Author Topic: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding  (Read 9566 times)

Offline raynerd

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Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« on: July 30, 2013, 05:17:26 PM »
I`m after a small motor turning at approximately 20-30rpm - no too much torque required as I`m attempting to make a penny pusher (arcade/slot machine style game).

I believe others have used "a 12v windscreen motor off 5v" to get an appropriate speed but I thought there would be more to it than just hooking up a dc voltage to get one of these running - can anyone any advice? My understanding is that using a 5v or 7v supply will reduce the speed but then will reduce the torque and generate heat. Is PWM the only way to go...if so what sort of a pwm controller would work?

Any help appreciated

Chris

Offline awemawson

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2013, 05:33:00 PM »
Almost any small dc motor and driven by a simple pulse width modulation circuit. 555 timer giving variable mark space driving a VFET to switch the motor. Tweak the mark space to get the speed you want.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline raynerd

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2013, 05:39:30 PM »

Offline chipenter

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2013, 05:41:22 PM »
Have a look in Maplins http://www.maplin.co.uk/components/motors-and-servos/motors-and-gearboxes various ratios available .
Jeff

Offline Bluechip

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2013, 05:49:43 PM »
Chris
 
I have some similar to this:
 
http://cpc.farnell.com/mfa/940d1001/motor-gear-4-5-15v-100-1/dp/HK00908
 
Built on g/box, 12V IIRC ( dunno about the output revs ..can check tomorrow re: volts/o/p revs if you like ).
 
Ripped out of scrapped machines when I was at work  on someone's payroll.
 
Dave BC
 
 
EDIT  Done it ...  :thumbup:
 
Found one
 
PITTMAN with  96:1 G/box
 
13V   about 70mA    26 and a few scratty bits  RPM
 
?????
I have a few modest talents. Knowing what I'm doing isn't one of them.

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2013, 06:22:32 PM »
Chris, I have a windscreen motor and that very same controller from Ebay. Had intended to try to use it for table drive on the mill. I haven't actually tested the motor and drive together yet, but could if you're interested.
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline raynerd

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2013, 06:24:53 PM »
Wow, thanks for your effort bluechip - PM coming your way.

I`m looking forward to starting this little project.

Need to decide how to mount the motor and link it to the table to make the pushing table/ledge.

Chris

Offline raynerd

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2013, 06:26:04 PM »
Chris, I have a windscreen motor and that very same controller from Ebay. Had intended to try to use it for table drive on the mill. I haven't actually tested the motor and drive together yet, but could if you're interested.

Hi vsteam - if you do give it a go, I`d certainly be very interested!

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2013, 07:56:14 PM »
Okay Chris, found the parts and hooking it up now to a PC power supply. Will make a video of it shortly and post.
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2013, 08:33:04 PM »
Okay, here it is. Apologies for the crude hookup. This motor had 3 leads -- a common (black), a high speed (red), and a low speed (blue).

I connected the new controller to the high speed and common  leads. The power supply was the 12 V out of a PC power supply rated at 30 amps on the 12V line.


[embed=500,375]<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/71379802" width="500" height="375" frameborder="0" webkitAllowFullScreen mozallowfullscreen allowFullScreen></iframe> <p><a href="">Reynerd's Motor Controller Test</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/user9419463">vtdiy.</a> on <a href="https://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>
[/embed]
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline raynerd

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2013, 02:11:39 AM »
VSteam - thank you very much! Have you any approximate ideas as to what max current it would have been pulling during that test? I do have some ATX supplies but was hoping to use something smaller with a smaller current rating.

Another thanks for testing that out and posting your results for me  :beer:

Chris

Offline NeoTech

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2013, 02:58:17 AM »
Those geared windscreen motors is really usefull to different things arent they..

why ebay them though.. just go the local car scrappy and pull one out of some old junker, would prob. cost you a fiverr at most.. =)
Machinery: Optimum D320x920, Optimum BF20L, Aciera F3. -- I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. http://www.roughedge.se/blogg/

Offline mattinker

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2013, 05:21:26 AM »
Chris, another useful motor are electric window motors, they are from, what I have seen, smaller and may be less power hungry. I ordered one of the speed controllers you found, I need this sort of thing from time to time for my work. Thanks for the heads up!

Regards, Matthew

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2013, 07:10:26 AM »
Chris, I can give you current draw later today, but for open running.

I'm not sure how to test it for the amount of torque you want to load it with and at what RPM you need.

I would suggest that once you know the baseline draw of most small motors, the addition of the power you need isn't going to vary that greatly between motors. Power needed is power. drawn I suppose efficiency does enter into it, but I bet it isn't a huge factor.

However baseline requirements are probably a pretty big chunk of the pie -- especially  the gearhead itself and the bearings and rotor and shaft sizes, etc.

So would unloaded baseline current be sufficient to give you an idea?
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2013, 07:15:36 AM »
One important thing about wiper motors Mattinker is that they are designed for continuous operation, and long term service.

I don't think a window closing motor has to do much more than run for 3 or 4 seconds. 


Unless of course you have a 7 year old on board, like I do.   :)
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline mattinker

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2013, 09:55:51 AM »
Very good point VT, I'll do a test when the controller arrives, I think I have a window winder motor some where. I don't have a seven year old, or electric windows!

Regards, Matthew

Offline AdeV

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #16 on: July 31, 2013, 10:13:34 AM »

My understanding is that using a 5v or 7v supply will reduce the speed but then will reduce the torque and generate heat.


Just to go back to this for a moment.... I'm pretty sure that  you won't get extra heat running a motor at a reduced voltage. Reduced speed & torque, yes. If you use a resistor to drop the voltage, then the "wasted" volts will generate heat in the resistor.

Consider - reducing the voltage of a simple DC motor (which is all a windscreen or window motor is) is exactly how your old train set or scalextric cars work[ed]... (before the days of DCC & PWM).

Of course, PWM is better because a) the motor always generates peak torque for the speed it's going at, and b) it overcomes "stiction" much better than gradually increasing the voltage - which is why PWM train controllers do a much better job of controlling a train at low speed than a boggo rheostat.
Cheers!
Ade.
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Occasionally: Zhengzhou, China. An even longer way from anywhere...

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #17 on: July 31, 2013, 03:52:39 PM »
Chris -- I just tested the windscreen motor and speed controller setup. I get:

1.6 A @ full speed, 60 RPM
.55 A @ 30 rpm
.09 A @ lowest speed (3.5 RPM)

I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline kayz1

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Re: Windscreep Wiper motor madmodding
« Reply #18 on: July 31, 2013, 04:46:02 PM »
Chriss, i have a Nissan Micra rear screen motor and that controller on my mill as a table drive, it has had some abuse from me with no ill effects on it for the last year. Oh! and it runs from a piddley little transformer to.
 Lyn.