but by the time i add the P&P i might as well buy from here. A 6" 3 jaw will set you back above the 500 mark,  not including VAT and postage, way to rich for me. That's more than i paid for the lathe.
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Offline hopefuldave

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2013, 01:19:03 PM »
Hi ;Paul,
The.dimensions that matter - taper, camlock pin diameter and PCD - *are* the same wherever they're made, the.differences will be in the pins' threads and the size of the capscrews preventing the pins rotating.
I have a 60 year old English lathe, new far-eastern chuck's fit straight on!
Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men.

Offline Swarfing

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2013, 01:42:38 PM »
Dave it's good hear that and what i expected. Sometimes you just need to hear it from the horses mouth. This should be easier than what i'm probably expecting. The weekend i will make the plug as i have some metal for that. will need to get my hands on something to make the D1-4 mount. Should i worry too much about whether i use bright steel or something that should be hardened?
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Offline hopefuldave

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2013, 05:34:31 AM »
Hi Paul,
If the nose is going to get a lot of use, I'd use something hardenable, but beware dimensional changes during heat-treatment! You may need to finish the taper by grinding once hardened and tempered, so leave a thou" or so allowance and hope nothing distorts too much.
Grinding to size with a toolpost grinder will give you the certainty that all's concentric too, very light passes (a few tenths of a thou") until there's a couple if thou" gap between original spindle face and the flat back on the D1 nose, the mounting bolts' tension should then close the gap and give the right interference fit.on the A1 spindle to eliminate any problems with rigidity etc.

Then repeat and grind the taper and flat on your new D1 nose, Robert's your parent's sibling!
Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men.

Offline Pete.

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2013, 05:57:35 AM »
And be bloody careful when cutting the taper. If you over-shoot and cut it small on the OD you'll have to cut the mating face back four times as much to bring it back to size.

Offline Swarfing

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Re: revisit A1-4 Spindle nose
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2013, 03:08:10 PM »
Thanks guys for the info, this project is taking a while to get off the ground due to work. Plus i have the problem getting to the metal merchants to order the steel. I will just have to be patient  :(
Once in hole stop digging.