Author Topic: Bally Power Cuts !  (Read 21588 times)

Offline awemawson

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Bally Power Cuts !
« on: August 11, 2014, 04:19:31 AM »
Being quite rural we are on overhead line supply, and power cuts are not that uncommon.

Yesterday was a nightmare. Power would go off - flicker on a couple of times as the automatic re-closer tried to re-connect, then go off for a period. When it came back on, I'd leave it for quite a long period to be sure we were stable, then go the rounds re-starting PC's, resetting timers etc. Worse bit is the front gate which is electric powered. Had to manually over-ride it, but if the power comes back on the manual over-ride has just dropped a dog clutch, so the motor is turning trying to close the gate.

I have a small generator, as our sewage plant needs power, and ALL water used on the place goes through it - so if power is off for more than a few loo flushes I have to start it to pump out the treated effluent or it over-flows  :bang:

We went through this sequence SIX times yesterday - infact after the fifth, it came back on and I started typing this whinge, and it went off again as I typed  :bang:

A few things come out of this:

a/ I must replace the three timers for lights and pumps with ones that don't loose their settings when the power goes off

b/ I must consider UPS's for the PC's, though they are distributed over three buildings

c/ I must investigate a bigger automatic change-over generator that will power the lot. (Cottages power is sourced from our house supply)


We have a pair of holiday cottages on site, and when people are on holiday you can't really tell them to cross their legs for extended periods, and oh by the way you are locked in as the gate doesn't work  :scratch:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline John Rudd

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2014, 05:30:33 AM »
Well sorry to hear of your misfortune, but it does highlight one fact ......

You got a lot of work ahead of you to aid coping with power outages :lol:

Good luck with it all...
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Offline chipenter

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2014, 10:15:36 AM »
It's not just you we only had one yesterday but Friday there was five , no sooner set the clocks and the microwave than anouther hit round we go again .
Jeff

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2014, 11:32:34 AM »
Any hope with solar panels/ wind turbines/ water wheels/ other 'off the grid' stuff?

Not so sure about saving the planet, or saving money, but it always looked like fun stuff to play around with.

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2014, 12:06:20 PM »
I'm kicking myself Simon that a few years ago I didn't go ahead with a large solar array on my barn roof. It has a roughly south facing aspect at about the right pitch. 40 odd foot long by probably 25 or so on the slope. It would have been a good investment as the feed in tariff at the time was high, but I needed the capital for use elsewhere  :bang:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline chipenter

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2014, 02:54:48 PM »
I use 10 what solar panels to help charge the batterys for my 24v South Bend , they have doubled the time between charges .
Jeff

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2014, 03:54:25 PM »
I have a 12 watt panel sitting on the lid of my infrequently used 'road drill' air compressor to keep the battery topped up and it works a charm - first one got knocked off by the cat and didn't survive the drop onto concrete. I have to remember to remove it when I start the engine (big diesel) or the vibration will knock the second one off !

Just ordered three time switches:

http://www.discount-electrical.co.uk/product.php/396116051/timeguard-ntt04-white-24hr-7day-compact-digital-socket-box-time-controller-with-1---2hr-boost--1-minute-switching---28-on---off-programs-16a

720 hour battery back up, automatic Summer / Winter time change over and a fairly simple programming sequence

Amazing variation in price between sellers - that one was the cheapest inc VAT and post I could find

Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2014, 10:02:34 PM »
I feel your pain Andrew -- and that must be rough being responsible for holiday tenants in that situation. I'm sure you'll come up with some improvement.

When I lived on my houseboat twenty years ago, I had a Heart Interface inverter that charged the batteries at dock, and it had an automatic transfer switch that instantly kicked in ships power as soon as the connection was cut. So when there were power outtages around me in the evening, I'd hear a click, and the slight hum of the inverter, and not even a flicker of the lights. Stereo still working. Computer unfazed. Looking out the ports, I could see the neighborhood blacked out. This happened quite a few times in rural Florida where I spent a few years. Nothing like an independent backup power source!

Now I have to start the generator, and that can be a pain in the middle of the night in mid winter.

I've still got the inverter and would love to hook it up to at least one house circuit, but it cuts out now, and I don't have the electronic know how to fix it.
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2014, 11:00:00 AM »
Steve or some other moderator: this thread is in the wrong box, I must have had a brain f**t - can you move it please !


Well some progress:

Today I replaced three non preserved timers with ones with a 720 hour back up, so that's three less things to re-set after a power cut.

Also I took delivery of an APC Smart 750 UPS and started integrating it with my HP DC6700 pc and Windows 7. Got it to the stage that they talk via usb, and if the UPS is unplugged it supports the PC for a few minutes then shuts it down. Then I remembered a feature this pc has exhibited for some time - it turns itself back on  :bang: Tried and failed before to solve it.

Several things in a modern PC can kick it off - the network card for instance can start the PC if it sees activity. However everything was disabled and battened down. I re-set the bios to factory defaults - even changed the power supply for one from a PC I know doesn't do this. No avail.

A bit of googling found a chap with the same issue, solved by pressing a reset cmos button next to the cmos battery on this same model - blast no button  :bang:

So I reasoned - remove the cmos battery, short out the battery holder contacts to discharge any on board capacitors and it should do the same as the button. Sure did  :ddb: I restored the factory cmos defaults and the system now happily stays shut down when it's been told to - phew !!!

Well - almost phew. Now part way through restarting first time, it shuts down again  :bang: Second re-start is ok. Need to do more investigation, but AVG has just started auto update and we are going out, so I'll save this investigation for later.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Online NormanV

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2014, 11:49:04 AM »
It should be a doddle for you after your CNC mill epic!

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2014, 05:35:42 PM »
Thanks Spud for moving the topic - I must have been having hissy putting it where I did!

OK it seems at the moment the UPS throws a wobbly almost exactly 2 1/2 minutes after it gets power back. Leave it to get past it's seizure before rebooting the pc and everything is fine. Must be a setting somewhere as it's too repeatable to be a fault in the normal sense of the word.
 
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline spuddevans

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2014, 03:29:47 AM »
Thanks Spud for moving the topic - I must have been having hissy putting it where I did!

No problem :thumbup:

Quote
OK it seems at the moment the UPS throws a wobbly almost exactly 2 1/2 minutes after it gets power back. Leave it to get past it's seizure before rebooting the pc and everything is fine. Must be a setting somewhere as it's too repeatable to be a fault in the normal sense of the word.

It's funny you say that, but when I first switch on my CNC PC, it will interrupt and reset the CNC drivers. I think it interrupts the "Heartbeat" signal sent out the parallel port, but it does it without putting Mach3 into "reset" mode, so I think it is something in the hardware level. The reason for mentioning it is that it occurs about the same timing as you describe (although I have never timed it)

I've just learned to put the PC on as soon as I get into the workshop, then by the time I want to use the Mill it will be past the point where this occurs.

Perhaps there may be a common cause to both yours and my problems, perhaps some "self test" that either the PC hardware or the operating system makes shortly after booting that messes with your UPS (and my CNC driver)


Tim
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Offline Pete W.

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2014, 05:44:26 AM »
Hi there, Andrew,

Thank you for your account of that session of computer diagnosis and repair/reconfiguration, a useful contribution to the 'Group' knowledge!   :thumbup:   :thumbup: 
All duly noted.

We have a saying in this household: 'computers are fun, FUN, FUN'!  Usually voiced while simulating tearing of hair!   :bang:   :bang:   :bang: 

If you think the power outages (aka CUTS) are bad now, just wait until 'they' get to phase two of smart meter introduction! 
Best regards,

Pete W.

If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, you haven't seen the latest design change-note!

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2014, 08:54:18 AM »
So a bit more progress -  I videoed the UPS lights as it went through its wobbly stage for the benefit of the vendor, who is equally puzzled. I have installed a second identical UPS on my workshop PC with as far as I can tell an identical configuration, as it throws the same hissy fit  :scratch:

This tells me it's either a setup / configuration issue or a feature. It's not a show stopper, as all I have to do is not re-start the PC for several minutes after a power outage, and usually this would be the case anyway

Here is an EXTREMELY boring video:

Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline pete3000

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2014, 11:44:33 AM »
looks like its a config. the manual is here http://www.apcmedia.com/salestools/ASTE-6Z8LC7/ASTE-6Z8LC7_R0_EN.pdf
 the 2nd paragraph under shutdown mode.... the display scroll if the ups is ordered to shutdown by the PC to preserve UPS batt capacity.

We normally run our UPS's the other way round, i.e shutdown once ups has only 10-20% batt remaining. Which keeps systems up as long as poss for short outages. this is done from powerchute software.

Of course the usual caveat is that you can't then have output from UPS to turn the systems back on until you have 10-20% charge back in the batteries. :bang:

We have our computer Bios set to after power failure = power on. (meaning as soon as we have 20% the systems come back up.)

HTH
Pete
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2014, 05:12:25 PM »
Hi Pete - I'm sure that the PC is not instructing the UPS to power down, as at the point that the hissy fit occurs, the PC is fully down, not running and has no power!

However I suspect that as the UPS is programmed to reboot as soon as power is returned, this feature is actually happening 2 minutes after power is back on - perhaps APC's interpretation of immediate varies from mine !

My requirement is to shut the PCs down gracefully rather than to keep them running through a power cut, so I think that it is probably best to leave the config as it is, and work round the issue by not bringing the PCs back on line for several minutes after power is restored, which is no great hardship.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline chipenter

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2014, 02:06:39 AM »
At least you have a PC still running Monday we had a power cut , and the PC wouldnt start after the power came back on , power supply fried also took out the hard drive and floppy , only half my data backed up  :doh: but now I have a one tereabit drive I have no way of backing that up iff it's full , agro I could have done without .
Jeff

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #17 on: December 01, 2014, 04:50:19 PM »
Well at long last I have been able to source a generator that meets my specification in price and 'solidness' !

It's based on a 3 cylinder Lister ST03 diesel engine driving an alternator rated at 12.5 kVA as a base load. Many of the modern import generators are useless for long running, and although this hopefully will only ever occasionally run for a day or so it should do it reliably.

It has been a stand by set in Council offices and probably has only run for regular test runs, showing 100 hours on the meter.

Our absolute top load limited by the 100 amp company fuses is 25 kW so 12.5 will amply cover virtually anything running, including our 'cottage guests' using their hobs, ovens, kettles etc !!!
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #18 on: December 01, 2014, 04:56:29 PM »
I think that the engine dates from the mid to late 1980's - it may or may not have been new when Puma incorporated into a generating set - it's obviously been re-painted looking at the engine plate.

Not physically seen it yet - just been arranging for it's collection by a pallet company. The good thing is that it comes with a brand new auto change-over starter panel
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #19 on: December 01, 2014, 05:02:51 PM »
It's fairly doubtful that I'll have it installed and up and running this winter. I need to construct some sort of weatherproof housing for it close enough to our main power connection, and also fabricate a fuel tank. The design of the housing is a bit limited as it will be in a pretty visible place. I suppose that I could locate the main change over relay close to the company meter in a wall housing, and drive it remotely, so I could tuck the generator out of sight. That at least reduces the run of heavy duty cable (25 or maybe 35 mm csa) to one pair as it is stupidly expensive  :bugeye:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Online AdeV

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2014, 05:55:13 PM »
That's a very nice looking genset, colour me jealous... I still haven't sorted out my CS-based backup unit yet (one day, one day)...

BTW, if you're interested, I think I have that same model UPS, the plastic front panel is damaged and the batteries are toast. If you like, I'll send it to you FOC (sans batteries obviously, they're useless).

I upgraded to a massive APC unit I got at a bargain price - brand new, but it got dropped on delivery & smashed all the plastic front panel up. The vendor didn't dare power it up - I just plugged it in & got on with it, it's a 3000AH unit, so I can boil my kettle with it for over an hour!
Cheers!
Ade.
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Online AdeV

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2014, 06:03:38 PM »
PS: Engine is 1982 - add 50 to the first 2 digits to get the year; next set of digits are the engine no, then the type (ST3), rotation (C is probably clockwise, vs A for anticlock BUT... it could be C=counterclockwise and blank = clockwise... the dating page doesn't elaborate). The trailing 03 is the build number. Again, what this is is not specified...

http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel/EngineDating/Dating6.htm
Cheers!
Ade.
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Offline mattinker

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #22 on: December 02, 2014, 12:43:32 AM »
rotation (C is probably clockwise, vs A for anticlock BUT... it could be C=counterclockwise and blank = clockwise... the dating page doesn't elaborate).

http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel/EngineDating/Dating6.htm

I may be wrong, but I thought that Lister was British, anticlockwise is a US term, so I would imagine that it is anti-clock and clockwise!

Regards, Matthew./

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #23 on: December 02, 2014, 02:38:01 AM »
Ade - a very kind offer thanks

Matt , when I used to work on large American disk drives they used 'CW - clockwise' and 'CCW - counter clockwise' but Google tells me that Lister, who are / were British, used Z as the anti clockwise indicator.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline mattinker

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2014, 08:25:28 AM »
rotation (C is probably clockwise, vs A for anticlock BUT... it could be C=counterclockwise and blank = clockwise... the dating page doesn't elaborate).

http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel/EngineDating/Dating6.htm

I may be wrong, but I thought that Lister was British, anticlockwise is a US term, so I would imagine that it is anti-clock and clockwise!

Regards, Matthew./

My slip, I wrote it the wrong way, counter clockwise being the US term! Lister use "Z" strangr!

Regards, Matthew

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #25 on: December 02, 2014, 08:39:39 AM »
That's a fine genset, Andrew. Very envious!  :beer:
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2014, 11:39:51 AM »
It ain't arrived yet Steve - it may be a clunker  :bugeye: But I sincerely hope not  :scratch:

But it's exactly what I was looking for (if it works). I have a friend who went 'off grid' for a couple of years and he must have brought his 'far east genny' to me at least half a dozen times for bits that had broken, stuck, fatigued or just died. Horrid design and reminiscent of your 'carb and tank built into dash board' issue !
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2014, 02:30:30 PM »
Well Andrew I have to admit that I have a far east genny, but it's a Lister clone of 600 lbs of cast iron, producing 6 hp @ 600 rpm.

Funny note apropos this thread, the nigh beforeThanksgiving (Nov 28) we got 12" of snow -- heavy wet stuff that stuck to trees. And the ground was still soft from rain and not frozen. So it ripped out trees by the root balls along the roads and we had 4 power outtages in a row as stuff came down on the wires throughout the area.

I have got my Lister type gen all ready except for a starter motor and a line to the house transfer switch. It is still hand cranked, but that's really difficult to manage with 30 weight oil and low temps.

So I went to my other modern 3600 RPM racketmaker gasoline generator (Generac brand) which was already hooked to the transfer switch, under a little roof next to the house. Gave it 3 pulls and the starter cord broke and I fell over backwards into the snow cursing it worse than the snow-blower with the bad tank. Of course it was dark outside, and I wasn't about to try to fix a recoil starter under those conditions by flashlight (electric torch) -- I would certainly drop nuts, dogs, springs, whatever into the snow. Also couldn't do it inside since the lights were out, of course! So I just gave up. We lit candles, read, and went to bed early. Not such a bad thing.

I do think however that there should be a reverse-Nobel prize. And it should be given to the inventor of the recoil starter. What was wrong with the prior system of a pulley with a notch in it that you wrapped a rope around? Any rope.

Rope broke, so what?

Repairing a recoil starter is one of the jobs I least look forward to....... and in the dark outside in winter during an emergency (sort of)?
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
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Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2014, 03:16:58 PM »
I have a 4kW Briggs and Stratton (spell check wants to substitute CASTRATION  for stratton :lol:)  engined generator that I use as standby at the moment, and it's recoil starter only recoils when the engine is running. So if it doesn't start first pull you are knackered. It is possible to ease it back a tiny bit at a time by sticking fingers into it, but not easy.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2014, 04:21:06 PM »
I fixed the recoil yesterday. Took t off the motor.  It was all plastic, and at first I couldn't figure out how to get it apart, with no obvious screws or fasteners. Then I realized the front metal badge was only a peel off label. But underneath, still no bolts or screws. Just a black plastic circle with a white nylon square shaft protruding though it. Finlly guessing the nylon might be a sort of peg or wedge, I threw cautions to the winds and put pliers on it squeezed and pulled. Sure enough, it was a double wedge locking device, and the squeeze action compressed the barbed legs and it came out.

I didn't have enough dacron braided line to replace the starter rope (and it is thin stuff on these recoil starters), I decided to just shorten it 6". To do this you have to thread it through the guide ferrule first before the rubber handle, and tie a stopper knot. Very difficult as the cord had to make a right angle turn in the rubber handle, and it wanted to fray instead of slide around the bend. I heated the rope end up with a match to try to keep it whipped together.
 
Finally getting that done with the help of tweezers, needle nose pliers, and foul language, I tied the knot and pulled it tight in the handle. Ready to reassemble. Parts laid out on the table. There were two dogs and springs, but no shafts for the dogs. They just fit in recesses in the plastic and pivoted in that.

I tried putting it back together, but it wouldn't all fit, because the spring wouldn't hook onto the proper mating part. The end had a flattened loop that was supposed to mate with a plastic lip. I re-bent the loop to make it easier, and managed to stuff the whole clam back into its shell. But the spring was no longer wound so the recoil wouldn't work. I'd  hoped that there was some kind of retainer on the bulk of the spring, keeping tension in. Because I'd never heard it go "Sproing" when I took it apart. But no such luck. It was unwound fully.

So I realized I was going to have to manually wind the whole thing before putting the recoil mechanism back in its cage. And to do that, I realized I'd have to remove the rubber handle from the cord again, wind the spring, wind the cord on the pulley, insert the unit in the cage, and then somehow fish the line out of the ferrule, and reinstall the rubber handle.

So 20 minutes later, mainly due to the restringing operations, I had it back together, had reinstalled the plastic wedge (which was harder than removing it) and was pulling on the cord to test the spring action, when one of the dogs popped out and landed on the floor. I apparently hadn't exactly lined everything up when reinstalling the wedge, and the dog had space to come loose. Which was why the wedge was so hard to press in place.

Finally, I managed to get the whole infernal machine (with label) back together again, and glumly returned to the generator to bolt it in place. I of course dropped one of the attachment bolts into the snow. Right next to the piece of plastic I put down to catch anything I dropped.

I was able to dig it out in a few minutes with raw fingers, and got the starter back on the machine. To give it a test, I flipped the choke on, opened the tank valve, switched the generator to run, and gave it a pull. It started instantly. Which so surprised me that I slipped backwards into the snow again. Or perhaps I just pulled too hard while off balance.

Of course the power had long since been restored...... :lol:



I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #30 on: December 02, 2014, 04:52:20 PM »
Steve  you said
"I do think however that there should be a reverse-Nobel prize"
There is the "Ignobel Prize" I think that covers all your needs.
 

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #31 on: December 02, 2014, 05:20:54 PM »
Steve, you definitely need to get an electric starter fitted ASAP !!!
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Online NormanV

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #32 on: December 02, 2014, 05:25:47 PM »
Snow? In December, I was not expecting it here until February!

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #33 on: December 02, 2014, 06:45:31 PM »
It snowed November 27 Norman, and in the last couple of days melted 10 of the 12 inches that were put down then. But my wife just let the dog in a minute ago (just after dinner here) and his fur was covered with snow after 5 minutes out there. So I guess it's coming back!

 In the last two weeks we have had temps ranging from 17C to -12C -- in fact those two temps were only one day apart. The weather has gone completely wopperjawed here. Don't know whether to wear shorts or a snowmobile suit!

Can't complain about snow after what happened to Buffalo though. It was the same numbers, but inches here compared to feet there
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline PekkaNF

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #34 on: December 13, 2014, 04:02:07 AM »
I stubeld upon this one, while searching aux. tank with filtering and gravity feed for my portable diesel generator project, but it might be usefull here.

http://www.hardydiesel.com/acc/exhaust-kit.html

Bottom of the page is an illustration that might interest on exhaust and cooling air routting.

Pekka


Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #35 on: December 18, 2014, 07:47:47 AM »
So at long last the 1/4" BSP 'banjo bolt' and 9 mm 'banjo' arrived in the post this morning so I've been able to rig up a temporary fuel tank (5 litre bottle!) and do some load testing.

First job was to crimp up the fuel line from the filter to the newly installed fuel lift pump. Easy peasy. Then to bleed air out of the system. I powered up the pump, slackened off the banjo and waited  -  and waited - - and waited - pump clacking away but no fuel  :scratch:

Initially I thought that perhaps the pump needed priming, this would have been "BAD" as it's supposed to lift a minimum of 12" dry and I need it to. Anyway I pulled the pipe out of the 5 litre bottle, put a funnel in the end and 'primed' it.

Hang on, why are bubbles coming up into the funnel - surely I can't have put it in the wrong way round, it's very clearly labelled with arrows on both side saying 'fuel flow'  :bang:

Then - well no I've put it in as labelled - surely they can't have labelled it wrongly  :scratch: Oh yes they can  :lol: :lol:

The pump is a Chinese clone of a "Facet Cube" electronic pump. It has a bent up clamp that is also the mounting and this carries the stamped flow direction markings. Un-crimped the fuel lines, bent up it's tabs, assembled it the right way round and reversed the pipes - now I stink of diesel - but it works  :ddb:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #36 on: December 18, 2014, 07:54:07 AM »
So on to the load test. It took a bit of cranking to get air out of the system and firing on all three cylinders, but we got there in the end.

Load consisted of a 4kW fan heater that's supposed to be wall mounted and a pair of 500 watt halogen lights - only 5kW and we should be able to push 15 kW at a squeeze, but it's all that I had to hand.

Took it no problems
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #37 on: December 18, 2014, 08:08:26 AM »
Andrew
Better get another oil pump , fit a hi/low switch to the sump hook up the system with new pump the right way round this time to a lube oil tank

That's what we did to the off site standby sets , but we did have remote monitoring . The main Gennys had to be checked 4 Hourly as they drank sump oil this was no problem as we were on site 365/24/7 anyway
Maybe that's why the had 96 gall sumps  :Doh: they were for info V16 96 litre 1000hp units by clatterpiller we had five and a V12 unit each rated and tested at 750 kW at 1000 rpm

There was a calculation for fuel used and the amount of lube oil that should be used , but they were beautiful inside all rods were polished not what you would expect

As to fuel how about 50 gall per hour of load each  :doh:

Stuart

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #38 on: December 18, 2014, 08:20:40 AM »
Stuart, Lister used to sell a remote oil tank and gubbins for this engine for long running - it shouldn't be an issue for the use this will see.

Talking of oil, I'm pleased to report that it shows good oil pressure when running.

When it arrived there was a fairly basic battery charger bolted into the box on top of the alternator, wired so that the generator charged its battery when running. Not a lot of use for a stand by generator as the battery needs maintaining over possibly many months of idleness before use. So I've removed it and intend to rig up a battery maintainer powered off the house ring main. When on normal mains, it'll charge, when the lights go out and the generator starts and powers up the house, it'll still charge  :thumbup:
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #39 on: December 18, 2014, 08:28:57 AM »
Love that green! Nice genset!!!  :drool:

I imagine your Lister is a lot smoother, too, than my one lunger. I had to put down serious damping, and it's very inadvisable to start the old singles just bolted to the steel bearers. They have a habit of chasing you around the room with 200 lbs of spinning flywheels....
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #40 on: December 18, 2014, 08:43:27 AM »
Apologies, Andrew I hit the modify button instead of the quote button and overwrote your post before I realized it :palm:

Second time I've done this -- I think I ought to turn in my moderator badge...  (Steve)

 :doh:


ps. I think you just mentioned low vibration on the Lister, and the fact that the shade of green was not the proper one.......sorry!
« Last Edit: December 18, 2014, 09:31:38 AM by vtsteam »
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #41 on: December 18, 2014, 09:08:16 AM »
I figured a three cyl would be nice that way. What is the RPM, running, Andrew?

I think mine would be useful in the Spring if I was back into fishing. At 600 RPM, and with it's massive power stroke and weight, it shakes the earth all around. It's not unpleasant -- in fact we all think the sound running IS pleasant. Just a thump thump thump.

But my thought is, it ought to drive the nightcrawlers (earthworms) nuts on a spring evening when they're near the surface and easy to collect. I bet there would be hundreds of them out ready for the picking up with a little run of my genset!!

There ought to be a Roald Dahl story about that!

ps. We Yanks aren't up on our greens like you guys are -- much to our detriment, ornamentally.  I just figure if a motor is green it's a Lister  :palm:

Always a pleasure to see the range of door colo(u)rs you have, and locomotives not just colored black.... :beer:
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #42 on: December 18, 2014, 11:27:13 AM »
OK walk all over my posts - see if I care , I'll go in the garden and eat worms :clap: :clap:

Seriously - no problems Steve, it was probably rubbish anyway  :ddb:

I think I was rambling on about not being sure that its' actually the right colour - supposed to be "Brunswick Green" I believe, but I thought that that was darker, rather like "British Racing Green"

It's nominal speed is 1500 rpm
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #43 on: December 18, 2014, 11:45:34 AM »
1500 must sound okay Andrew -- not like my little 3600 RPM gasoline racket-maker. I still haven't hooked the big Listeroid to the house transfer switch, so the racket-maker still gets used in power-outs. After the tiny shop is finished, I'm going to change that and get the Listeroid connected. Not sure what shade of green mine is!
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline awemawson

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #44 on: December 18, 2014, 11:56:03 AM »
I'm surprised it's actually not too bad noise wise, especially considering so far I've just screwed the 'pepper pot' exhaust terminal into the exhaust manifold and left off the silencer ! Biggest noise at the moment comes from the rattling of the lid of the electrical box as it's just laying on not screwed down yet.

Putting 5kW load on made a just perceptible change in the engine note. I think it's a 1900 cc engine rate 18 BHP / 13.4 kW continuous with a 10% overload margin (just looked it up!)
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline vtsteam

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #45 on: December 18, 2014, 03:01:23 PM »
I'm sure 5 kW was easily handled with 18 bhp!

The figures for mine are 1400 cc (single) 6 hp and about 3.5 kW (though I have a 5kW gen head).
I love it when a Plan B comes together!
Steve
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sDubB0-REg

Offline PekkaNF

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #46 on: December 19, 2014, 02:59:24 AM »
My generator is:
http://www.pramac.com/pages/Product_detail_fr/513?ixRecordTableName=vw_p_product_sheet&root_node=2&lang=en_GB&id_market=176&id_product=1026&ixRecordId=1026

Yanmar L70N engine and it is nominally 6,7 hp at 3600 rpm, but continuous power at 3000 rpm is 4,1 kW making it fair close match to nominally 3,9 kVA generator and continuous power of 3kW of electics.

Pekka

Offline Joules

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Re: Bally Power Cuts !
« Reply #47 on: December 19, 2014, 07:27:19 AM »
Our Generator is a Kipor 6700TA

http://www.kiporuk.co.uk/diesel-generator/kde-6700ta-400-64-67.php

Clone Yanmar diesel engine in it.  The thing can run our IT systems if we loose power, we also have a small battery bank that is solar charged and can be kept topped up with the generator in the winter if we don't get sun.  Yep even in the UK on a sunny winters day we get enough juice to fully charge our battery bank. 4.8kw of which 2.4kw is our allowed drain doesn't sound much, but it gives us time to start the generator should we have a power cut without the computers all going down, also covers the house lights and network/telephone gear.
Honour your mentors, and pay it forward.