MadModder
The Shop => Wood & Stuff => Topic started by: Powder Keg on January 03, 2010, 12:13:51 AM
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My wife and I decided to build a small hand cranked organ this winter. I never "needed one" But I like the way they sound. There are a few examples on the net. Here is one example.
They really aren't that hard to build I don't think? There are a few pieces to them though. It will be a 20 note organ. We just started on it. But I have some of the things that I need rounded up and waiting. I'll snap some pictures tomorrow.
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I built one of the John Smith 20 note organs 6 or 7 years ago. It was a great project, lots of fun to take to shows- I call it my 'smile machine' because everyone that passes it breaks out in big smiles.
Be very cautious of the plans- trust NOTHING until you double check the other parts., Although the John Smith plans have opened a huge hobby, they are really very poor plans. I guess he understands that because he has a note bout it in the plans and on his web page. On the 20 note he gives some dimensions for the feed rollers, and he gives some text about the ratio. They are not the same, if you build it to the drawings the speed is wrong. My organ has lots of extra holes in the case where I had to move things to get them to fit properly. I started out just taking the drawing and making parts, only when I went to put things together did I figure out the problems.
I did not find any errors in the pipe dimensions.
I just ordered the plans for the 26 note and the Midi organ. Again, the plans are just crude hand sketches, and it takes a long time to study and get them figured out- he does include a DVD that helps a lot. I want to build a MIDI organ, probably a 65 key.
Its a great project, lots of fun to show and both satisfying and frustrating to build. There have been a couple other 20 note and one 26 note at Cabin Fever. The 26 note was a beautiful job, sorry I lost the name of the fellow that built it. He was there last year, hope to see it again this year.
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Thanks For your input Ron. I've heard that about the plans before. I've been looking them over. I love how e has metric and english dimensions on the same drawing. I'm pretty excited about this project.
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Sounds pretty complicated to me Wes! Interesting though, I'll certainly be watching if you managed to get any pics on here. I see a guy at all the shows up here that stands there cranking it over - I always thought it must be a bit boring repeating the same tunes but it never occured to me that he may have built it!
Nick
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Nick, It's way simpler than it looks. There are 3 billows inside, a pressure box, and an air bar that directs the air to each whistle. The music is made with paper tapes that when the holes move over the air bar air goes through the hole to the whistle. You can put a couple songs on each paper roll and the rolls are easily changed. That way you can play more than one song:o)
There are quite a few parts though. But if you break them down to pieces it won't be so bad. I don't think?
This weekend we cut up a 1" X 6" popular board into strips that were 2" X 3/16" thick on my band saw. I then took the strips to a buddy's house. He has a thickness sander and we sanded the strips down to 1/8" thick. I haven't had a chance to do any more yet. I had a couple things come up.
:proj:
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Wes,
Sounds good (no pun). I've always wondered how they work. So are the paper tapes readily available standard sizes etc?
Nick
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Yes, There's a couple of places that sell the tapes. I'm probably going to order a couple to make sure that the bought tapes fit when the organ is built. A lot of people make a punch so they can make their own music. I'll probably end up going this route for most of my music:o)
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Nothing like hand cranking the old organ to get a fella thru the long cold winter nights. :bugeye:
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We got some of the pieces for the smaller whistles cut out today. I think you have to reset the saw on just about every cut. Here are the pieces in stacks of four. We'll sand the edges and make one more cut. Then we can start gluing these together\o/
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles001.jpg)
The wood strips are getting used up fast to. But I think I have enough.
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That is a very fine-grained wood...what kind is it?
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We are using Popular for the whistles and the lips where the wind comes out will be Ash probably. I like Popular because it's easy to work with. It has a pretty consistent density and almost no knots:o)
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Nice 1 Wes, this is going to be really interesting, totally different from the norm!
Nick
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Well I have all but the last three Base whistles cut out. I'll get them today. After we get all the edges sanded down, I'll measure and cut the front piece for the aperture. This will be where the wind comes out. I'm getting good at converting MM into English measurements :bugeye: Then we can start gluing them together.
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Poplar is a good choice for its nice tight grain. I am not sure Ash is a good choice for the pipe lip. They must have a very sharp and crisp edge and Ash tends to have open grain that might make it hard to get a clean edge. Id stick with the poplar. If you want a contrasting color wood maybe Cherry.
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Thanks for the heads up on the Ash Ron. I'll do a couple of test pieces before I cut them all out :clap:
:wave: :wave: :wave:
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I forgot the picture. Here are all 20 pipes. I think the 5 biggest ones will be mitered after they are glued togather. This will make them fit in the case.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles002.jpg)
:wave: :wave: :wave:
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This sounds like a fun project, Wes. Well, except that I have such a hard time with wood, you know..
How large is the organ when it's finished? It looks like it would be just the neatest thing to run with a small-ish steam engine. Kind of like a miniature calliope.
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I had a chance to draw up a fancy crank handle. I wanted it to look old. I'll machine this out of Brass and machine a brass hub for the big end and a wood handle for the small end. I'll make it on the CNC after work one day this week.
:wave: :wave: :wave:
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This thing will be a real hoot when you get it done!
Best,
BW
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Hey Bob. How have you been?
Tonight I stayed after work and made a jig to hold my crank handle. I had a couple of problems with my program. But I got it. Took about 15 min to run all togather.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Handcrank001.jpg)
I'm planing on staying tomorrow to. The crank for this is built up and I want to machine some fancy webs for the throws on the crank.
I'll try and get a video.
:wave: :wave: :wave:
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Crank is starting to look good!
Keep it up.
Eric
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Yeah very nice :thumbup:
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Here are some links you might find useful
Mechcanical Music Digest and archives (http://mmd.foxtail.com/)
Roll cutter.com (http://www.rollcutter.com/)
castle wood organs (http://www.castlewoodorgans.com/)
Busker Organ music site UK (http://www.melright.com/busker/)
virtualorgan (http://www.virtualorgan.com/forum/)
crank organ plans (http://www.geocities.com/crankorgan/)
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Thanks for the links PT. They will come in handy. I almost didn't build this. One reason being, I have never read sheet music before. Don't know the first thing about it. I'm still a little nervous as to whether I can make music or just noise :lol:
The crank shaft is made from welded up parts. I decided to make the webs a little fancier than the sketches showed. I drilled the holes in one operation then used some cap screws to hold the pieces to machine the profile. I have about 5 min into each one. Ill machine the shafts to length and champher the ends so I can get a nice weld.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Crankshaft001.jpg)
There aren't many more metal parts on this thing. I have the plywood ordered and the Ash sanded down to thickness. I'm going to try and get some of the whistles glued togather this weekend.
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looking good wes :thumbup:
it is nice too see projects involving metal and wood.
i will be following this project as it progresses. :D
chuck :wave:
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Thanks for the links PT. They will come in handy. I almost didn't build this. One reason being, I have never read sheet music before. Don't know the first thing about it. I'm still a little nervous as to whether I can make music or just noise :lol:
Well what is music but orginized noise, right? :lol:
Can't wait to hear what kind of orginized noise your box will make when complete. Orange Blosom Speical comes to mind. :med:
Bernd
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I have glue all over my fingers :dremel: Today I got all the main parts of the whistles glued togather\o/ I think I spent 5 or six hours on them. It took every little clamp I have.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles003.jpg)
I used a piece of aluminum angle as a jig to keep the pieces square.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles004.jpg)
Here are all the little square wood tubes. I have to glue in the bottom and the piece for the air chamber.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles005.jpg)
More tomorrow.....
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Looking good Wes, starting to come together. Keep up the good work.
Nick
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Thanks Nick!!!
I've been working on the end pieces today. There are 2 pieces that form the bottom and the chamber where the air comes in. I cut out the pieces and started gluing them in. The 3 biggest whistles were slightly out of square. I just pulled them over while I was gluing the bottom piece in.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles006.jpg)
The pieces were cut a little long. They stand proud of the face slightly. After the glue dries, I'll sand them down flush with the surface.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles007.jpg)
Nearly half done with the whistles\o/
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles008.jpg)
Next step will be to start cutting the pieces for the lips. They will be made out of Ash.
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They're neat, Wes. Even B&W pics. How about that?
One batch of these has an angled piece of wood in the ends. Are these separate pieces from the ones that have the two small square blocks in the end?
I'm trying to figure out how these work, and how you tune them.
Dean
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Hey Dean, The angled pieces are just setting there so they don't get lost. It is the short piece that came off the front piece. I used part of it and cut another to make the two pieces that form the chamber where the air will enter the whistle. Here is another B&W of the ends sanded down flush. I have about 8 this far now.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles009.jpg)
The last ten I'm going to let my wife glue. She has smaller fingers :clap: And can handle them better.
There will be a couple of front cover pieces that will make the whistle work. Then there is a stopper that you can slide up an down to adjust the note.
I need to get some brass tubing. I'm going to rework how the tubes fasten to the pipes.
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wes do you ever sleep :scratch:
you seam to be getting allot of work done in a short period of time and you have the wife involved in this project............you are one lucky man. i can't get anyone in my family to help with what i work on.
keep up the good work :dremel: :thumbup:
chuck :wave:
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I sleep pretty good. I don't watch much TV. Sometimes I spend too much time on the puter though :scratch: I'd be happier if we went to 50 hour days. I think I could catch up on everything. :lol:
:wave: :wave: :wave:
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Great work Wes :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: an interesting project I'm watching this one carefully.
Have fun
Stew
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he is another site, Fo recording of mech music, he just bought out the other outfit great stuff at not bad prices. For use people that the only musical instrument I can play is an IPod :lol:
Band Organ Music (http://www.bandorganmusic.com/index.html) make sure you check out the links page.
your project is coming along great!
:thumbup:
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Thanks for the links PT!!! I need all the help I can get :lol:
I'd like to play this on my organ. My Grandpa sand this when I was a little boy.
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Tonight Ten of the whistles are ready for the hardwood lips to make them functional. I cut out the last 20 pieces so my wife can glue them up tonight. Tomorrow I'll start making the lips. They will have a teeny bit of mill work on them. I'll post more pictures then\o/
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Still plugging away at these whistles. I started cutting out the cover pieces that will make the whistles work. They were drawn up flat across the top. Mine will take a little more work , but I think they look better.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles010.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles011.jpg)
:wave: :wave: :wave:
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Today my wife glued her pieces togather and sanded the whistles down. I'll get to cutting out the rest of the hardwood for the small whistles.
The plywood showed up also. We can start out cutting the pieces for the front to mount the whistles to. Then the pieces for the billows. I still need to find some leather for that. I also need some tubing to supply the whistles with air. Still a lot to do\o/
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For the leather your best best for small amounts is http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com/ (http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com/) check they may have a store near you. the only other ones I have are wholesale large minimum.
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Thanks for that Glen. I forgot about them. I'll get an order coming. I don't think it will take long to build the billows.
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how-to-make-tune-and-voice-reedpipes (http://www.lulu.com/product/download/how-to-make-tune-and-voice-reedpipes/6284040)
Will also put it in the resource list
Download is $4.95 or you can get it as a print on demand type book mailed to you. For $13.95
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For leather Id go to http://www.columbiaorgan.com/col/ (http://www.columbiaorgan.com/col/) They have the real stuff for organs. I ordered small quantities from them
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Thanks Ron!!! I have an email off to them checking on the prices for the pieces that I need.
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Powder Keg
Any updates to report? Just a gentle reminder. :D :D
Cheers :beer:
Don
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Thanks Don,
Summer actives (fishing:o) and work have distracted me. It is still fresh in my mind though. I'm going to see Birk next weekend and check out his organ in detail\o/
Wes
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I'm not touching that last sentence, no way, no how. :jaw:
Bernd
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Me neither :doh:
Cheers :beer:
Don
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So Wes , did you check out his organ ,, was it satisfactory :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Rob
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Thanks Don,
Summer actives (fishing:o) and work have distracted me. It is still fresh in my mind though. I'm going to see Birk next weekend and check out his organ in detail\o/
Wes
OK Wes, we are no longer interested in Birks organ. How is your organ progressing before the summer activities get in the way again? Inquiring minds want to know. :poke: :poke: :lol: :lol:
Cheers :beer:
Don
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Thanks for the prodding people :poke: I need it sometimes. When we left We were making the whistles.
Back to the whistles. My wife sanded down the parts so they are all a nice fit. Today we are going to mark the back of the lips and mill them so air can escape and make the whistling noise. The plans showed a piece of card stock glued between the lip and the whistle body. This seemed like a really cheesy way to make these to me?
Pictures soon\o/
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I forgot to add. When we were at Birks, He gave me a piece of leather and the patterns he used to cut his out. So there's no excuses now right?
I'll post pictures of that also :ddb:
Wes :wave:
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This morning we marked the bottom piece where the air will escape from the whistle.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles012.jpg)
I set up the mill and showed my wife a couple things then she milled the rest of them.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles013.jpg)
She did a great job on all of them.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles014.jpg)
Here is what we were after. A nice clean thin slit for the air to escape.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Whistles015.jpg)
The plans originally had a piece of card stock cut from a cereal box cut to this shape and sandwiched between this piece and the whistle to create this slit. I thought that was kind of a cheesy way to make them.
Next I'll start cutting out some of the larger pieces.
Wes :wave:
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This was an very intressting project that you have started, and you have your'e wife with you. Greate. :clap: :clap: :clap: :thumbup:
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The plans are kind of poor. There are some missing dimensions and some wrong dimensions. I've been searching the internet trying to find builds where people have mentioned these errors. Hopefully I have found them all. Mainly it seems like the overall width is off sometimes. There is one area that seems to be about 3/16" short and another that is around 3/8" short. The only trouble is that I can't really tell till I start assembling things. There Is also a website that has tips and tricks to make your Busker organ better. I went through that and have come up with a few things that I am going to do to mine.
Today I'm going to start on what is called the pressure box. It will be where the air from the bellows travels to before it goes out to the whistles. It has the Plexiglas window in the video. The sides of the cabinet fasten to this.
Stay tuned....
:wave:
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I spent a while longer double checking the changes I made. I would like this to work good when done. The pieces were cut out of 1/8" and 1/4" plywood that is finished on both sides. I had to special order it. No one in town carries this kind of stuff. There were a couple of holes that I drilled before I glued things together, per the instructions. I then began gluing the pressure box together. The hump in the middle still needs to be cut out and glued in. These dimensions were missing in the plans. I'll just measure what I have and make them to fit. I have some small bits that still need cut out and fitted. I'll work on it after work tomorrow. I'm hooked again :zap: :ddb: :zap:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Pressurebox001.jpg)
Here you can see where I marked where the hump will be.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Pressurebox002.jpg)
More later :ddb: :ddb: :ddb:
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I'm getting good at converting MM into English measurements
I've just picked up on this project, great fun.
Why bother to convert surely you've got a ruler and a digital vernier with mm graduations.
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No metric rulers here. I have a set of 4" digital calipers. Somewhere. But I think the battery's are dead.
There is a part called the tracker bar. The paper rides over the top of this and as a hole in the paper travels over a hole in the bar, it is directed to a whistle. I am going to deviate from the plans here. There have been some nice ones made. I'm going to try and replicate one of them.
Wes :wave:
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Tonight I cut out the rest of the pieces for the crankshaft. I need to make the drive roller. Then I can silver solder all the pieces together.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Crankshaft002.jpg)
Wes :wave:
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Nice work Wes, glad you're back on this project :thumbup:
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Thanks Nick.
Tonight I made a little crank holder. I need to hold things straight while I silver solder the pieces of the crank together. We don't want a wonky crank. LOL
I also cut out a couple of little blocks of wood that will be the bearings for the crank shaft. I'll get a couple pictures when I get them a little farther along. No one wants to look at pictures of little blocks of wood do they? Well, some here might. :lol: :lol: :lol:
I'm glad to be back on this one also :wave:
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Spent the night in relaxing with my lovely wife. I did get to the hardware store after work. I found these little wood screws that had a 8-32 bolt on the opposite end. They will hold the main bearing caps on. So tonight, pictures of little blocks of wood.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Bearingblocks001.jpg)
Later, Wes :wave:
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Today I about got the rollers made. I still have to drill and tap them for setscrews. I'm going to try and get the crank silver soldered together tomorrow. I can get better pictures when I get things mounted to the pressure box.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Drivewheels001.jpg)
Wes :wave:
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Grrrrr I seemed to have misplaced my silver solder...... :bang: :bang: :bang:
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Grrrrr I seemed to have misplaced my silver solder...... :bang: :bang: :bang:
Got any old coins? http://www.oldengine.org/members/christison/resources/allen.htm
Andy
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Thanks for that link Andy. It might be fun to try some time. But for now I went and bought some silver solder on Monday. I decided to finish the bits for my hand crank so I can solder it while things are warmed up. Stay tuned...
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That's a tough question. A quick count and there are really close to 250 parts in the 20 whistles. About 11 per whistle. I think the 3 bass notes have some extras by the time they are finished. 20 tubes to supply air to the whistle. A brass fitting at each end = 40 more pieces. There are parts that are are assemblies. Like the crank handle will be made out of about 6 pieces when I'm done. The crank shaft is 7 or so parts. I haven't started the billows. They have valves in each one. There are 3 of them. 2 for pumping air into the third one that is a spring loaded reservoir, that supplies air to the pressure box, it has a inlet valve and a valve so the system doesn't get too much pressure. We don't want the billows blowing their sides out. There will need to be rolls made to store the music on. A take up roll for the music to go to right after it has been played. I'm going to guess 400 parts. Plus or minus a few :smart: Nothing complicated by any means. Just a lot of parts.
The music that can be bought is a little expensive for me. My wife said that she wanted to make some of our own music. I have a book coming on how to translate sheet music into paper rolls. A little roll punch will need to be made. I found one that would be easy to make and operate. It would be boring I think? Kind of like knitting. Hundreds of little holes. The same thing over and over.
I've been wanting to make this for a few years. The main thing that has stopped me is I don't know Jack about music. I can't read one note. I kept telling myself " How can you build a musical instrument, and not know anything about music" I still have my doubts whether the darn thing will work or not. We'll see.
Thanks for watching, Wes :wave:
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I started to solder stuff together today. It started good and ended bad.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Handcrank003.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Handcrank004.jpg)
Looks like I need some more practice. Good thing I machined a couple extra crank arms while I was up to it.
Wes:o(
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Been there, done that :( :( :doh:
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Second time was a go\o/
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Handcrank005.jpg)
Now I need to drill a hole in the bushing and cross drill it for a setscrew.
Wes :wave:
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I wanted to get some more accomplished today. I made a wood spinney thing to go on the end of my crank handle. I like the proportions of handles on older machines. That's where The design came from. This fits my hand very nice!!!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/Powderkeg3418/Hand%20cranked%20organ/Handcrank006.jpg)
I still need to clean some more solder off the arm. But It's getting closer. I can almost hear the music :zap:
Wes :wave:
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It is looking good....
Did you build the bellows and reservoir yet?
I just finished Building the same or similar organ. I built the "senior"
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I have just read throught this thread and it is a treat!!!!
You are doing a great job and the fact that you have been thinking about it for years is nice to know.
Maybe there is hope for all those plans we have.
Thanks for sharing this with us
Rich
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how-to-make-tune-and-voice-reedpipes (http://www.lulu.com/product/download/how-to-make-tune-and-voice-reedpipes/6284040)
Will also put it in the resource list
Download is $4.95 or you can get it as a print on demand type book mailed to you. For $13.95
Did you download this? If so was it any good?
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No I haven't downloaded it as of yet, but it is considered one of the better works on the subject.
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Thanks for the reply.
I worry about such a complex subject translated from one language to another. If the translator is not very knowledgeable on the subject that things can get twisted or left out.
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Power keg what's up with this build. I am new here and have found this site while searching for information on this same organ. I read through the posts and find that you have yet to make music with this build. I know life can come up on us and take our time but maybe you can give us an update on how this project is going. :poke: :poke: :poke: :update:
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Powder Keg, I last posted on this in Feb this year wondering where you were on this build. You're work thus far has been clearly impressive. I too am building a busker organ myself and would enjoy having someone else to build with. I am along in the build having made the pipes, pressure box, bellows, trackerbar, and many other pieces. I am right now figureing out the drive system at this point. I have a drive shaft but it is clearly not up to your standards by any means. I will at some time make another one and instead of welding will thread it and I can clearly make that much better looking. I did have some setbacks with building somethings as I did not follow the plans to the letter. I too have had to improvise my building. So I now have a fairly modified organ. I hope that I have this playing music by Christmas but that is if I can keep making progress with it. I am right now making the clutch system. This has been a fun build and I can't wait to have that grin on my face when I can hear this thing play. I hope you haven't gotten board with the build and shelved it. If so I would hope that you pick it up and continue on. Your far enough along I would consider you past the hump and on the final leg to compleation. Hope you get back to us on your progress. :thumbup:
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It has been shelved. But not for long. Work and life in general get in my way more than anything. I was looking at a couple parts a few days ago. I plan on getting it all out very soon. I have some neat plans I think:o) Thanks for the compliments:o)
~Wes~