Author Topic: Redundancy  (Read 9886 times)

Offline John Rudd

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Redundancy
« on: June 23, 2014, 07:44:33 AM »

Well arrived at work this morning as usual....
We knew we were having a presentation delivered by our Ops Director at 1-00 pm this afternoon......
I was called in to see the Engineering Manager and HR at 10-15.....

Upshot is, I'm being made redundant and am on a 30 day consultation period.......


Oh well I can't grumble after giving 27 years of my life to the industry........
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lordedmond

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2014, 07:59:29 AM »
Sorry for your news there John

27 years is the same I did with NatWest in the engineering dept

Is your 30 days the same as three months gardening leave

They do not want you at work so three months paid leave

Hope you have a good deal from them , but it does not replace the job

Hope things go well for you , I have not had a job for 17 years but I have no regrets

Stuart

Offline John Rudd

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2014, 08:03:01 AM »
Stuart, thanks...
From what I understand, they help me secure another job (same salary grade etc) within the company (Centrica is quite big....) but if that doesn't happen after the period, then I'm officially out....

From sympathetic sources, I ought to receive something like two years salary plus my pension.....

Gimme the money....lol  :)
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Offline philf

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2014, 09:18:22 AM »
John,

I took voluntary redundancy 5 years ago after 38 years doing basically the same job.

I was 57 then and took the redundancy payout and the lump sum from my pension.

I've not regretted it for a second.

People will tell you that once you've retired you'll wonder how you ever found time to go out to work. It's true!

Good luck.

Phil
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lordedmond

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2014, 09:32:02 AM »
All I can say I agree with Phil how did I find time to go to work

I got my index linked final salary and a pay out in six figures ( not including the two after the dot )

If you want a job then I hope they can sort you out

Stuart

Offline John Rudd

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2014, 09:39:58 AM »
Stuart,

Shortly after I left work this morning after receiving the news,I got a phone call from my ex-manager....after the pleasantries, he said he needs to talk to me make sure I'm ok....
Basically he thinks I should go straight to my pension even tho' I'm only 56, but that I should get at lest two years salary as redundancy,(again 6 figures....)

We'll see what happens......
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lordedmond

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2014, 09:55:58 AM »
John

very similar to me I was 55 now 67 so at 65  got my state pension so did the boss,

I am lucky my pension from Nat West is index linked and I have enjoyed 3% plus pay rises , whilst in work we got less that 1 %

now we are comfortable and have a good nest egg had to split it up though due to the limit that your funds are guaranteed , make sure if you do that the firms are not in the same group if they are they count as one

I am not sure if you can use this method of tax avoidance now but I paid all my pay out into the pension fund purchased an annuity with some and then withdrew the rest back out therefor no TAX was paid on the lump , the bank sorted this out for me , maybe worth some enquirers to see what the score is now as I was  on 50pence in the pound the tax bill makes me go pale now



Stuart

Offline chipenter

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2014, 04:06:11 PM »
I was made redundant 20 years ago with a pension suposed to be half salery , but it wasn't indext linked I now get £75 a week a hole lot less than I was expecting .
Jeff

Offline Chuck in E. TN

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2014, 04:28:06 PM »
John, make lemonade out of your lemons! You won't regret it. I retired a couple of years ago after getting fed up with managments constant harassment. I was employed by a local school system (Government retirement system) The politics you wouldn't believe! I was harassed as being slow(read old), and not doing enough (read working an 8 hour job with regular unpaid overtime). Having an excelent record of cost savings and a reputation for fixing any and all problems wasn't enough. If my job could have been outsourced to Asia, it would have been. Finally had enough and took retirement. Come to find out I was replaced by he head of IT's newly graduated from college son.
Best decision I ever made! I answer to Herself and no one else. I have more available spending money as I'm not driving 50 Mi. each way to work, I can wear jeans if I want. quit work when I want, the list goes on.
Take your severance package and invest as much as you can, and enjoy life! I am!
Chuck
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Offline John Rudd

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2014, 04:36:43 PM »
Comforting words Chuck.....
And there are a lot of similarities between us......
I reckon one of the main reasons for my departure is that I'm not degree qualified  or  am member of a professional body yet have the title of engineer....(I guess I name up for it with experience?)
I won't be sad to leave, just a change of lifestyle.... :beer:
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Offline David Jupp

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2014, 05:46:28 PM »
Something similar about 13 years ago (BP in my case) - though not as much pension earned.  It pushed me to start my own consulting company.

I definitely get much more variety at work than I ever used to, even if I'm perhaps not as well off as if I'd stayed.  I also get far less stress - I only have to worry about where the next job is coming from, not the politics.

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2014, 05:49:49 PM »
John.

I sincerely hope it is a change for the better........

Better way of life. Better attitude of mind.

With far less money behind me, than you guys are mentioning. I stepped into the unknown, a few years early.
After a few weeks, I relaxed, and started to enjoy myself.

We now, live well, on the state pension(s).
The annual payment from the Pru, gives us a yearly surplus.

Hope it works as well, for you.......

David D

David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline gerritv

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2014, 06:13:35 PM »
John
The good news for you is the lump sum and the fact that you have something to retire to. That is critical to being retired IMHO. Boredom kills.
Start frugal, then ease up once you figure out how much (how little actually) you need to live well. The package will ease the transition, just don't tie all of it up in a way that you can't get at some of it for living expenses.

I took a part time job helping out in a Ferrari restoration job, for the experience, not the pay! After a year I started to get busy with hobbies, and now as others mentioned have no idea how I had time to work. Between travel and hobbies there is little spare time.

Gerrit
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Offline SwarfnStuff

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2014, 03:30:16 AM »
Hi John and others. Another John here, but resident down under. I was made, "surplus to requirements" Christmas 2000. At 59, I was too young for the aged pension but managed to get the eqivalent of 12 months salary payout. Then, because of a long term medical problem and a sympathetic government Dr. I was put on disability pension until I turned 65 when it changed to the aged pension.This plus a modest superannuation being turned into an allocated pension has meant that life is comfortable. I can add that not once have I woken in the morning thinking I would like to go to work.  As Gerrit says keeping busy is the key - boredom kills.
John B
Converting good metal into swarf sometimes ending up with something useful. ;-)

Offline DavidA

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2014, 04:01:42 AM »
Most of you guys seem to have entered retirement in a reasonable if not good financial position. And it appears that many are from professional or at least management positions.

The story isn't so rosey for those of us who came up through more mundane occupations. I'm not complaining,  we are all the product of our own decisions.

I retired five years ago at 65.  Well,  not exactly retired,  just went onto short time.  I now work three mornings a week at the same place I was for the last eight years. I do it to keep in touch with the people I knew,  to have access to the machines and to take up the slack when they get too busy for the staff level but not busy enough to set some one else on.

But mainly for the money.  Other wise I'm on state pension.

This August I intend to finaly quit and try and settle into full retirement. Doing it half and half doesn't really work.
The big killer isn't boredom,  too much to do for that.  It is inflation when on a fixed low income.

No real way around that.  Good job I don't drink or smoke.

Dave.

P.S.  Do any of you run a spreadsheet to plan your financial position.  In real time and into the future ? I find it very usefull.

Offline awemawson

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2014, 04:11:43 AM »
John, I'm sorry to hear of you redundancy, but take it as an opportunity and grasp it with both hands.

I was made redundant aged 50, but it was I openly admit by my own maneuverings  :thumbup: I'd worked for Ferranti for many years, and when they went bust my bit of the firm was bought by a third party maintainer. They were sharp young bright things and I was sure the older more expensive staff would be in their sights before long - I reckoned that I needed a lifeboat before that happened. I bought three Launderettes as they could run on their own without my presence. First years takings went into re-equipping. Second third and fourth years I spent buying four  'buy to let flats'. And darn me they still hadn't given me the chop. Then I spotted my opportunity. They decided that the engineers would 'work from home' and although I was then in sales support my office was still with the engineers as I had previously been their manager. Would I please arrange to sell the lease of the office as I'd arranged its purchase for Ferranti many years ago. I got the sale up to the point where they couldn't withdraw, then innocently asked where they wanted me to work. I told them I wasn't prepared to work from home and that I think they'll find 'cessation of work at a particular location' is the legal definition of redundancy ! Ah but we have this project we want you to do, you're not redundant said they! So why did you close my office says I! To cut a long story short I agreed to work for them as a consultant as and when I wanted so long as they met their obligations under my Ferranti contract, which had enhanced redundancy terms :ddb:

Never looked back since - that was 15 years ago and I've never been so busy, but doing what I want, not jumping over other peoples hurdles :lol:

Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Jo

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2014, 06:52:22 AM »
P.S.  Do any of you run a spreadsheet to plan your financial position.  In real time and into the future ? I find it very usefull.

 :thumbup: I have such a spreadsheet up and it used to track how many years living my redundancy would pay for before the pension kicks in, my reduced pension entitlement from the age of 50, year on year if I continue working and also projects my spare income after expenditure and inflation for the rest of my life.  It shows me that next time there are any redundancy opportunities I can afford to say   yes, YES, YES :ddb:

All I am now working for is quality of life in retirement :beer:

Jo
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2014, 07:36:50 AM »
Well while employed I had a spread sheet plotting and  predicted what my 'pot' would be for my money purchase pension when I retired. It showed a very comfortable situation. (Our 'final salary' scheme had been cancelled).Then the government started aggressively taxing pension funds, and the very week they passed the legislation they increased MPs pensions  by 25% - after that the 'pot' was nothing like what it would have been, and I am relying on my property investments now. My occupational pension after a full working life of significant contributions is less than £300 per month, though admittedly I drew down the absolute maximum when I bought this place to ensure that my various mortgages were all paid off.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Pete W.

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2014, 08:37:42 AM »
Hi there, John,

I'm sorry to hear your news.

I was made redundant at the age of 57 (I suspect it was partly because I'd been a bit too outspokenly critical of some of the top people's pet projects!).  I survived, but I found looking for new employment very disheartening.  It didn't help that the staff in the local Job Centre were mostly in their early twenties and gave the impression they'd never had a 'proper job'!  I opted to start drawing my company pension when I was made redundant so I never received any unemployment benefit - the only benefit I got was twelve months exemption from National Insurance.

Eventually, after a few odd-jobs for a couple of years, my old firm found they were short of staff and invited me back as a 'temporary systems engineer' on a contract with 1 week's notice on either side.  They paid me what I'd been on when I left, plus cost-of-living rises, which I thought was quite fair.  Not everyone has that sort of lucky break!  I worked in that role for almost a year but I'd moved house in the meantime so eventually I resigned.

It is a big change and re-adjustment, especially if it is unexpected, and it's important that you keep up your morale.  I suggest that you have a project in the workshop that you can turn to and succeed at when you encounter the inevitable dark moments.  In my case, it wasn't in the workshop - I started a succession of Open University courses and became B.Sc (Hons) at the age of 67.   

Best regards,

Pete W.

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Offline gerritv

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2014, 10:24:05 AM »
One thing for the UK members to keep in mind when you start taking your pension. It is indexed/not indexed depending on where you retire.
If in the UK , EU and most of the world your pension is indexed. If however you decide to move to one of the ex-colonies, your pension is frozen as of the day you arrive (if already taking the pension). This bit of discrimination is being foisted on WW II veterans in several ex-colonies.

My wife is facing that situation in a few years.

Gerrit

Offline philf

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2014, 11:45:14 AM »
Most final salary pension schemes used to allow you to take your pension from the age of 50. (I believe that this may recently have changed to 55.) With our scheme there was a 4% reduction for every year you started to take the pension before you reached the age of 60. A lot of people thought this excessive and would delay taking their pension until they were 60 - the facts show that they were wrong. Going at 57 1/2 I lost roughly 10% of my monthly pension. But, like Stew mentioned, my pension is index linked and, in the 5 years since I retired, have had increases in excess of 15%. If I'd still been in work I might have had a total of 6 or 7% (for some of these years I know they got 0%!) If I'd delayed taking my pension until I was 60 I would be worse off - the monthly pension would have been about the same but I would have missed out on the pension I'd been paid for those 2 1/2 years.

At work (and in work's time!) I devised a spreadsheet which calculated pensions and redundancy payouts. (I had many colleagues asking me to do the calcs for them when redundancies were mentioned.) The spreadsheet could also tell you when you would start to benefit by delaying taking your pension until you were 60. Ignoring inflation, I would have started to be in front when I got to 84 had I held on for another 2 1/2 years.

The only mistake(?) I made was that for a year or so before I retired I went part time (3 days) so my redundancy payment was reduced accordingly. Our final salary scheme was closed and frozen a few years before I retired and so that wasn't affected.

As well as paying into the final salary scheme I had paid AVCs (Additional Voluntary Contributions) for many years and then paid into a Money Purchase Scheme for a few years. With this pot I had to buy an annuity which was very demoralising as the rates then (and probably still now) were so poor. I held off buying the annuity hoping for the rates to improve - they didn't and I lost out on a few years income.

The rules have changed(or are about to change) and you can take all your annuity pension pot to do with as you like (subject to tax). As my pot was small compared with my final salary pension, if I was buying my annuity now I would do take it all and give fairly significant lump sums to our children - benefitting them rather than the annuity company.

I'm fortunate that I joined a Final Salary pension scheme as soon as I could and am now reaping the benefits.  My wife and I live quite comfortably on our company pensions.

When I had apprentices working with me I always used to bore them by trying to instil in them the importance of joining the pension scheme asap. Unfortunately many were persuaded by our Personnel Department (why are they now called Human Resources?) that they would be better off with a Money Purchase scheme rather than the Final Salary scheme as the FS pension was based on their basic pay whereas the MP Pension would be based on their actual pay which would include shift allowances and overtime. I wonder if they can now claim compensation for mis-selling!

Phil.
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Offline boatmadman

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2014, 11:53:32 AM »
Hi,
Sorry to hear about the threat of redundancy.

I was in that position 18 months ago, with Centrica as well. They aren't generous I am afraid.

I hope the offer you get is better than the one I got, it was 2 weeks pay per years service up to a maximum of 40 weeks, with no pension enhancement. I was 55 at the time.

I had to take the alternative on offer, moved to a different business unit, a job I was doing similar to 25 yrs ago, and significantly less pay.

Good luck.
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Offline garym

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2014, 05:46:24 PM »
Hi John,

Redundancy is not fun much whenever it happens. I was made redundant from Ferranti (like Andrew) over thirty years ago. Turned out to be good for me in one sense as the job I got six weeks later has kept me busy ever since and I spent the redundancy money on a new car. You will probably feel angry that they are doing this to you after many years of service but it should pass. You have a great hobby to take your mind off things. I'd echo the thoughts of others and go for early retirement, if you can afford it. I feel sorry for the people whose pensions have been destroyed by the money men and it's a sad reflection on our society that we have allowed it to happen without any real fuss being kicked up on our part.

Gary
Workshop activity resumes now ankle improving :-)

Offline John Rudd

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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #23 on: July 27, 2014, 05:37:14 AM »
Well it's been a week since I finished work.....
It's been hectic, fixing things in the house, a bit of electrics in the bedroom, car maintenance and dome DIY.....I need to go back to work for a rest ..... :lol:
Off out in the caravan this week to Cirencester to a traction engine rally,should be good.....

So far, yup I'm enjoying myself.
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Re: Redundancy
« Reply #24 on: July 27, 2014, 05:58:16 AM »
John

Sounds like you have got your head round it now , next question will be how did I find time to go to work  :)

The best bit for me is the winter time when I hear people scraping ice off their cars , now I just turn over in bed and smile

Although I never did have to do it as NAT West used to send a taxi to take me to and from work , one day the taxi firms boss turned up in his car it had a flying lady on the front and RR badge on  :jaw:

Glad you have sorted now you can relax , my favourite comment to people when asked about jobs I say I am more secure that you are I don't have a job to loose

Stuart