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Gallery, Projects and General => Project Logs => Topic started by: spuddevans on May 22, 2009, 02:32:55 PM

Title: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 22, 2009, 02:32:55 PM
So I decided to make a start on my X2 mini mill belt-drive conversion. I'm using the popular plans available on the Yahoo mini-mill group, but I'm not sticking rigidly to them.

I plan to make the base and motor bracket out of some 4" wide, 0.5" thick ali.

I started today by taking some 3" ali bar and hacksawing off a 50mm chunk.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/543089336_uZFnF-XL-1.jpg)

Boy were my arms tired, took me about 15mins, I really need to get a bandsaw.

I then chucked it in my 4jaw. This presented me with a potential problem, probably all you experienced machinests knew this already, but when I hacksawed the chunk off and checked both cut ends with a square, and of course the ends were not square. Now normally with smaller chunks of metal I would mount it in the chuck and when tightening up the jaws will get the part squared up parellel to the ways. But with this size of part I am using the jaws reversed and they dont have as much gripping depth and when I chucked it up it did not tighten up into square and parallel.  :scratch:

So this was my crude solution,
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/543088329_uzf5N-XL-1.jpg)

2 squares, one mounted on a 3-2-1 block on the ways, and one on the part, adjust it square, rotate 90 degrees and repeat, then re-check on all angles and then finally tighten up, face one side and then I was able to reverse the part and hold it tight up against the jaws, mount the dti and get the part centralised, and then face the other end.


Then it was just straight turning to reduce it down to start forming the Big Pulley as per plans.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/543089423_G7gRb-XL-1.jpg)


It's amazing just how much swarf you can make with this, I got a big boxfull from just this operation.

Next I will be boring out the bore  :lol: and then reversing the part and turning the pulley-shaped-sections, and then on to the smaller pulley for the motor.

One thing I do need help to find is a supplier of the 1/4" V-belts themselves, I've had a bit of a look online with no success, but maybe it'd be better going into a local belts & bearings supplier and getting one there. 


Anyway, that's all I got for today.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Brass_Machine on May 22, 2009, 02:38:52 PM
Quote
...

One thing I do need help to find is a supplier of the 1/4" V-belts themselves, I've had a bit of a look online with no success, but maybe it'd be better going into a local belts & bearings supplier and getting one there. 

...


If you don't have any luck, let me know. Mcmaster carr is 10 min from me. I can get em and ship them to you.

Eric
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Darren on May 22, 2009, 02:42:32 PM
My local motor factors in the UK seem to stock every size I have ever asked for over the years. They are stored by type and length there unlike Halfords which you need to specify which car you want it for.

Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Bernd on May 22, 2009, 04:14:05 PM
So this was my crude solution,
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/543088329_uzf5N-XL-1.jpg)

Tim


Tim,

Nothing crude about the way you solve a problem. Most ingenious way to do it.

Good luck with the rest of the project.

Bernd

Edited to add: Now that I've studied the pics a bit more I see that it really won't matter if it wasn't perfectly square since you will be turning the surface down quite a bit.
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: CrewCab on May 22, 2009, 04:21:51 PM
Nice start Tim  :thumbup:

The belt for my conversion is a Gates Truflex 0130 (interchanges with a 2L130), don't know if yours will use the the same.  The size is 1/4" x 13" (6mm x 330mm) though I found it hard to source them here, in the States they are readily available so Brass Machine shipped me some over.

Looking forward to following your build.

CC
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on May 22, 2009, 04:22:30 PM
Tim, great start - excellent photo`s, please keep them coming. I am really keen to see all the stages to make this project so keep the pictures flowing if you can bothered to keep taking them. I`m really interested to see how you actually cut the pully sections, tooling used and such.

Regarding belts - I will eventually need some, be it in 5 months or 18months and therefore for the price, if you find a supplier or decide to get some shipped over I`d be happy to order a few + spares and split postage and import costs.

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: CrewCab on May 22, 2009, 04:33:28 PM
LIMCT (http://shop.limct.com/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=1078&category_id=6834dda8e3e6e5aa18bafc63a57fd04a&) in the States sells the 0130 Belt as "cheap as chips" ................ (about 1.50), but their carriage costs to the UK were unreal  :bang: ................. however .............  having a few members over there that needn't be a problem.

CC
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on May 22, 2009, 05:01:19 PM
Have any of you considered using Redthane belting, just buy yourself a length and cut and weld it to fit. No more searching to find a specialist stockist of your v-belts.

I find it much better than normal V belts and it lasts considerably longer. Machines run a lot quieter with less vibration, and in bad circumstances can have enough 'give' in it to prevent damage to the machine, and of course, during it's life, because it is always in tension, no belt tension adjustment is needed.

http://www.poly-products.co.uk/beltext.htm

It comes in a variety of sizes and you can usually buy it by the metre from local engineering suppliers. I will be upgrading my lathe belts soon, and that will allow me to switch pulleys without having to make a complicated tensioning device. Just stretch it off one pulley and onto the next.

John

Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 22, 2009, 05:12:37 PM
If you don't have any luck, let me know. Mcmaster carr is 10 min from me. I can get em and ship them to you.
Eric

Thanks Eric, if I cant source any here I might just take you up on that  :thumbup: :thumbup:

My local motor factors in the UK seem to stock every size I have ever asked for over the years. They are stored by type and length there unlike Halfords which you need to specify which car you want it for.

I'll give that a try Darren, I think there's a place near me that specialises in just belts and bearings so I'll try there and then some motor factors.

Now that I've studied the pics a bit more I see that it really won't matter if it wasn't perfectly square since you will be turning the surface down quite a bit.

I know that I've cut away a lot on one end of the ali bar, but the plans call for a pulley of a little over 3", and this is a 3" bar so I didnt want to loose any more than absolutely nessesary as I will already be making a slightly smaller pulley than the plans call for. Thus the extra effort to make sure everything was properly square and true.

Nice start Tim

Thanks CC

Quote
don't know if yours will use the the same.

Yup, it's the same, although as I'm making the major-diameter pulley a little smaller than the plans call for I might get both a 13" and a 12" or 12.5" as well to be covered.

Tim, great start - excellent photo`s, please keep them coming. I am really keen to see all the stages to make this project so keep the pictures flowing if you can bothered to keep taking them. I`m really interested to see how you actually cut the pully sections, tooling used and such.

Regarding belts - I will eventually need some, be it in 5 months or 18months and therefore for the price, if you find a supplier or decide to get some shipped over I`d be happy to order a few + spares and split postage and import costs.

Chris

Thanks Chris, I'll keep on taking pics, even of the really mundane stuff  :coffee: I'm intending to cut the pulley sections with my parting tool, I figure on turning down the center flat sections of both pulleys and then angling the compound over and cutting the V sides. If anyones got any other ways of doing it I'm all ears.

Re the belts, PM recieved and replied to.

Have any of you considered using Redthane belting, just buy yourself a length and cut and weld it to fit. No more searching to find a specialist stockist of your v-belts.

I find it much better than normal V belts and it lasts considerably longer. Machines run a lot quieter with less vibration, and in bad circumstances can have enough 'give' in it to prevent damage to the machine, and of course, during it's life, because it is always in tension, no belt tension adjustment is needed.

That looks very interesting, is it easy to weld? Does it need a different pulley groove from a V-belt?

Hmmm  :smart: :coffee: I'll have to look into sourcing some of that around here or online.


Thanks everybody for looking and commenting.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Darren on May 22, 2009, 08:32:49 PM
I need a new belt on my mill, the inner is starting to come away and no doubt causing some vibration.

Would you recommend that type of belting for such a machine John?
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: TFL45 on May 22, 2009, 09:10:49 PM
Great pics as usual, Tim.  :thumbup:

Here's another belt option, although I haven't tried it myself.  Appears to only come in 1/2" size, so might not be suitable for your application, but others might have use for it. One source in Canada is Lee Valley  ( http://www.leevalley.com/home.aspx ) but must be other vendors.

Floyd
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on May 22, 2009, 11:59:27 PM
As I said Darren, I have used it in industry, and now I am about to fit it to my lathe.

Floyd has also shown the link belting, which again is very good.

It is fairly expensive, but in my mind, well worth it.

I always used to keep a few metres in my shop (when it came to me as freebies), but I only have short lengths left now, after modifying all my previous machines (and other peoples) with it.

If you can wait a while, when I get what is required for mine, I will do a little write up on how easy it is to get a strong welded joint that should last the lifetime of the belt.


John
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 24, 2009, 02:33:13 PM
Ok, do you ever have one of those days that everything seems to go not-so-good, and takes 3 times as long? Well I've just had one of those days.

I started out by center-drilling the bore.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/544646851_DYT5u-XL.jpg)


I then drilled it with a 1/4" drill, then 3/8" and then 1/2" ( the biggest drill I have, I really must some bigger drills as it's a lot quicker to bore with a drill than to bore with a boring bar ) and then set up with a boring bar with enough sticking out to reach through to the other side of the Pulley blank.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/544648076_wfWrh-XL.jpg)


Then things stopped going smoothly. I had bored out the bore until it was 1mm under-size, and decided to try my hand at cutting the key-way. Not having done this kind of thing before I ground up a Hss blank to be the right size for the key. I ground a shallow angle kinda like a woodchisel (and this may well be the error of my ways).

When trying to cut the keyway I found that the pressure would rotate the QC-toolpost, digging the tool in harder and causing progress to stop. So I thought that I could perhaps dig out most of the keyway-waste-material on the mill with a 6mm (the smallest cutter I have) mill.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/544646505_Hper6-XL.jpg)

But I still had the same problem of the tool digging in and rotating the toolpost holder. I tried to tighten the toolpost holder up but only succeeded in breaking off the handle on the toolpost  :doh: :bang:

So in frustration (and not thinking that it would be better to just pause and perhaps take a break ) I decided to make 3 cuts using a hacksaw (now now, I may be a bit daft, but I can still hear your laughing  :lol: ) to get rid of most of the waste.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/544646607_GLhiF-XL.jpg)


It was at this point I decided to leave that particular part of this project as if I kept at it much more I might have had to retrieve the pulley from next door's back yard. Thinking about it now, if I cant get to grips with cutting the key-way on the lathe I might do as someone has suggested in the plans, and use the spacer-collar already fitted to the mill and just bore out the pulley to be a good press fit with some loctite.


Finally some sense raised its head ( I dunno where it was prior to this  :scratch: ) and I decided to remount the pulley the other way round in the 4jaw, center it, and then turned the OD's of the 2 pulley sections.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/544646682_tyHw7-XL.jpg)


I then tried to set my compound to make the cuts for the inner sides of the V parts of the pulleys, and came across a flaw in my lathe. My C2 has those nifty little DRO's incorporated into the compound and cross slides, these sit a little proud and prevent you from setting the compound to any angle greater than 45degrees, and as the plans call for 71Degrees ( total of 38 degrees from edge to edge of the V, so splitting that gives me 19 degrees of 90, if you follow what I mean, but please correct me if I'm wrong)

So without modifying the lathe I think I'll have to grind up a Hss toolblank to 19 degrees to form the tapered V, unless any one of you experienced machinests can give me a better way of doing this?


So that's as far as I got today, now I'm (virtually) off to find out what I can about cutting key-ways. Nothing like bolting the door after the horse has locked  :scratch: errm, or something like that  :lol:



Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Darren on May 24, 2009, 02:41:29 PM
Hi Tim,

I did something similar here, not sure it's going to help you much though.

It sounds like you need your tool post to be tightened down a bit more?

http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=460.msg1410#msg1410
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 24, 2009, 02:58:46 PM
Hi Tim,

I did something similar here, not sure it's going to help you much though.

It sounds like you need your tool post to be tightened down a bit more?

http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=460.msg1410#msg1410

Actually that helps a bit, just seeing what your toolbit is shaped like, that might be where I was going wrong. I may try again with a re-ground hss bit.

Thanks for that link.

If anyone else has a diagram of how to grind the proper tip for cutting an internal keyway please feel free to share it, I really could use all the guidence available on this.

Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on May 24, 2009, 03:31:26 PM
Tim

Your doing the right thing in cutting out some of the meat, to take some of the load off your small lathe, Try shaping the key out in small sections and you can always finish it off with a file, noting wrong in that its what our Grandfathers would have done.

Good Luck

Stew
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on May 24, 2009, 03:41:21 PM
Hey Tim, as I said, I`m one step behind you, I wouldn`t know how to start without your post.

It is really interesting as I showed the plans to my mate earlier this evening who does machining on a much bigger scale and he was immediately drawn and curious as to how the key way was cut. Following darrens linked post to his "one off key groove" - I can see how he has turned the parting tool on its side but I don`t understand how the groove is being cut? I take it the work piece is not rotating the in the jaws, but if it isn`t, how is the tool cutting?

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: John Stevenson on May 24, 2009, 03:52:22 PM
You rack it backwards and forwards with the carriage, a bit of a poor mans shaper.

JS.
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 24, 2009, 03:52:45 PM
Hey Tim, as I said, I`m one step behind you, I wouldn`t know how to start without your post.

It is really interesting as I showed the plans to my mate earlier this evening who does machining on a much bigger scale and he was immediately drawn and curious as to how the key way was cut. Following darrens linked post to his "one off key groove" - I can see how he has turned the parting tool on its side but I don`t understand how the groove is being cut? I take it the work piece is not rotating the in the jaws, but if it isn`t, how is the tool cutting?

Chris

The lathe is stationary, the groove is (supposed) to be cut by the tool taking a tiny cut each pass. You know if you have a tool in the lathe and even when stationary you wind it past the workpiece it can leave a tiny groove if the tool's too close? It's the same principle with cutting a keyway.

I'll have another try tomorrow and take some pics of my efforts.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on May 24, 2009, 04:01:25 PM
Ohh, I see. So you are simply scraping metal off. Interesting.
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on May 24, 2009, 07:01:43 PM
Hope you don`t mind me posting a pic, not trying to hijack your thread  :whip:

I`ve just bored the piece to size, and taken down the diameter to form the pully section and I suppose the shaft area. Don`t know where to go from here.... pully sections? I couldn`t have done it without your pics and your post....I really appreciate it, cheers

(http://www.raynerd.co.uk/wp-content/upLoads/beltconv.jpg)

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 25, 2009, 04:04:02 AM
Hope you don`t mind me posting a pic, not trying to hijack your thread  :whip:
Feel free to add whatever you want, or even start a build thread yourself  :thumbup:

Quote
I`ve just bored the piece to size, and taken down the diameter to form the pully section and I suppose the shaft area. Don`t know where to go from here.... pully sections?

The next step that I did was to get the outer sections of the two V pulleys to size. Then there's the dreaded key-way (or is it key-set?) and the shaping of the inside of the V sections.

Those are my next steps.

Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 25, 2009, 01:19:39 PM
So I started today by working on the keyway (ok people, start your screaming  :lol:) I re-ground the Hss bit to be more the profile of a parting tool on it's side. This worked a bit better than previously but I found a bit more success with using a file gripped in the QC toolpost
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/545508922_XLBM9-XL.jpg)

To make things a bit easier, I released the saddle so it would slide by hand rather than by winding the handle back and forth, and then just pushed the saddle to and fro while advancing the cross-slide by about 0.10-0.25mm each time.


I then turned to the V parts of the pulley, as mentioned before I couldn't set my  compound to the required angle, I decided to grind up a form tool, and here it is.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/545508432_Gj9gh-S.jpg) (http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/545508520_m9fdS-S.jpg) (http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/545508596_fa7Nm-S.jpg)


After grinding the bit up I found out that I had accidently ground it up to the exact size needed for the V-belt.  :headbang: ( I had thought that I would plunge it in and then move the bit sideways to get the size needed)  The only thing I would do different if I did again would be to use a 5/16" Hss tool blank instead of a 3/8" as it was a bit tight cutting the 2nd (the smaller one). I used the larger size of toolbit to try to reduce chatter.

So I very gently and slowly inched (or should that be millimetered  :scratch: ) the tool into the workpiece. I started off in the higher gear but the chatter kept kicking in the safety overload detector thingy in the C2 and it kept cutting the power, so I used the lower gear. The tool produced a lot of fine shavings.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/545509005_QDhns-XL.jpg)


And after that I repositioned and did the same again and ended up with this,
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/545508721_SdJmn-X2.jpg)

(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/545508837_CpkcB-X2.jpg)


And that's as far as I got today, next I gotta start on the smaller pulley.

I may have to deepen the keyway a bit as well.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on May 25, 2009, 05:11:59 PM
Well done that man.

 :clap: :clap: :clap:

Nothing wrong with methods that work   :thumbup:

Cheers

Stew
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Darren on May 25, 2009, 05:28:25 PM
That's a neat idea with the file...looking good there Tim  :clap:
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: websterz on May 25, 2009, 08:57:02 PM
Very nicely done!! I will "file" away that keyway tip for future reference.  :thumbup:
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Stilldrillin on May 26, 2009, 02:12:48 AM
When trying to cut the keyway I found that the pressure would rotate the QC-toolpost, digging the tool in harder and causing progress to stop.
But I still had the same problem of the tool digging in and rotating the toolpost holder. I tried to tighten the toolpost holder up but only succeeded in breaking off the handle on the toolpost  :doh: :bang:

Very nicely done Tim!

If it works...... It`s ok.....   :clap:

Thought you might like to see my little mod to allow the toolpost to rotate, only when I want it to.....  :thumbup:

A small piece of 1/8" plate, held with a 6mm caphead.

(http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n95/Dayjo/p5250004.jpg)


Locked.

(http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n95/Dayjo/p5250005-1.jpg)


Unlocked.

(http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n95/Dayjo/p5250006.jpg)

Works very well.....  :thumbup:

David D
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on May 26, 2009, 02:16:11 AM
Nice neat mod there David I like it.  :thumbup:

Stew
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 26, 2009, 05:50:46 AM
Thought you might like to see my little mod to allow the toolpost to rotate, only when I want it to.....  :thumbup:

A small piece of 1/8" plate, held with a 6mm caphead.

Thats neat, but what stops clockwise (as you look down on the toolpost) rotation?


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on May 26, 2009, 06:18:12 AM
If you have a look at your topslide with the toolpost off, there is usually a hole drilled into the top.

If you can make a matching hole in the bottom of your toolpost, it is just a matter of making a slug to drop into the hole and put the toolpost onto it. This will effectively lock up your toolpost and prevent it turning. Just take the slug out and you can then set your toolpost to angles again.


John

Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 26, 2009, 07:44:08 AM
If you have a look at your topslide with the toolpost off, there is usually a hole drilled into the top.
If you can make a matching hole in the bottom of your toolpost, it is just a matter of making a slug to drop into the hole and put the toolpost onto it. This will effectively lock up your toolpost and prevent it turning. Just take the slug out and you can then set your toolpost to angles again.
That's a handy tip, I think I'll use that one, thanks John  :thumbup:


I got a little time this morning to install the spindle locking slot into the Pulley I just made. I probably should've milled the slot before turning the V sections, but you live and learn.

This is how I clamped it up using a V-block, some spare round bar that was a bit smaller than the bore, and the clamping kit for my mill. I double checked that the bar was not unevenly pulling the pulley off square and plumb, and then tweaked it tighter.

(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/546463046_MsRBF-XL.jpg)

another angle
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/546463090_hJc8w-XL.jpg)


and then just milled it out with a 6mm mill, and then widened the slot to 8mm. It was pretty rock solid, but even though, I took my time and did not plunge through the 8mm or so thickness in one pass, I think I took off about 1-1.5mm per pass of the middle, and then to widen out the slot I had the mill at full depth and took 1mm off each side in 3 passes (that is 3 passes of 0.33mm not 3 1mm passes  :lol:)
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/546462989_aPz23-XL.jpg)


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Stilldrillin on May 26, 2009, 08:16:20 AM
Thought you might like to see my little mod to allow the toolpost to rotate, only when I want it to.....  :thumbup:

A small piece of 1/8" plate, held with a 6mm caphead.

Thats neat, but what stops clockwise (as you look down on the toolpost) rotation?

Tim

Tim,

There`s a spring loaded rachet/ plunger in the topslide, which only allows it to be rotated anti clockwise.....

It`s probably in the hole which John`s used for his locating pin!

David D
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 26, 2009, 12:59:43 PM
There`s a spring loaded rachet/ plunger in the topslide, which only allows it to be rotated anti clockwise.....

It`s probably in the hole which John`s used for his locating pin!

Ah yes, I remember taking that spring loaded pin out, I found it irritating having to spin it 360degrees  just to turn it a little amount clockwise  :bang:


I got a little more done this afternoon, I chucked up a chunk of 50mm ali round bar, turned a 15mm spigot 4mm long on one end. then I reversed it in the 4jaws and turned it down to 1.7" as per the plans for the larger section of the small pulley for the motor.

I also ground up a 5/16" hss toolbit to form the 32degree V-section as per the plans.

I then formed the 1st section of the V pulley
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/546663028_ejoEt-XL.jpg)


And that's all for today folks,


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on May 26, 2009, 03:17:18 PM
You know the large pully - what is the m6 set screw for, does it go through key-way and if it is to lock it to the spindle - how will you get through it to tighten it with the base plate in the way? Sorry for my ignorance - it has just been confusing me.

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 26, 2009, 03:50:11 PM
You know the large pully - what is the m6 set screw for, does it go through key-way and if it is to lock it to the spindle - how will you get through it to tighten it with the base plate in the way? Sorry for my ignorance - it has just been confusing me.

Chris

I think it is an additional fixing method, I dont know why its there as the locking ring will hold the pulley on the spindle, and the keyway will lock the pulley from being able to freely rotate. If you do install one, if you position it on the same plane as the spindle-locking-slot-hole you should be able to tighten the set-screw through the spindle lock hole in the baseplate.


Hope that makes some sense.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on May 26, 2009, 04:49:21 PM
Yes - perfect sense and thanks for your suggestion. Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on May 26, 2009, 05:35:18 PM
Normally when a grub screw is used and it locks against the key, it serves two purposes.

The first is to stop the key moving along and back and side to side in it's slot, thus preventing wear on either the key or the slot.

The second reason is if the slot in the pulley is not as tight as it should be, it creates a mechanical lock that prevents the pulley rotating slightly around the shaft and key. Again this is to prevent excess wear.

If you don't understand the mechanics of the reason to put it in there, it is always better to put it in anyway.

It is called 'belt and braces' or 'just in case' engineering.


John
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on May 27, 2009, 02:09:30 AM
it serves two purposes. ......   to stop the key moving along and back and side to side in it's slot, thus preventing wear on either the key or the slot.
...... if the slot in the pulley is not as tight as it should be, it creates a mechanical lock that prevents the pulley rotating slightly around the shaft and key. Again this is to prevent excess wear.

Thanks John for explaining that, it makes sense now I understand that. The original spacer on the X2 is made out of steel and does not have a grub screw, I guess because it is a very tight, close fit to the spindle and key, and because of it being steel it would not wear so quickly. (and it would cost extra to have one  :lol:) In the belt conversion we will be removing the original steel spacer and replacing it with our newly made large pulley made out of Ali', and hence the need for a grub screw as John said to fix firmly the key in the slot (which, let's face it, on my pulley is not quite made to the same tolerence as the original spacer's slot)

Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on May 27, 2009, 02:37:29 AM
I see, I see

Quote
which, let's face it, on my pulley is not quite made to the same tolerence as the original spacer's slot


...and that will apply to me two fold!  :doh:

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 02, 2009, 02:11:18 PM
So, After being away to london at the weekend, I managed to get back into the workshop. I left you all on the edges of your collective seats (  :lol: ) as I was part-way through making the small pulley. Well before I went away I managed to get the pulley finished, and got a start made on the base. I didnt get any pics as the camera was already packed for traveling.  :( I did use my boring bar in my mill for the first time which went ok. I bored out the hole in the base for the large pulley to fit through. I stepped up from 1/4" through to 1/2" drills, and then switched to using the boring bar, I took cuts of about 1.5mm per pass (total enlargement of hole per pass - 3mm).

After boring out the main pulley hole, the 4 fixing screw holes including clearance, voila
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/552985167_XJpkc-XL.jpg)


I then cut a little off one side to bring down the width to 3.4"(ish) from the 4" original size except from a little "ear" at the back to attach one of the spacers to. I then cut off a chunk of 1" square ali bar, and then milled down a section to make it fit and give the required clearance.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/552985317_DcsLG-L.jpg)


And this is where it will fit
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/552984761_7cbhj-XL.jpg)


While the vice was set up and the depth was still locked in I milled a small (2mm) rebate in the other spacer block so that it too will fit properly.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/552984858_ze5Vv-XL.jpg)


I then drilled and tapped and bored clearance holes in all the right places to attach the 2 "ears", and then attached said "ears"
Bottom view:
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/552985093_Z3P4E-L.jpg)

Top view:
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/552984931_GEFhd-L.jpg)


And that is as far as I got today. Next will be the motor mount and also drilling and tapping the top of the "ears" and then clean the whole lot up, getting rid of all my marking (and re-marking) out.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on June 02, 2009, 03:05:52 PM
Excellent job Tim. I like the "ear" idea, I don`t have any ally in stock large enough to include the sides all in one, so I may well use this idea. Thanks for the update. Keep us posted.

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on June 02, 2009, 03:47:41 PM
Coming along nicely Tim  :clap:

Stew
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 03, 2009, 12:46:22 PM
Thanks guys  :thumbup:

I got some time in the workshop today and got started on the motor mount. I hacked off some more of the 4" x 1/2" ali flat plate and then milled both cut ends smooth. Then on went some marking out dye (big black marker  :lol: ) and then I marked it out.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/553836973_RFJ5Z-XL.jpg)


Then I mounted it onto the mill with a sacrificial plate underneath and center drilled and then drilled through the 4 motor mounting holes, a pivot hole (drilled larger to accept a brass bush) and then a hole for enlarging for the motor pulley.

Then I dug out the faceplate, stuck it on the lathe and set about centering the motor mount. Then I removed the motor-mount and hacked off 2 corners to enable the motor-mount to turn without hitting the ways. :doh: (the curse of the small lathe).  I got the motor-mount roughly centered by mounting a drill the same size as the hole, into the tailstock, and using that to center it. After roughly centering and hand tightening the hold-downs, I removed the drill and mounted a Dti to get it accurately centered, then I tightened the bolts up fully and started to make the cut.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/553837077_camXv-XL.jpg)


The boring completed.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/553837152_VzeXZ-L.jpg)



Next step will be to mill out the curved slot on the motor mount, then make a brass bush, and then drill and tap the "ears".


That's it for today,


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: SPiN Racing on June 03, 2009, 01:56:17 PM
Coming along Nice Tim!
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 05, 2009, 02:16:12 PM
Ok, I got a little more done today. I started out by making a brass bush for the pivot pin on the lathe and boring the centre 6mm
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/555414094_334Se-L.jpg)


And then pressed the bush into the motor-mount plate

I then drilled and tapped the 2 "ears" M6 and turned my attention to the curved slot. I knew that my tapped holes in the "ears" were not the same distance apart as the plans called for ( about 2.5mm narrower ) and wanting to make sure the slot was the right curvature and the right distance from the pivot I came up with a solution. Just mark out the underneath of the motor-mount with a black marker, then screw a M6 grub screw in the hole with the pointy end up, attach the motor-mount with a long M6 screw through the brass pivot pin and scrape a curved line.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/555414176_xqZR5-L.jpg)


I then clamped the belt-drive base to the mill, mounted the motor-mount onto the base (upside down so I could see the newly scribed line) and chain drilled the bulk of the slot out.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/555413683_rTVGq-XL.jpg)


To clean up the slot I used a 6mm slotting mill in the same setup, but for this operation I removed my hands from anywhere near the cutter. I used a long F-wrench clamped onto the motor-mount to rotate the workpiece, taking very shallow cuts until the slot was made smooth. I also kept the pivot screw fairly tight but there was still a bit of vibration, esp' if I tried to take off too deep a cut. It may take longer, but many many shallow cuts felt safer than trying to do it in 2-3 passes.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/555413855_qe3ep-L.jpg)

(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/555413995_5zU2g-L.jpg)


Next I have to mill away some of the underneath of the motor-mount to reduce part of it from 1/2" to the 3/8" thickness called for in the plans, then I have to drill and tap the 2 pulleys for set-screws, check if the key-ways are deep/wide enough, make a spring loaded spindle locking pin, and then just try it all out when the belt arrives.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on June 05, 2009, 03:58:30 PM
Well that was a nice bit of improvisation Tim, looked as though it worked well  :thumbup:

  :nrocks:  :mmr:

Stew
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: CrewCab on June 05, 2009, 05:33:55 PM
Nice work Tim, and great write up  :thumbup:

CC
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on June 05, 2009, 06:38:50 PM
Nice job Tim. Your running ahead of me now, I`ve got  :proj: and keep working on my first engine build - I`m sure I`ll be inspired again once my belts arrived. How hard have the plates been in comparison with the pullys in terms of time taken, effort and thought. I thought I had it made once I`d done the pully but now looking at the motor plates, I think they look pretty tricky as well!
You have done an excellent job of adding the wings or ears, would it have been quite a bit easier if you had have had the full size material?

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: kvom on June 05, 2009, 09:51:16 PM
FWIW, it's generally a bad idea to hold an endmill in a drill chuck.  Seems to have worked this time.  Nice job.
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 06, 2009, 04:30:18 AM
Thanks Stew & CC  :thumbup:

How hard have the plates been in comparison with the pullys in terms of time taken, effort and thought.

Not that hard actually, they've taken less time in actual machining, but more time in setting up and marking out and thinking how to machine them.

 
Quote
You have done an excellent job of adding the wings or ears, would it have been quite a bit easier if you had have had the full size material?

It would've been neater looking, and possibly a bit easier, but it would've meant a lot of cutting (and I only have my right arm as a power hacksaw :lol: ) plus you still have to make the spacers, so why not use slightly bigger spacers and  bolt them on the side like I did?

FWIW, it's generally a bad idea to hold an endmill in a drill chuck.  Seems to have worked this time.  Nice job.

Thanks Kvom, that's a good reminder not to be lazy about using the best tool ( a collet ) for the job, not making do with the easiest tool.  (the drill chuck that was still mounted from chain drilling)


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on June 06, 2009, 05:23:24 AM
Tim,

You are doing wonderful and innovative work on your making of the parts, and you are showing that you don't need a lot of gizmos to get the job done.

A lot of it is laziness and impatience on our part, and if we all did what you are doing, more of the basics of machining would be understood.

I think you have a good improvisation head on your shoulders, and you should let it keep leading the way.



Getting back to grass roots machining, great!!


John
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: CrewCab on June 06, 2009, 04:19:33 PM
A lot of it is laziness and impatience on our part,

Bogsie  :bugeye: ................. stop giving all the secrets away  :D :wack:

CC (http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b28/CrewCab53/Smileys/bunny.gif)
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 06, 2009, 04:52:23 PM
I think you have a good improvisation head on your shoulders

And it's getting bigger too :lol:

Thanks for the encouragement John, it means a lot to me :thumbup:

I did think about using a rotary table to mill out the curved slot, but the arc's radius is over 4.5" and I only have a little 4" diameter rotary table, I didn't think having roughly 2.5" sticking out unsupported would be too good, so I figured that using the belt-drive base could give me the needed support and provide me with the perfect matching radius I needed, and after figuring out how to remove my fingers from being close to the milling cutter I just gently milled it away.

I do find that I spend more time looking at the workpiece and the machines I have figuring out just how I can best achieve the results needed, than the actual time spent milling or turning it !!


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on June 06, 2009, 05:17:30 PM
I think you have a good improvisation head on your shoulders

I do find that I spend more time looking at the workpiece and the machines I have figuring out just how I can best achieve the results needed, than the actual time spent milling or turning it !!


Tim

I think thats very true for most people Tim:- I quite often find myselfe thinking about something I'm three or four weeks away from making. It sometimes gets me in trouble with the Boss, she'll be rabbiting on about something, I'll be lost on thought about making something, and then she'll say OK thats agreed then, what what was that    :bugeye: :wack: :zap:

 :lol: :lol: :lol:

Stew

Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on June 06, 2009, 05:25:17 PM
Dave,

If you look back at old mags and books, you would be surprised how easy a lot of the supposedly difficult jobs were got around.
It is only the last few years that specialist tooling like rotary tables and boring heads came within the modellers price range.
Before that, everything was done just as Tim is doing, and to me should be the way everyone should start off.
Get the basics under your belt, gizmos can come later to make the job a little easier.

I honestly think that is why the older generation of model engineers make things look easy. It isn't because they are any better machinists, but they have a greater understanding of the principles involved in making the part, and when they get to using modern techniques, using modern tooling, it looks just like they are using black magic to make the parts.

Modern machinists are getting a mental blockage, that assumes modern bits and bobs are needed to do the necessary procedures, whereas they should be thinking that they only assist in making the job easier to do. The last two hundred years or so of engineering have proved that the modern way of thinking is all wrong.

Just to reiterate, Tim is showing the ways how it used to be done, and good for him.

Now if we could get someone to show us how it was done before metal planers, milling machines or vertical slides came onto the scene ........... hacksaws and files (complete with aching arms and loads of sweat) spring to mind. Remember all those old piccies of rows upon rows of benches with chaps standing there filing away at hunks of metal. They were called fitters, because they were making parts so that they FITTED together correctly.

A hundred jobs (or even more) replaced by one CNC machining centre, turning out millions of parts that fit together perfectly. But can it make a one off, at short notice, from a fag packet sketch? I very much doubt it.

That is where we come in, but unless you have the basics, you will struggle.


Bogs
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Bernd on June 07, 2009, 09:10:35 AM
Bogs, truer words were never spoken like those above.  :bow:

Bernd
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 08, 2009, 12:05:53 PM
Today I started by milling down the middle of the underneath of the motor mount, to bring a bit more clearance for the belt.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/558106742_8spxQ-L.jpg)



I tried the large pulley on the spindle of my mill and found that the bore in the large pulley was ever-so-slightly too small, so I mounted the 4jaw and trued the pulley as best as I could and took off 0.22mm, checked it and it was ok. Then I filed the keyway a bit deeper, and then mounted it on the mill just as I did for milling the spindle-lock-slot and drilled and tapped M6 for the grubscrew.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/558107023_KCbP4-L.jpg)



I then mounted my vice onto the mill and set about drilling and tapping M4 the grubscrew on the small pulley.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/558107245_QP3t7-L.jpg)


And here are both pulleys (the smaller one is resting on the bottom of the larger one) showing the grub screws.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/558107486_5RHjy-L.jpg)


That's all for today,



Tim


Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on June 08, 2009, 02:05:12 PM
Nice job Tim - did you get your grub screws online, I need to find a supplier. I normally get my machine screws locally but one thing they don`t seem to sell for some reason is grub screws.

Your certainly not far off now!

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: CrewCab on June 08, 2009, 02:11:43 PM
Chris

Have a look Here (http://boltmeup.com/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=m4+grub)

CC
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on June 08, 2009, 03:15:49 PM
Thanks for the link CC - good price. I`ll get some ordered.
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 08, 2009, 03:59:27 PM
Nice job Tim - did you get your grub screws online, I need to find a supplier.

Have a look Here (http://boltmeup.com/index.php?main_page=advanced_search_result&search_in_description=1&keyword=m4+grub)

Would you believe it, that's the exact place I got my grub screws from  :thumbup:


CC beat me to it  :thumbup:


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: CrewCab on June 08, 2009, 04:05:13 PM
Chris,

Before you melt the plastic have a look at this link (http://shop.ebay.co.uk/merchant/aruncas?_nkw=grub&_sacat=0&_trksid=p3911.m270.l1313&_odkw=&_osacat=0)

I've dealt with each of them and in my experience they are both good people  :headbang:

CC
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 12, 2009, 12:32:01 PM
Not a lot done today, just hacked off a bit of round ali bar, chucked it in the 4jaw and turned down a section, drilled and tapped it M6.
(http://www.velvet-art.co.uk/photos/561743199_az4jU-L.jpg)


Then I turned it around and gripped it by the smaller diameter that I just turned down, faced the other end and then knurled the body. This is where it fits
(http://www.velvet-art.co.uk/photos/561743101_LUcu9-L.jpg)

I loctited a M6 stud into the "ear" for the Knurled knob to attach to. Then I just cleaned up the faces of the belt-drive componants.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 14, 2009, 04:46:59 AM
I got a bit more done yesterday, I started on a spring-loaded spindle lock.

I started by finding a suitable reclaimed spring that had an inner diameter that was the same as the width of the slot milled into the large pulley (about 8mm). I then rigged up the belt-drive base on an angle plate on the mill to drill it and found that I didnt have enough headroom on the z-axis to use a conventional drill-chuck  :bang: It then occurred to me to try the ER32 collet chuck as its a lot shorter than a drill chuck and there was just enough room if I held most of the drill in the chuck and only had about 40mm of the drill showing.
(http://www.velvet-art.co.uk/photos/563086591_J87B8-L.jpg)

(ps. this photo is a mock up of my setup as I had taken off the clamps before realising I hadnt taken a picture, that's why it's held with just one engineers clamp.)


So I drilled 9.5mm(the outer diameter of the spring plus a tiny bit for clearance) to 15mm depth, then swapped out for a 8mm bit and drilled through the final few mm.

Then I drilled and tapped 2 M5 holes either side of the locking pin hole.

Then it was back onto the lathe and I chucked up a short length of some unknown steel and turned it down to 7.5mm on one end, a small 9.4mm section and then turned the piece around and turned the other end down to 7.5mm. Then I rounded the ends over with files, and then sanded it smooth.
(http://www.velvet-art.co.uk/photos/563086624_Cs39Q-L.jpg)


Then I just took a small piece of 2mm thick ali, drilled 2 M5 clearance holes and a 8mm hole (which I also reamed 8mm as the drill left a slightly triangular hole) and mounted the whole lot onto the base.
(http://www.velvet-art.co.uk/photos/563086689_atZNT-M.jpg)

(http://www.velvet-art.co.uk/photos/563086498_GRjfU-M.jpg)

(http://www.velvet-art.co.uk/photos/563086744_a4tbQ-M.jpg)

Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Darren on June 14, 2009, 04:53:44 AM
Very nicely done, I wish I had a spindle lock on my mill.... :thumbup:
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 14, 2009, 10:03:00 AM
Very nicely done, I wish I had a spindle lock on my mill.... :thumbup:
Thanks Darren, I hope this will save trying to remember to remove the locking pin before starting the mill up  :bang:


Chris (craynerd) asked me if I could show some more details of the spindle lock so here's a couple more pics.

(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/563210768_5s5wh-L.jpg)

(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/563211000_RZPkw-L.jpg)

Notice the "ledge" in the hole that the spring compresses against
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/563211060_GpdKZ-L.jpg)

(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/563208749_zCSY3-L.jpg)


And here's a pic of all the mill belt-drive conversion parts minus the belt and mill
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/563211378_PfwJC-L.jpg)


And all the parts individually
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/563211760_jaPB7-L.jpg)


For larger resolution pics go to Linky (http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/gallery/7152982_cNL28#563086689_atZNT)


Hope this is what you wanted to see Chris, if you want to see any pics of anything else just ask and I'll do me best to post them.


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on June 14, 2009, 11:56:43 AM
Good Job Tim.
 :thumbup:

Well explained and shown the spring loaded lock is a great idea.

Cheers

Stew
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on June 15, 2009, 01:53:26 AM
Excellent pics Tim, really appreciate it. You know the knurled nob and the slot that it locks down onto on the motor mount? - is that to allow you to swing the motor mount back and change the tension on the belt? I noticed on hoffmachine plans, he just had a straight slot but I don`t understand how a straight slot will allow it to swing through the angle.

http://www.hossmachine.info/images/belt%20conversion%20motor%20plate.jpg
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 15, 2009, 02:11:43 AM
You know the knurled nob and the slot that it locks down onto on the motor mount? - is that to allow you to swing the motor mount back and change the tension on the belt?

That's right, it's for tensioning the belt. I cant say why hoffmachine's plans call for a straight slot, I dont see how that'd work unless you have 2 straight slots, one for each side of the motor mount.



Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 25, 2009, 06:01:09 PM
Ok, so no progress for a bit there, unfortunately real life caught up with me  :scratch:

But this morning the postie brought me some goodies, the mini V-belts from Chris. So being the impatient sort and having a couple of hours free, I started in to putting the whole belt-drive conversion kit together.

Here's the before pic
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573748285_LsuTE-M.jpg)


1st off I removed the motors wiring from the control box, (very easy to do as the motor is connected by insulated spade terminals inside the box) and then I removed the 4 hex screws holding the old motor mount on the mill head and lifted the motor off. (handy hint, before removing the old motor mount, use the locking pin to lock the spindle and, after loosening the grub screw, undo the splined-type spindle nut, it loosens the opposite way that you think) then undo the 4 philips screws shown below.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573748514_xq2YF-M.jpg)


Then I removed the 4 long philips screws that hold the plastic motor base on.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573748592_7SBuL-M.jpg)


Then I tried to attach my new motor mount using the same long screws, here I came accross a problem. I had drilled and counterbored the 4 mounting holes as per the plans, but now that I had my mill in bits I found that the screws were slightly larger than the screw-holes, and the screw-heads / washers were also bigger than the counterbores.
So a quick bodge/fix was called for. I gripped the motor mount in my bench vice and carefully opened out the holes with my hand drill, turned out ok.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573748728_c5qyf-M.jpg)


That being done I turned back to the mill and removed the steel spacer from the spindle and I also removed the white plastic gear that sits just behind the spindle ( looking from the front ), this left this little pest,
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573748828_YPAUK-M.jpg)


Well with a little persuasion from my friend the hammer, it soon popped out the underneath and I was able to mount the new base.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573748996_3uaKJ-M.jpg)


Then I mounted the large pulley onto the spindle. Here's a pic showing how I access the grub screw on the pulley.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573749115_VzkVz-M.jpg)


And this is why you need the grub screw, unless you have some kind of special tightening tool you have to make do with a couple of allen keys and tighten it the best you can.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573749333_34w43-M.jpg)


Turning back to the motor mount, the gear on the motor is retained by a circlip ..... and by a quite strong press fit. I did not want to wreck the gear while removing it so this is how I leavered it off.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573749542_FGAga-M.jpg)


Then I mounted the smaller pulley onto the motor and decided to try the motor in its place and... :doh:
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573749675_SLmdn-M.jpg)

and
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573749765_Gi7Lh-M.jpg)


 :bang: :doh: :bang: :doh: :bang: :bang: :doh: :bang: :doh:


So, after making a "Tim's forehead" shaped impression on the workbench for several moments, and then regaining semi-consciousness  :lol: I then removed the pulley (which is not as easy as installing it considering I had to hammer it on, I almost ruined it getting it off) and mounted the pulley in the 3jaw to remove about 4mm from the bottom.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573749864_vHsuG-M.jpg)


Then I Hammered mounted it back onto the spindle, just in case anyone's worried about me whaling on the pulley to mount it, I was careful;
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573757062_aNUv8-M.jpg)

Closer view
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573756741_4oCDs-M.jpg)


And this is how it all looks
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573757426_RDBCx-M.jpg)


I almost made a boo-boo with the size of knurled knob, almost too big. So if anyone else is making a similar conversion, make sure the knob is smaller than 30mm.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573756504_8gwki-M.jpg)


And ( finally ) the obligatory B.L.O. (bits left over) shot.
(http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/photos/573748048_UJzWS-M.jpg)


Larger versions of the pics can be found HERE (http://velvet-art.smugmug.com/gallery/7152982_cNL28/1/573748048_UJzWS)

Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on June 25, 2009, 11:08:18 PM
It has turned out very well Tim, well done.

But you have forgotten one thing.

You don't say if it works or not.

I assume because you have done such a good job, it does.

John
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: sbwhart on June 26, 2009, 12:48:46 AM
Well done that man.

 :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:


Great job well explained, thanks for showing Tim.

:D  :ddb:  :nrocks:

 :beer:

Stew
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 26, 2009, 01:17:43 AM
You don't say if it works or not.

Oops,  :doh: Yes, it works just fine. Soo much quieter and smoother.

I also forgot to mention that I also had to reverse the motor wiring (but not the earth, obviously) as now the motor needs to run in the opposite direction.

Edit: I've since realised that there is no need to reverse the motor's direction with this belt drive conversion




My next project is to tram the mill up as best as poss, and to allign the mill head with the z-axis (which it currently is not alligned that well).

So yet more piccies will be on their way.


Thanks for looking,

Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: bogstandard on June 26, 2009, 03:35:25 AM
Tim,

Maybe you should knock up one of these.

Tramming then becomes a joy rather than a PITA.

http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=822.0

or Stews smaller version

http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=1077.0


John
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Darren on June 26, 2009, 03:46:50 AM
Lovely tidy job there Tim.... :clap: :clap: :clap:

Bet you're pleased as Punch..... :thumbup:
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: raynerd on June 26, 2009, 08:35:57 AM
Nice job there Tim and thanks again for all the piccys! I can`t believe the belts got to you so fast, must only been 12 hours from sending to receiving!!  Cheers to Eric for sorting them out for us.

I`ve got the base plate sorted out now and I just have the motor plate to complete and then I`ll be able to try it out as well.

Great to see it up and running  - you have enthused me to try and get mine finished over the next few days however your, and now my Elmer #25 build is distracting me....lol I think I`m just copying you :)

Was the motor OK to rewire - is it obvious?

Chris
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 26, 2009, 08:57:30 AM
Tim,

Maybe you should knock up one of these.

Tramming then becomes a joy rather than a PITA.

http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=822.0

or Stews smaller version

http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=1077.0


John

I remember reading those threads, I think I'm going to make one, a little one. (perhaps a slightly smaller version of the smaller version)

Was the motor OK to rewire - is it obvious?

The re-wireing is unbelievably easy. When you open up the lid of the little box on the left of the mill you will see that the wires from the motor are colour coded brown for +,blue for - and green for earth. Just keep the earths linked as before and wire the brown to blue. All the wires are connected with spade terminals so it is really easy to re-wire.

Just a note of warning. The motors on the X2's are DC and that is why it is both very easy to reverse the direction, and also safe to reverse the wiring. DO NOT TRY THIS ON OTHER PIECES OF EQUIPMENT UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING ( sorry to shout, but electricity can kill you very quickly ) if in any doubt get someone who is qualified to do it for you.


Remember what Mick the electrician says, Green to Brown, Brown to Blue, Blew to bits.  :zap:

Edit: I've since realised that there is no need to reverse the motor's direction with this belt drive conversion so disregard the above details


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Bernd on June 26, 2009, 08:58:09 AM
Tim,

Nice job there.  :thumbup:

This is the first I've heard of the motor needing to be reversed from all the others that have done this mod. Don't recall if any mentioned needing to reverse the motor. It makes sense though since your going from gears to belts.

Bernd
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 26, 2009, 09:12:13 AM
Tim,

Nice job there.  :thumbup:

This is the first I've heard of the motor needing to be reversed from all the others that have done this mod. Don't recall if any mentioned needing to reverse the motor. It makes sense though since your going from gears to belts.

Bernd

 :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:

You know, it's only when you try things out you find out how just thinking things out in your head can catch you out. I just went out and turned on the mill and, you guessed it, it was turning backwards. I was sure that I needed the motor to run in reverse to make up for the change from gears to a belt, but there you go.

I'm really glad you posted that Bernd, I'll go and edit my previous post to correct my mistake.

So, to sum up, you dont need to reverse the motor's direction when making this belt drive conversion.


(a rather redder faced) Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Bernd on June 26, 2009, 09:15:26 AM
Red Faced Tim,

So your saying you don't have to reverse the motor?  :scratch:

Now you got me confused. (doesn't take much  :lol: )

Bernd
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 26, 2009, 09:27:41 AM
Red Faced Tim,
So your saying you don't have to reverse the motor?  :scratch:

That is correct. I reversed my motor and now have a mill that spins backwards. ( I just ran out and checked after reading your post about not having heard of others having to reverse their motors)

My 1st job later on this afternoon will be to restore the wiring to the original state.

So just to repeat, there is no need to reverse the motor with this belt drive conversion.

I'm not sure where I had got the idea that it needed to be reversed, probably the ramblings of a deranged fool ( me )


Tim
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: Bernd on June 26, 2009, 09:43:45 AM
Tim,

Here's an idea you might want to try. Since your going to have to open that box again and change the wires back, have you thought of maybe installing a reversing switch? It sure would come in handy when tapping.

Just a thought.  :med:

Bernd
Title: Re: X2 belt drive conversion
Post by: spuddevans on June 26, 2009, 10:22:04 AM
Tim,

Here's an idea you might want to try. Since your going to have to open that box again and change the wires back, have you thought of maybe installing a reversing switch? It sure would come in handy when tapping.

Just a thought.  :med:

Bernd

That's a good thought  :thumbup: I may not get doing that today, but I think that'll be going on the growing list of things to do  :proj:


Tim