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Gallery, Projects and General => Project Logs => Topic started by: vtsteam on January 30, 2018, 08:49:47 PM

Title: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on January 30, 2018, 08:49:47 PM
Uhhhhhhhh, I kind of went with an impulse purchase........

Well, I've always loved Westinghouse type twins......... But models......now I'm about to own the real thing!  :loco:

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/WestTwinsm.jpg)
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: Joe d on January 30, 2018, 11:01:12 PM
So is the shop going to be rigged for line-shaft power?

Nice engine Steve :clap: :clap:

Joe
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: SwarfnStuff on January 31, 2018, 12:49:59 AM
 :proj: Will keep you entertained for a day or so plus a few more methinks.

Have fun working on it,

John B
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: awemawson on January 31, 2018, 02:42:30 AM
Nice  :thumbup:

So a nice big wood powered boiler next Steve ?
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: philf on January 31, 2018, 07:32:34 AM
Steve,

Call that a steam engine!

This is a steam engine:  :thumbup:

(You may want to turn the volume down before hitting Play if you don't like the sound of about 100 schoolchildren screaming!)



Cheers.

Phil.

Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: awemawson on January 31, 2018, 10:29:48 AM
Phil is that one of the rolling mill engines ?
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: seadog on January 31, 2018, 10:35:40 AM
Call that a steam engine?

Now this is a steam engine  :D

Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: philf on January 31, 2018, 10:42:05 AM
Phil is that one of the rolling mill engines ?

It is Andrew - hence the need to be able to reverse very quickly. It is awesome.

Phil.
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: philf on January 31, 2018, 11:04:14 AM
Call that a steam engine?

Now this is a steam engine  :D


Hi Seadog,

Very impressive - must try to see it some time.

But that is only 1,008 hp compared with 12,000 hp and the River Don Engine can go from full speed forward to full speed reverse in 2 seconds! (& it doesn't need a starter motor!)

Cheers.

Phil.
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on January 31, 2018, 01:18:23 PM
Hey, I still say I have a bigger one than the rest of you guys!  :headbang:  :lol:
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: philf on January 31, 2018, 01:38:51 PM
Hey, I still say I have a bigger one than the rest of you guys!  :headbang:  :lol:

Hope you mean a bigger steam engine! In which case that's true - certainly in my case.  :beer:
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: awemawson on January 31, 2018, 02:12:40 PM
OK chaps - keep the Testosterone under control  :clap:
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: Stilldrillin on January 31, 2018, 03:00:14 PM
The River Don engine, was built to roll WW1 battleship armour plate. Made from 24" thick steel.......  :bugeye:

Quite an experience, to stand beside. Especially, when the children are all in school.  :thumbup:
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vintageandclassicrepairs on January 31, 2018, 03:42:01 PM
Hi All,
For those into steam engines and machining have a look at David Richards channel on YouTube



Steve,
What era would the Westinghouse engine be from?

John


Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: philf on January 31, 2018, 04:36:54 PM
Talking of big things - you need a big vice to hold the big parts.

Also at the Kelham Island Museum:

(http://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10017/P1100643.JPG)

Phil.
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: awemawson on January 31, 2018, 04:38:50 PM
Oi - my bench vise is a Record No 3 and it ain't that big  :bugeye:
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on February 01, 2018, 10:32:27 PM
John, I'm not sure of the manufacturer. The true Westinghouse engines that I've seen online had different shaped crankcases. But I think I now have a clue to the maker-- it is coming from Michigan and I found this online about a Detroit, Michigan engine maker.

I think there's a strong resemblance in the photos on the museum webpage linked below, and I also know mine has a 4" bore. Not sure of the stroke yet. It's supposed to arrive next week.

http://newsm.org/steam/murphy-two-cylinder-steam-engine


(http://newsm.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Murphy-MA014.jpg)

Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on February 01, 2018, 10:52:18 PM
I'm guessing that It might run 20-30 hp if it's a 4" x 5" twin and it can run maybe 1000 rpm on 175 psi.

I don't really know, of course, but that's a chair butt laptop engineering guess without much solid ground to go on.

I don't need that much hp -- my 6 hp Listeroid diesel will put out 3 kw steady, and in a power outage it will run most everything in the house, except the hot water heater.

So I will probably run this baby more modestly on steam, after repairs/restoration, and, if and when I ever have a boiler etc. for it.

600 rpm might be a good number, and that's the same as the Lister. My gen head is a 5 kW Chinese ST-5. Wouldn't be more than a pulley change to mate that up.
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on February 01, 2018, 11:15:09 PM
I might be off on that hp calculation. I'm not sure if it should be figured differently for this engine than the usual steam way, since it's a single acting engine. Maybe it should be more like 15 hp at 1000 rpm and 175 PSI (at the boiler).

Well anyway, probably 600 rpm will provide plenty of juice, and maybe push the ST-5 gen head to to make its max 5 kW rating, rather than the 3 kW I get now with the LIster. 10 hp out of the steam engine would do that.
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vintageandclassicrepairs on February 02, 2018, 09:21:17 AM
Hi Steve,
Thanks for the reply,
I'm chuckling away quietly here, "Murphy Iron Works Michegin " (plate on engine)
Us Irish got everywhere :wave:
It would be a cool setup to have the steam engine/ genny backup,
I wonder if you could also get domestic hot water as a by product?
Exhaust steam to a heat exchanger maybe?
Lots to think about :scratch:

John
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on February 02, 2018, 03:24:27 PM
Yes John, let's hope Mr. Murphy's law won't apply when it arrives, though my expectations are set to handle that anyway. Fixing stuff is second nature, and I can even cast iron here.

Yes, I had definitely thought about CLP some day. Waste heat is very useful here in Vermont 8 months of the year. I already have baseboard hot water heat set up, and a buried hot water supply and return line from the house to the shed (currently unused) from earlier wood chip furnace experiments.

In addition, our greatest electricity consumption now is for a hot water heater. If that were heated with an exchanger by way of a condenser after the steam engine -- I'd be killing a three birds with one stone.
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: Meldonmech on February 03, 2018, 12:39:16 PM
 ,
Hi Steve

                      What amazing potential,  are you setting yourself a target for complete installation?

                                        Good Luck

                                                          Cheers David
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on February 04, 2018, 02:10:10 PM
Hi David, no, sorry to say -- as always with steam, the boiler and auxiliary lubricators, feed pumps etc. are a lot more difficult to source (and pay for) than the engine itself. So that's all a "some day" dream.

On the other hand, taking the engine apart and cleaning it up, fixing things, shining, painting, etc costs next to nothing, so that's what I look forward to doing. As well as hooking up an air line for fun, assuming my compressor has the guts to turn it over....
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: tom osselton on February 04, 2018, 07:01:01 PM
Nice engine I'll be looking forward to your project!
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on February 16, 2018, 09:11:56 PM
Thanks Tom!

Well it's taken nearly 2 weeks but it (they) finally arrived today. Actually it's two engines one "runner" and one "parts" engine. The second block was originally going to be retained by the seller to cut down on shipping weight, but instead he just packed it aboard the shipping pallet, a nice surprise!

I didn't get them off my truck by this evening, and I left the wrap on because it's supposed to snow, but here are a few photos of what I received.

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/WestinghouseArrival3.jpg)

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/WestinghouseArrival1.jpg)

Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on March 25, 2018, 03:22:14 PM
Pathetic progress, I know, but the engines have sat under a tarp on my truck for over a month. The problem..... I pulled two muscles in my left arm, and winter being what it is here, and parking across an ice dammed stream away from the tractor meant no means of removal. Until this week's thaw, that is.   :palm:

So FINALLY, I was able to get the tractor across the stream and 300 feet up the hill to the road, and with careful maneuvering of the busted left wing, remove the engines from their pallet, and put each in turn in the tractor bucket. We made it across the stream to just outside of my workshop. Here they are temporarily setting in the snow after twisting them out of the bucket.  :ddb:

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/Murphy1.jpg)



Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on March 25, 2018, 03:26:45 PM
Here is the "good" engine:

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/Murphy2.jpg)
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on March 25, 2018, 03:33:33 PM
And here is the "bad" engine. As you can see, the series of bolts below the breather indicate a repair plate had been added -- after a rod throwing incident.

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/Murphy3.jpg)
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on March 25, 2018, 03:38:43 PM
Also, the crankshaft has been sawed off, (left side of engine) just behind the flat belt drive pulley. This was apparently accomplished by the last owner to remove parts to build up the "good" engine. Unfortunately .....  :(

Cut off shaft:

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/Murphy4.jpg)
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on March 25, 2018, 03:48:01 PM
Despite the injuries, I may try to resurrect the severely injured engine, since I have a working version to reference. And casting iron is still a possibility here.

Welding the crank may be possible if it's steel. I don't think the small flat pulley end outside of the crankcase really saw that much torque.

Pulley and a few spare parts tucked into the crankcase:

(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/Murphy5.jpg)
Title: Re: I bought a steam engine
Post by: vtsteam on March 25, 2018, 03:59:37 PM
Interesting view of the rocking inlet valve ports in the head of the "bad" engine:


(http://www.vtsteam.com/Westinghouse/Murphy6.jpg)